Showing 1 of 187 conversations about:
kuhnsrc
90
Jun 6, 2017
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If you think that this drop is silly, this guy explains the concept of these cables pretty well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7ERMu825m4
Jun 6, 2017
scoooty
44
Jun 7, 2017
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He explained nothing, the video is 9:57 of nonsensical ramblings
Jun 7, 2017
kuhnsrc
90
Jun 7, 2017
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Ironically so are all of your comments ;)
Jun 7, 2017
scoooty
44
Jun 7, 2017
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Shoot the messenger when you don't like the message, eh.
Jun 7, 2017
kuhnsrc
90
Jun 7, 2017
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I loved the message, it gave me a great insight into why people like you spend so much money on silly things like this. If you couldn't garner anything from that video, then I don't really care what the 'message' is, but rather how it reflects on you, and how your mind thinks. (If it does at all ;P )
Jun 7, 2017
scoooty
44
Jun 7, 2017
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Your attitude just reeks of jealousy.
I will continue to enjoy my cables, while you post youtube videos of a lonely guy from 'straya having a whinge.
Jun 7, 2017
heysplangy
163
Jun 7, 2017
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A lot of what he said is true, there is a huge confirmation bias in high end audio. That being said, the strangest things can make genuine differences in an audio system. I became very aware of this many years ago after experimenting with different wires for a set of Sennheiser HD650 headphones that I was running through a tube amp I built. I skeptically bought some pricy cables thinking they were going to bring me nirvana compared to the 10' stock cables, but NO. The tonal balance was off, they were somewhat harsh and the soundstage was not as clear. Undeterred, I built a set from some Belden star quad mic cable and BOOM that was it. I could not really believe how much everything jelled. Dave makes some rational arguments, but it's clear that he really has never done any real listening. When I hear someone try to back up their point with something like "...anyone who knows anything about science or electronics etc.", I just have to laugh. I know a lot about science and have have forgotten more about electronics...blah blah. Wires do sound differently, some sound better than others. Are cables worth hundreds of dollars? I'll never know, I'm more of a headphone guy, but I'm sure you can spend a lot of money making yourself crazy trying to figure it out. Scoff if you like, but I also made a power cable that sounds better than a stock IEC, $10 and 30 minutes well spent; it freaking works. Don't get me started on the different capacitors I've put in that headphone amp...oof.
Jun 7, 2017
audible
431
Jun 7, 2017
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hah. headphones showed me too.
Jun 7, 2017
Jamorro
12
Jun 8, 2017
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lol you wat.... The only way you can differentiate between cables if you do a blind test. You cannot say that one sounds better if you know what the cable is and yes the placebo effect works even if you know that its a placebo, You said so yourself "there is a huge confirmation bias. If you can pick out your cables from 3-4 other cables ill believe you. However never seen that happen...
Jun 8, 2017
heysplangy
163
Jun 8, 2017
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Absolutely, you wat. The blind test is the way to go, I am a firm believer. You are suggesting that I am biased for the cable I built I suppose...but against the cable I spent too much money on...ok, I guess there is some logic in there somewhere. Anyway, I have done blind tests on a handful of cables and have a pretty good record of not getting duped. Not sure if I could do it with a speaker system, but I know my setup very well indeed. I can always pick the "fancy" cable out; when I say it's bright and forward and 'fatiguing', I mean it's not a subtle thing. I was recently given a 4' version of the stock cable and can not tell it from the one I made from star quad. Your scepticism is noted, but brushed away with a bemused and knowing grin. Cheers.
Jun 8, 2017
audible
431
Jun 8, 2017
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There is no logic in jamorro's assessment. There is attempted logic. We know what he is saying, but it's poorly thought out and slanted with bias.
Jun 8, 2017
chris3833
0
Jun 9, 2017
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Small bits from this are correct. But there is a difference in cables, and I know first hand. No I don't have examples which I guess defeats my argument right there. But oh well. My background is as a musician/audio engineer/recording engineer/record producer. Steaming from metal like Spite, Ministry, Disturbed, Kings X, to Reba McEntire. You can actually see the difference in the incoming, recorded wav signals via switching to different cables. Some are not as pronounced as others, and some are more pronounced than others. I agree that Monster is a overpriced and claims are crazy. They are a middle of the road cable. That's all. Are they as good as Mogami? No. But how far are they from Mogami? Not very far when your looking at 1 track. But when you take 96 tracks and compound it, that little 1/64th of sound can come out much larger in the long run. Making it sound noticeably different without zooming in on the wav files 100x.
