Drop + Audio-Technica Carbon VTA Turntable Discussions | Drop

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Drop + Audio-Technica Carbon VTA Turntable

Feb 7, 2020

I've got a Pro-ject debut carbon with ortofon 2m red- will this be an upgrade? If not, how can I make the most of what I have now? Still not fully satisfied with the sound from them :p

Feb 7, 2020

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Fayne

2584

Feb 7, 2020

phoenixsongI doubt this will be much if any of an upgrade for the Pro-ject Debut Carbon and an Ortofon Red. If you haven't already, I'd suggest looking at vacuum tube based RIAA stages like the Yaqin MS23B, as having a good phono-preamp can make a huge difference. Using a weight and different mat can also make a big difference in the background noise and bass response. I personally use all three of those items with my Denon VL12 Prime with Ortofon Red and they work great for me, but YMMV.

(Edited)

Feb 7, 2020

gonzoznog

Feb 9, 2020

phoenixsongI would suggest to upgrade to Ortofon 2M Blue. I love it with my Pro-Ject!

Feb 9, 2020

phoenixsong

1055

Feb 9, 2020

FayneNice suggestions! I do have a standalone phono preamp, makes the sound fuller and more "meaty". Used to have a nameless vacuum tube amp before it blew out, the texture and speed was delightful indeed :) Before I get another, I shall try out playing with different mats and weights

Feb 9, 2020

phoenixsong

1055

Feb 9, 2020

gonzoznogGlad to hear it! I was considering this a while back. If it reappears on Drop... ^^

Feb 9, 2020

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bigpancho28

Feb 9, 2020

phoenixsongThat TT should sound amazing. Doubtful this will beat it. Are you using a dedicated preamp?

Feb 9, 2020

livingspeedbump

6723

KeyChatter’s Owner and Editor-in-Chief

Feb 11, 2020

phoenixsongSo that's about right in the same ballpark as this guy, both have certain features better than the other but overall sound is very similar. Audio is a tricky thing to upgrade, because if you blow money on a single big upgrade (be it cart, speakers, phono pre, etc) the rest of your system has to be up to par to really reap the benefits. An audio system essentially always plays to the lowest common denominator within the setup. So it is definitely worth making a few small upgrades at the same time or spending a whole lot more up front. In your case you have a really decent turntable, so I think money spent on other upgrades would be a better route for you. What in particular are you not happy with?

Feb 11, 2020

phoenixsong

1055

Feb 11, 2020

bigpancho28I am using a standalone one by pro-ject, forgot the model name tho :p I'm glad to hear the turntable itself is wonderful!

Feb 11, 2020

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phoenixsong

1055

Feb 11, 2020

livingspeedbumpIt sounds analogue, but not smooth enough, even in the mids. Also, bass isn't very tight and treble sounds off. I'm using it with a pro-ject phonobox and JBL LSR30X speakers. Thinking it might be the cables (really makeshift ones) or the speakers atm :/ Used to have a nameless vacuum tube amp with Quad speakers, and that made the bass sound nice. Perhaps analogue audio with monitor speakers makes one lose the best of both worlds XD

Feb 11, 2020

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livingspeedbump

6723

KeyChatter’s Owner and Editor-in-Chief

Feb 12, 2020

phoenixsongSo a lot of these issues are probably related to speakers (especially smoothness in the mids). You can tighten the bass up a bit with an acrylic platter and/or a record clamp. Unsure what "sounds analogue" really is. I know analogue well (masters was in analog centered audio engineering) but analogue equipment is capable of sounding as different and unique as any digital system for the most part. Warmth is often equated with analogue, and its often the case, but even still there are many high end amps, turntables, etc, that try to be as transparent as possible without any additional warmth.

Feb 12, 2020

Fayne

2584

Feb 12, 2020

phoenixsongThe LSR series of speakers from JBL are really nice studio monitors. I absolutely love my 30x. That said, professional studio monitors are designed for and *really* good at showing off the imperfections in the source and content. It might seem counter-intuitive, but audio-engineers typically need their speakers to not flavor the sound. That ends up meaning that without a bit of EQ they can be a bit ... boring. :)

Feb 12, 2020

phoenixsong

1055

Feb 13, 2020

livingspeedbumpYep, by analogue I meant warm (tho it's not fuzzy). Pardon my language, for I'm inexperienced with vinyl and tubes :p I think a record clamp sounds like a solution, will try it out. Not sure how an acrylic platter would help, could you explain that please?

Feb 13, 2020

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phoenixsong

1055

Feb 13, 2020

FayneI think it may very well be the case here, though I sincerely wish it weren't XD Changing speakers at this point is out of the option for me due to reasons. The speakers sound decent directly paired with dacs though, like it's a match meant to be. With the turntable and phono box it sounds warm with fatter bass, but somewhat subdued. Bass isn't very deep and tight, and treble isn't extended or precise

Feb 13, 2020

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livingspeedbump

6723

KeyChatter’s Owner and Editor-in-Chief

Feb 13, 2020

phoenixsongA clamp + acrylic platter essentailly squeezes the record tightly against the platter which helps eliminate any small warps as well as unwanted vibrations due to the higher desnity and low stiffness. Furthermore it can help bring the bass more alive.

Feb 13, 2020

phoenixsong

1055

Feb 13, 2020

livingspeedbumpThink you're onto something, I remember seeing the tonearm moving due to apparently somewhat warped records. One step from getting a pro-ject acryl it with an audio technica disk stabilizer, hope to hear your opinion about it

Feb 13, 2020

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phoenixsong

1055

Feb 13, 2020

FayneFayne, which mat materials would you recommend and why?

Feb 13, 2020

Fayne

2584

Feb 13, 2020

phoenixsongI'm currently a fan of acrylic, especially with a heavy weight/clamp. I initially got the combo (which I linked) because a number of the older special edition LP I own are warped (clear/tinted stuff from the 70s did not hold up). It helped flatten them out enough so that playback didn't have any noticeable warping noises. After using it with a bunch of good vinyl, I found it did help tighten the bass response a bit while bolstering the mids a smidge. Both of which didn't make too much of an overall impact for my setup because the gear I'm running is fairly warm and vibrant for mid-fi (Denon VL12 Prime turntable, Teac AX-501 and Nobsound 6P1 amps, Yaqin MS-23B Phono preamp, Yaqin CD3 line buffer, and Pioneer FS52 and BS22 speakers with SP-8 subwoofer), and were only easily noticed when using the monitor out with my HD6xx and T1.2 cans. I did not (and still don't) like cloth mats. They have a bad habit of generating and holding static electricity. Plus they leave detritus on the bottom side of the LP. I did find that putting the cloth mat between the turntable platter and the acrylic mat helped isolate some of the vibrations generated by the floor-standing speakers and subwoofer, but that is more anecdotal than anything else. Edit: Also, a handy benefit of the acrylic platter is being able to easily and accurately set the anti-skate controls on turntables that have 'em. Without risk of damaging the stylus or vinyl, even. Start the table without any vinyl, place the stylus about 1/4 the way to the edge of the acrylic, and adjust the anti-skate control until the tonearm doesn't move in either direction. Too much or too little will have the tonearm either heading towards the center or outside of the platter.

(Edited)

Feb 13, 2020

JohnCarter17

Mar 5, 2020

phoenixsongYou might want to also consider a bronze upgrade. Blue you can swap to quickest, same cart as red. Bronze and Black come with a different cart.

Mar 5, 2020

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