Showing 1 of 54 conversations about:
Grinnie_Jax
89
Jul 2, 2015
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Why buy Rolex fake for such price??
Jul 2, 2015
DavidTheWin
36
Jul 2, 2015
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There's a difference between fake and homage. This is styled almost identically to a rolex sub but there are no trademarks on the design and the Davosa doesn't use any Rolex branding.
Jul 2, 2015
Grinnie_Jax
89
Jul 2, 2015
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So, if simply change the logo - it is okay to steal all the rest? 99,99999% isn't 100%.
Jul 2, 2015
jwestarb
21
Jul 2, 2015
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you buy a rolex homage for that price because it's well-constructed without paying for rolex branding. the whole 'diver' category of watches is similar to vintage rolex submariners. but, there are good companies who make diver watches with quality components for cheaper, because they don't pay for billboards and sponsor events. you can buy a rolex for the branding, or you can buy a diver watch, which will look similar but with different accents or details that make it unique in its own.
Jul 2, 2015
ChristopherJ
1188
Jul 2, 2015
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Watch enthusiasts will always have butting opinions about homage watches. Some guys think that it's not okay to mimic an aesthetic, other's will argue that good watch design can and will inevitably influence the watch industry.
The Rolex Sub is a better watch than this one. Rolex manufacturers their movement's in-house, they use a special 904L steel, the fit and finish is overall better, and of course there's a deeper historical provenance that comes along with the Sub. For all that, you would be paying well into the 4 digit range.
The Ternos may have the Submariner style, but that doesn't automatically make it a bad watch. You can tell from the stats that this watch isn't looking to copy the Sub aesthetic and cut corners for everything else. All that said, i've personally handled both the Rolex SubC and this watch and I can say that you are definitely paying for a lot of "intangibles" when you purchase a Rolex.
@moophus
Jul 2, 2015
WillVautrain
138
Jul 3, 2015
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I said serious watch collectors. You won't catch James Dowling arguing fake v. homage in this context. He knows what a fake means, and this is not it.
The difference in the steel is practically meaningless. 904L steel is more useful than 316L in a narrow set of circumstances, ones in which the average human is not likely to encounter.
I'll grant the fit and finish of current Subs is likely to be better than this watch, but older Rolex aren't exactly known for their superior finish.
The cachet, of course. If you have $4k, and you really fancy a Rolex Sub, pick one up, you'll love it. If you have double or triple that, get a vintage one.
Jul 3, 2015
NewAce
51
Jul 3, 2015
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Do I like Sub homages? Depends on how much of a homage it is. I'm not terribly partial to homages like Davosa Ternos but MKII watches I welcome with open arms. For your note, there is a huge difference between homages and fakes. If Davosa copied the logo, case dimensions, caseback, Oyster bracelet, engraving on inner bezel, etc etc down to the exact detail (but obviously at a poorer build quality) then yes that's a fake. What Davosa is pulling off here is a homage, and there's a wide range of how much design you borrow from the original Sub - and the Ternos is one of those homages that borrow a bit more heavily than, for example, 3-6-9 MKII Nassau. But just because a Sub homage uses Mercedes hands and cyclops doesn't make it a knock-off. If you judge it on that basis then pretty much 80% of all dive watches out there could qualify given the huge influence Rolex has had.
Also - Rolex quality is legendary, but it's not to be worshipped as infallible. Case in point: the latest suspected QA cockup with cyclops magnification. So you have to ask yourself if you're going to pay close to $10K for that. At the end of the day, it's a freakin watch.
Jul 3, 2015
Tigole
463
Jul 5, 2015
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$4k ? My Rolex Sub Date was around $7500, and I got a great deal at that price.
I own 20+ watches, including a few Seikos, which I think are outstanding value for their price. But, I only have a few in the $xxxx price range; one of them being an Omega Speedmaster Chrono, which I'll compare the Rolex to. At first, I thought Rolex's were similar to Omegas, iconic looks, nicely finished, good quality, but very expensive for what they are. A few months ago, my wife had her eye on a Rolex, so we dropped by the Rolex store while we were on vacation. While we were there, the sales rep showed me a Sub Date and pointed out all the details, and I was thoroughly impressed. I was even more impressed when I operated the crown to set the date and time. There's a smoothness to it which none of my other watches had. Anyways, we left the store with a Rolex for each of us.
Fast forward a couple of months, I checked the time against an atomic time source, to which I set the watch when I first got it, and it was running 9 secs fast. +9 secs in 2 months! This is by far my most accurate and stable mechanical watch. My Omega runs +2s/day--pretty good, some would even say great. I own a timegrapher, so I can adjust any of my Seikos or anything with a Miyota movement, etc., to run within +1-3s/day too. But, I can't get them to run anywhere close to the Rolex's stability and accuracy.
The Omega and Rolex are around the same money, but the Rolex is a league above in fit, finish, and performance. Before I got my Omega, a friend that owns a jewelry store told me to buy a Rolex instead, and said that if I bought an Omega, I'd just be throwing money away. I had my eye set on the iconic Speedmaster look, so I didn't listen of course. In retrospect, he was right. I can see why Rolexs hold their value so well.