Cables are like diamonds. If your copper has deposit's in the actual copper(which happens quit frequently)it will take off more of the high end. Let's say a 3'cable with high deposits sounds like a 20'regular cable. It will have a noticeably less defined sound. Now your ears are like muscles. If your used to listening to shitty audio you won't be able to tell the difference. But if your listing to great recordings, with a great DAC, great monitors, and great source files, then you will definitely be able to hear the difference! But many cable companies including Monster do highway robbery. This makes you think that all good cables are bullshit. Just like the DEA saying we don't need pain pills. Well just because a small bunch of people are getting doped up doesn't mean that when I get my are cut off in a car accident I don't need pain meds. Or let's say back in 1984 when the fascist Tipper Gore took rock music to court saying it was killing our kids...just because 1 kid killed himself while listening to Ozzie... Seems like your reading into things too much. Reminds me of sheep. Letting the herder heard you! But really cable's are there for 1 purpose. To carry an electrical signal from one end to the other without losing degradation. Well by the laws of physics, no matter what degradation will happen! It's just how much and to what extent that it does. Been involved with this argument before and in the end even with proof the starter of the argument refused to believe because they blinded themselves with their own bullshit. Won't be the first time, nor the last! Well how about this question-What is the most conductive metal?
Jun 9, 2017
kuhnsrc
90
Jun 9, 2017
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I admire your dedication. I'm going to ignore the sheep part, and however you interpret that is okay with me. It's pretty obvious that silver is the most conductive metal, with copper coming in at a close second, which is why cable manufacturers won't usually go the extra mile to use silver instead of copper because there is almost not return on their investment. I do have some 10 awg cable (not speaker cable) that is made up of dozens of copper wires plated in silver because of it's resistance to oxidation, and in some of the extreme environments that it's used in, that actually matters, and it is also sheathed in PTFE, making it one of the most versatile and well built spools of wire I own, but I would never waste such an expensive piece of metal on something like speaker wires, where it makes no difference. I'll go on amazon and buy generic speaker cable, and get two conductors bundled together with enough copper to handle more than the power my system can draw. Back on track though, if someone wanted to show me, with a high fidelity microphone, the actual difference in wave characteristics, like do some Fourier analysis on the signal received by the microphone, with the cable type being the only system variable that was changed, if you could show me that it makes a difference, I would happily believe you. The problem is that no one has done this. And yeah, the argument will come up that "Oh your ears are more sensitive than the microphone because the bitrate on the microphone is finite" well so is your DAC, and that doesn't seem to be stopping you from believing that cables make a difference. You can spend a million dollars on the best DAC in the universe, and the bitrate will be fixed, and anything you play on it will have that bitrate, or it will be upsampled. Things that supposedly happen on the atomic level will happen soooo much faster than whatever bitrate you are using, that it will never be the limiting reagent. If, by some miracle, you could have your audio sampled and played back at some trillion samples/sec, then I would believe that it would make a tangible difference, however the resolution of the human ear is impossibly far from that limit, so it wouldn't even come close to mattering. I have designed and built speakers from the ground up, and that says nothing about my skills as an audio engineer. They were mediocre at best, muddy and bassy, without enough representation in the highs, and I knew they were bad, and I knew I would never be as good at this as JBL or Yamaha, but I had a lot of fun. In my various experiments with these things, I discovered something. I was using this monster speaker cable that I got at a yard sale for like $3, it was about 100' long and 12 gauge. Good shit, but it was old. I didn't have a lot of money or knowledge, so I used that to drive one half of my speaker system, the other half I used some generic car wire, 18 gauge I think. I plugged in the system, and started listening, and one half of it sounded awful. Like it was just crummy, and honestly it sounded like it was clipping. I check, and sure enough, one of the connections I had made with the monster cable was shorting out, the little treads of copper at the terminal had managed to touch in all the shuffling around. I fixed the problem, and then started playing music again, and there was literally no difference. It sounded amazing on both sides and I was happy as could be. The gauge was something I was worried about, so I cranked it right up and both sides sung like the Sistine chapel on Sunday. I have no reason to believe that wire quality makes a difference, gauge might, but I seriously doubt it if you are below the current threshold. I really, really want someone to prove me wrong, like actually prove me wrong with recorded audio. I would love to know what is actually happening, but I can't just take some guy's word on the internet because his feelings told him something that couldn't be proven true. It's like religion, I'm an agnostic atheist, I don't believe that there is a god, but if someone were to show me that I'm wrong, with good, hard evidence, then I'd be happy to believe them. Until then, I'm gonna stick to the laws of the universe, governed by things out of my control.
Edit: Spelling
Jun 9, 2017
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