DarkVoice 336SE OTL Headphone Amp Reviews | Drop

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DarkVoice 336SE OTL Headphone Amp

Audiophile

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DarkVoice 336SE OTL Headphone Amp

Yossie4

Jul 18, 2019

Verified Buyer

Great headphone amplifier

can handle every can available. Needs Lon time breaking (at least 100 hour). Can be upgrade (highly recommend by replacing the stock tubes). Needs a decent and quality cans in order to enjoy the quality.

Recommends this product? Yes

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tsharp

Jul 18, 2019

Yossie4In-depth measurements show that this thing is hot junk. It is easily outperformed by $100 budget amps https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-darkvoice-336se-headphone-amp.6549/

LGCi

246

Jul 18, 2019

tsharpFrom your reference: "...high impedance headphones such as my Sennheiser HD-650. Boy, did the tables turn. I could easily outrun the the THX AAA 789 (in its single-ended mode). Because of this you could operate the 336SE at lower volumes and hence much reduced distortion", "...I can confirm the appeal of using the 336SE with high impedance headphones of 300 ohm and higher."

tsharp

Jul 18, 2019

LGCi"The lesson here is that what you hear will be highly load, volume and content dependent. It will also depend on your hearing acuity as to whether you can hear small distortions and true resolution." So yes, there are certainly headphones that will do this thing justice, but a simple solid state amp like the Atom, will outperform this thing in almost every respect and for 1/3 the price. Heck, my iphone headphone output measures better than this thing by a long shot. I'm just trying to save people some money.

(Edited)

LGCi

246

Jul 18, 2019

tsharpOf the 2.5k units sold at mDrop, the rating is 4.4/5 for me, that’s enough data points to say that (if you’re interested in or like the tube platform) the 336se is a very worthy start, into tube rolling. Admittedly, I haven’t turned my Darkvoice on in about month. Because I’ve been testing out the Monolith THX 788. But there will come a time when I’ll want to listen to some Smokey jazz on my 6XXs and that’s where (for me) the 336se beats all.

(Edited)

tsharp

Jul 19, 2019

LGCiAirpods also have generally good reviews. To me it just demonstrates that in the audio world, aesthetics trump performance. Reminds me of the quote ; "Audiophiles don't use their equipment to listen to your music. Audiophiles use your music to listen to their equipment." - Alan Parsons Coming from the recording/mixing side of the aisle, I generally prefer to hear it as close to how it was intended as possible. If I want to change the sound, I can EQ. There are some really great open source projects like AutoEQ on github, that have made custom profiles for tons of different headphones that are intended to make them match the Harman target curve. I usually start there and tweak it to preference with A/B comparisons. Definitely worth checking out if you haven't already. Playing around with that can have a far more positive influence on the sound than "tube rolling" or headphone mods could ever accomplish. But people like their arts and crafts time. Don't get me wrong, I think tubes are cool as frigg and I love modding electronics, but there are some things that just don't make sense. If anything, I think that spreading the word about how poorly designed amps like this are, should be a good thing because it should put pressure on manufactures to up their R&D. I know that tubes are inherently more noisy than silicon, but this could be greatly improved either way. The thing is that people will convince themselves that anything expensive is good because they obviously have to justify their decision. Places like Head-Fi are chock full of this type of thinking. Sorry for the rant, lol. Cheers

(Edited)