Jul 5, 2015
Tigole
463
Jul 5, 2015
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Just curious, but what is it about MKII watches that you like so much ? I have no experience with the brand.
Jul 5, 2015
WillVautrain
138
Jul 5, 2015
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Well, last time I was shopping for a Date Sub on the used market, they could be had for around $4k, but yeah, a new one is way more. You do realize that +9s in two months is atypical, don't you? It was a fluke, and it won't stay that accurate forever. I'm not knocking Rolex, I own a handful of them myself, I love them. No one is throwing money away on Omega, either. Perhaps they don't do quite as well on the secondary market as Rolex, but by and large an Omega purchased wisely on the secondary market can be liquidated quite easily, and without losing money.
Jul 5, 2015
Tigole
463
Jul 6, 2015
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If you buy used for anything, the resale value should be pretty good, since the bulk of the depreciation has already taken place. I was talking about resale value from new. Personally, I only buy new--especially if I'm spending thousands, I want it perfect from the factory.
And yes, I'm aware I lucked out and got a very good example. I checked my wife's Rolex today, and it was running about 4 mins fast after 3 months. That's +2.7s/day, which is still very good. The accuracy alone isn't what makes it really impressive though. Like I said, I can calibrate most of my other watches to be very accurate as well. However, their stability in different positions and over time isn't quite as good.
Jul 6, 2015
WillVautrain
138
Jul 6, 2015
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Rolex doesn't make a new watch I want to buy. It all started when they started making the spring bar holes blind. My Sub is a 5513 Maxi from 1982 or so. My wife wears a 1500 from 1969 with a graphite dial. FWIW, this Davosa is much more of an homage to the 16610 of the 1980's-2010 than it is of the current Subs.
Jul 6, 2015
Tigole
463
Jul 6, 2015
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You certainly know your Rolexes. The only difference I can see between the current 116610 and the 16610 are slightly wider lugs and crown guards. And in those areas, you're right, the Davosa Ternos is closer to the 16610.
Jul 6, 2015
NewAce
51
Jul 8, 2015
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MKII is a brand that I respect most out of all other niche, independent brands. I would caution you that I have never actually handled or seen one in person, but I would buy one at a heartbeat if I can get my hands on the new Key West GMT.
From what I repeatedly hear, it's simply one of the best quality Rolex homages out there. Good thing is they don't copy the popular designs. They specialize in making homages of rare vintages like Pan AM GMT. They also borrow from different designs to make them work really well, as shown by the popularity of their 3-6-9 Nassau that combimes vintage Sub look with Explorer I style dial.
They size their watches very well as well. 39mm-40mm case vs the usual 42mm that seems to be the norm these days with sports watches. All of this speaks to very good taste of the guy who runs that one-man company, Bill Yao.
Their distribution is also very limited, which leads to exclusivity and their watches often being sold for higher prices pre-owned vs. new. It's, to me, the Rolex of independent watch brands.
As much as I love my Steinhart OVM, I don't consider it a brand I can be proud of because of how they execute their Sub homage designs. MKII is something I would be almost as proud to put on my wrist as Omega, NOMOS and Rolex, and certainly more than Tag Heuer.
Jul 8, 2015
Tigole
463
Jul 9, 2015
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Thanks for the info. I took a look at their website and none of their models push any buttons for me--which is good for my wallet. I'll have to keep them in mind and check them out one day if given an opportunity.
Coincidentally, after taking a look at the 3-6-9 Nassau you mentioned, I saw this review for the Hager Commando show up in my youtube subscriptions:
I thought they were kind of similar in that they both have the sub look, date at the 4:30 position, and lack crown guards.
Jul 9, 2015
NewAce
51
Jul 16, 2015
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Huh, I've seen Hager before but I never seriously considered them until now. They look really decent. The issue is that Hager is 42mm and I have a Steinhart OVm that's also 42mm. It looks good, but I really like the 40mm case of MKII. The QA process for MKII is also known to be extremely thorough. I just love all the details of MKII watches.
Jul 16, 2015
Rustynuts
0
May 8, 2018
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I bought a Davosa to wear in places where I didn't want to risk the loss or damage to my Submariner. it is a very well-made watch, and I wear it proudly. I would never wear an outright fake Sub, but an homage surely only shares the design of the case and the dial with the real article. If Rolex are to believed, none of their in-house calibres are based on the ETA 2824-2 movement inside my My Davosa, then methinks that 99.999% of your argument is pure hogwash.
May 8, 2018
Grinnie_Jax
89
May 16, 2018
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So why do you need to wear Rolex fake to not put your Submariner to risk? Why not wear some honest Seiko Turtle or Certina or Hamilton Scuba or etc etc?
May 16, 2018
mhwolf
66
Oct 19, 2019
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There is nothing intangible about the much better resale value of the Rolex watches.
Oct 19, 2019
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