mjtreycoop63

Jul 20, 2019

tsharpAlan Parsons Pro-Ject?👍🏾

Schizoid

Jul 20, 2019

tsharpWhile I do like my Darkvoice, you do have a point. Aside from the "Tubes are more noisy than Silicon", since to be honest, most people buy tubes for the sound and maybe for the looks too, but not really to match a graph, The Darkvoice itself has issues that even it's contemporaries (Bottlehead Crack For Example) don't suffer from, specifically the fact that North America gets a Transformer with a 110 Primary Voltage rather than a 120, possibly since it's cheaper to just order three transformers and make North America use 110 instead of ordering 4 transformers but making one specifically for North American voltages, since a 10 volt difference from 110 to 120 won't damage the amp or the tubes in most cases. The design itself is pretty solid for a tube amp (I mean look at the WA6 "Non-SE" for example, different tube setup, tube rectifier, and uses output transformers, but the fundamentals in design and how some components are set up are really similar), just that there are certain quality control issues and component choices that should be looked at in general. I mean the Darkvoice is cool and all stock, but most people have Hum if they try changing in a new tube, and while there are solutions like the 72-Hour Burn in or the "Hum Fitz' mod, those things shouldn't have to be done to an amp like this, especially since the "Hum-Fitz" mod is literally placing two bypass caps on the Pre-Amp cathode and calling it a day. which the caps are basically cents in cost, since they don't have to be "Audiophile Grade" at this price, but adding them in would usually be a benefit in most cases (https://www.mouser.com/Passive-Components/Capacitors/Aluminum-Electrolytic-Capacitors/Aluminum-Electrolytic-Capacitors-Radial-Leaded/_/N-75hqw?P=1z0wrjqZ1yzxn8lZ1z0yp7rZ1yx4awyZ1z0vhz5). I love my Darkvoice tho, wouldn't trade it for anything, and the tube types it uses are top-notch, even if it does come with chinese tubes stock. From my experience, after modding the amp like crazy, if the company making the Darkvoice would just go out of their way to make a 120 Primary for North America and add the bypass caps to the preamp, the amp's stability would be so much better than it is now, and the bypass would help the amp in general. The Amp is dead quiet, even with the chinese tubes, any set of tubes I throw at it won't hum, buzz, or have any weird sound, or any noise really, until signal is fed. TL;DR, Tubes are something that most people use since they enjoy the sound, not to measure up on a graph, but the amp itself does suffer from issues that can be solved by just by making small tweaks to it's design, mostly for the tube's stability really. EQs are a great option tho, either to make the sound as close as possible to the Harman Target Curve, or maybe get a more personalized sound, since NGL, tubes can be expensive in some cases, where if you don't mind using an EQ, that's a really great alternative to tweaking sound the way you want.

eddiezr

106

Sep 30, 2019

SchizoidSo, if I may be so presumptuous, I take it you are saying the DV 336se is, in fact, a worthwhile consideration for a tube noobee such as myself? To my naive, virgin ears it just might prove to be a sufficiently adequate entre into the sonically wondrous and savings-draining world of hi fidelity valve amplification, n'est pas?

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Schizoid

Oct 6, 2019

eddiezrIf you like tubes it's a decent consideration, the cost of the amp here can help with buying better tubes for it afterwards, since it usually costs ~300, so you get a 100 buck discount. Honestly, there are better options with similar builds (like the Crack for instance) but if you don't know how to solder or don't want to, that'll be an issue for quite a few of them, especially if they get cheaper (Since Cheaper Tube Amps tend to need alot more work to make them function adequately, then again things get cheaper as tech advances so this point may be moot in time). Little Dot MK III is pretty good, just has an interference issue from personal experience, as long as you don't put it near things that can transmit signals you'd be good. A lot of pure tube amps at this price tend to have issues, Crack being an exception since it costs more than the Darkvoice and you build it yourself, meaning you'll probably care more into making it work as well as possible given the design (+ Easier to Upgrade since you know how it works). Also yeah, Tubes are expensive for this amp, especially NOS variants but it does improve the sound quite a bit, but there are workarounds like buying a 6SN7 to Dual 6J5, since those cost quite less and are electrically equivalent to even the best 6SN7s. Honestly it's a worthwhile investment if it's your first time listening to tubes, and have headphones that work well with tubes, like high impedance cans or anything based on the HD600, afterwards though, there are better offerings, it's just that price goes up quite a bit when you start getting better performing amps, and not so much in the sonic sense, more like the amp take away the negatives of the tubes they use and leave the sonic positives (Subjective though, don't think tubes are the end all be all of audio, it's just a preference, albeit an expensive one). Idk, if you have the money and want to buy a tube amp, this one works well with a few quirks due to it's price/build which can be easily rectified with a bit of tweaking (Although not necessary if you do the 72 Hour Pre-Amp Burn-In for example). If you have a bit more money and want to build one yourself, buy a Crack or something else else on the Bottlehead site (I recommend the Crack though as a beginner build though). If you have a bit more money but don't want to build it yourself, the La Figaro is a better amp performance and stability wise but maybe not sound preference wise. TL; DR: I'm kinda just writing to write because tbh because my honest answer now after a bit more time has passed is, "idk". People say that good tubes amps sound like SS amps, others say Tubes heavily change or "Color" the sound, others don't like the distortion and noise, others prefer it balanced, some want expensive components in theirs and others just want one that works. It's all up to you, if you've never heard a tube amp before, this amp might be what you'd consider a working example of one, but it isn't the "Best Introduction" since most amps at this price have their quirks, good and bad. I like my Darkvoice and La Figaro and especially now since I've modded (and still tweaking) and found the tubes I like for them since I can hear a difference in sound by doing so, but maybe you'll notice those differences less and that's fine, means you'll have to spend less money and time to be happy with your setup, you might not like Tubes after trying it and go to SS and it's a similar situation there where maybe all SS to you sound the same. If you buy it, and you haven't auditioned one, then I hope you'll enjoy it since it cost quite a bit of money, if you don't it's an experience that you've learned something from, or maybe have a point of comparison for future tube amps. Sound is pretty subjective once people hear it, even if the science says something else, and that's OK as long as you're enjoying it and understand that people have different views as to what they enjoy, especially in something as harmless and relatively good natured of a hobby as audio. I mean there are people who like the HD600 over the HD800S since even if one costs more and is hailed as an End-Game set of cans, it doesn't mean it'll be the same for you. Super TL; DR: Know what you like and like what you know.

(Edited)

eddiezr

106

Oct 6, 2019

SchizoidThanks so much for the prompt and brief response : ) I have Fender tube guitar amps which sound so much richer, natural and musical to most SS amps, IMHO, so I'm sort of aware of what a tube amp can do for my headphone experience. It's more a question about this particular unit: is it just good enough for a noobee, or will I grow impatient with it too soon? What is the better intro tube amp that you can confidently recommend? I'm using the Masdrop/Sennheisser HD58x headphones which can certainly tolerate a warmer amp. By the way, the 58x sounds almost identical to the 660s, to me, but with more extended sub-base and a little more top end shimmer. It's rumored to be a tweaked 660s?... Thanks again

Schizoid

Oct 7, 2019

eddiezrWhile the Darkvoice does have it's issues, most of them tend to just be due to the hum the preamp tube gets due to the transformer it uses (110V Primary instead of 120V Primary, giving the Pre-Amp Heaters extra voltage, making them hum but can usually be fixed through the 72-Hour Burn In). I'll recommend it over the Little Dot Mk III since that had a grounding issues (for me) as well as most reviews calling it more neutral than "Tubey". Besides the tubes you can get with the Darkvoice are some of the best out there (6SN7 Pre, 6AS7 Power). The Sound is affected quite a bit with aftermarket tubes too so you can customize the sound quite a bit IMO. Besides if you grow impatient/bored with it too soon (Although unlikely, IMHO), you can always mod the output coupling caps and give it a new (And Usually Better) sound as well as change output capacitance which will affect frequency response quite a bit. I'm recommending this to you since you're telling me you're a new to Tube Headphone Amps, and I truly do believe it'll have the sound (Stock or maybe with Tube Rolling) you're looking for, and the downsides can me fixed by a 72-Hour Burn in (If Modding is out of the Question). Once you get some time with this amp (Maybe a Year or so?) you might want to look into modding it a bit (this can be done sooner if you want, something easy to start off with like the Hum-Fitz Mod or Out Put Cap Upgrade) or side-grade/upgrade to a different amp to get a different perspective on the "Tube Sound" (Crack, Little Dot III/IV, La Figaro, Tor Audio, Liquid Platinum, Crackatwoa/S.E.X III, Xduoo etc.). Also yeah 58X are pretty dang close to the 660s, you could almost call it a Side-grade to it, since they are really dang close (and could probably be made closer/identical with some tinkering). Hope the Darkvoice suits you well in your Tube Amp Journey, if you buy it that is, and hopefully it lasts you quite a while if you do.

tim_herremans

Jul 8, 2020

SchizoidHey Schizoid, I’m looking to do all of the (top) upgrades on the Darkvoice 336SE and was wondering if I could get your help locating the caps and parts on Mouser. It will no doubt save many of us on shipping costs due to multiple orders. An updated comprehensive list of preferred upgrades and then optional.

Recommended upgrades: (1) Disconnect line-out by removal of ground wire or cap connection. It’s your choice. (2) LED bias cathode, remove the 1k resistors on the 6SN7 circuit, at the socket. Replace with similar ones used on the crack. Link: ? (3) Transformer swap: Hengniu HDB-110 (120v 60Hz) Link: https://www.hdoofactory.com/info/hengniu-toroidal-transformer-manufacturers-i00001i1.html
Order email: sales@chongzhouhengda.com (4) Volume pot swap: DACT 10k ohm (100k ohm does not fit) Link: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Audio-Grade-21-steps-DACT-Type-Stepped-Attenuator-volume-10K-OHM-/271219945117?_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49293 (5) Output cap swap, Link: ?

Optional upgrades: (1) Resistor upgrade, replace 1k and 30k with CCS. Link: http://www.kandkaudio.com/ but not sure which to buy. (2) Headphone jack swap Link: ? (3) Wiring swap with 14 or 16AWG copper UP-OCC Link: should be an easy find.

(Edited)

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Gizmo1k

Sep 23, 2020

Schizoid I've been trying to order the custom transformer for the DarkVoice and can't get the vendor you used to respond. I'm curious if you have any recommendations to get them to respond.

(Edited)

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