Drop + HIFIMAN HE5XX Planar Magnetic Headphones Discussions | Drop

Drop + HIFIMAN HE5XX Planar Magnetic Headphones

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Oct 29, 2020

Hey Friends, Is the 5XX a reskin of the DEVA? No, the driver is a completely different design. The 5XX uses a dual sided magnetic structure, like the original HE-500. This is a diagram of the HE-5XX driver:

Note the position of the horizontal bars (magnets) relative to the empty oval pieces (diaphragm). The magnets are positioned on either side of the diaphragm, front and back, this is a dual sided magnet structure. Why does this matter? Because dual sided magnetic structures produce more precise diaphragm motion, which translates to otherwise unattainable detail through the mid range, high end, and upper octaves (“air”). Sub-bass also manifests in unique ways, HE-500 reviews cover this at length. Single sided structures allow for higher peak force, big mid-bass and the upper-midrange impact that some communities value. Thanks for your passionate interest in our product. We can’t wait to hear your reviews once we get these in your hands. FYI- the 500 units shipping on Nov 6th and subsequent 1000 at the end of November are the only units that will be shipping in 2020. Edit: simplified post to focus on 5XX

(Edited)

Oct 29, 2020

WillFunny thing is that the HiFiMAN CEO himself said Deva has magnets on BOTH SIDES (though asymmetrical) in a video interview on YouTube with Resolve from the Headphone Show YouTube channel. Go look at this starting at 17:01 and at about 17:15 where he says "magnets on both sides" and Resolve asks, "magnets on both sides for the Deva?" and Fang responds, "yeah".. https://youtu.be/rgUr9UHC6F0?t=1021. and at mark 17:29 he explains that it is an asymmetric design with smaller magnets on the inside, bigger on the outside, and then he repeats at 17:42 that "for this very project... we use magnets on both sides." So someone here is at best confused -- there were early prototypes seen of the Deva with a grill that looked like the Sundara in design but silver-colored, and perhaps Fang was confused and talking about an earlier prototype of the Deva (which later was adopted by this HE-5XX) that had magnets on both sides and then later they changed it to single-sided, perhaps, but in this interview, Fang unambiguously says the Deva HAS "magnets on both sides." If you want to know when the discussion turns specifically to the Deva in that interview, it's at mark 13:58 approximately and this continues into the discussion on it in which he mentions the "magnets on both sides" twice. In any case, I'm not mad about it, hell I have the Deva, and I joined the drop within minutes for this HE-5XX -- I just want everyone to understand that the confusion is warranted when the HiFiMAN CEO himself says there are double-sided magnets in the Deva.

(Edited)

iucoen

137

Oct 29, 2020

WillThanks for the clarification. I will put in my order again. Can you extend the free expedited shipping to today? I'm sure many of us will order now after your post.

LifelongCaboose

598

Oct 29, 2020

trellusEven in the Deva picture you can see 2 sets of magnets there just right next to each other rather than showing them separate.

Oct 29, 2020

LifelongCabooseIndeed, the drawing (and keep in mind that's all it is :) ) of the Deva, I definitely don't see what the HiFiMAN CEO himself says about there being "magnets on both sides", but the fact that the CEO either doesn't know what it's in his own headphones or else there was a change going from a prototype Deva with magnets on both sides to what we see now in the drawing, contributes to the confusion.

(Edited)

Audioholic924

Oct 30, 2020

LifelongCabooseIt seems that the wired Deva is no longer availble for sale at their online store. What does it mean?

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Oct 30, 2020

Audioholic924Well, to be clear, the wireless SKU that comes with the Bluetooth dongle can still be used wired and comes with a wire, so you still get a wired Deva even if they don’t sell a wired only SKU.

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calfredie01

Oct 30, 2020

Audioholic924They sell it on Amazon

Oct 30, 2020

trellusHey Trellus, thanks for your interest in the product can't wait to get it in your hands. I'm glad you're not mad, I am a little mad at this situation TBH. We explain this is a unique driver design, somebody posts "It looks the same as other thing so it is the same", and I'm back here explaining that you can't water crops with brawndo. Here are some performance determining factors that carry no visual indicator: What's the strength of the magnetic array and orientation of the field? If you have magnets on both sides, but it's tuned for 90/10 ratio of strength on one side, it's essentially a single sided structure, and it'll sound like a single sided structure. What about the strength of individual magnets in the array? If the outer magnets are stronger than the inner magnets, sound and performance will be different. What about the diaphragm tension and coating treatments? Higher and lower tension completely change the sound and distortion characteristics. Nano-meters of thickness in the diaphragm make a difference so surface laminates and treatments have a HUGE impact on sound for planar drivers. The 5XX's magnetic field makeup is unique, the magnet array design is unique, the diaphragm tension and coatings are unique. Anyway /rant, I'm excited to get these shipped and see the reviews.

(Edited)

iucoen

137

Oct 30, 2020

WillSo Deva has dual sided but asymmetric? On the 5xx they are symmetric?

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Oct 30, 2020

iucoenNapa...

Resolve

112

Oct 30, 2020

WillHi Will, thanks for posting this. As you've pointed out, it's totally possible that there are differences we don't see - and even in the interview with Fang Bian, he mentioned this as well. We in the digital media world focus on stuff like dual-sided vs single sided because that's easy to confirm visually, but there are numerous other parameters that matter for overall sound quality. Because of this, from my point of view, the door is open to this being a unique driver, especially considering I haven't heard the headphone. But with that said, I do think it might be a good idea to amend the original post about the Deva being single-sided, I think people are bound to be misled by this. What you've said is totally understandable because in the picture you posted it looks like that might be the case. But if you look closely, you can see the magnets are positioned together, and the diaphragm isn't pictured at all. Now, there is official confirmation from HiFiMAN that the Deva is double-sided, but you can even verify this by shining a light through the Deva (no need to take it apart) to reveal magnets on both sides. EDIT: the diaphragm isn't pictured between the magnets, but there are still two sets. In any case, I look forward to hearing the HE5XX at some point, because the HE500 was a fantastic headphone - and if there is a similarity as you've mentioned, then that's really only a good thing.

(Edited)

Oct 30, 2020

ResolveHey, yea it's confusing Look to the left of the rectangular bars on the DEVA diagram, the diaphragm is the empty oval you see a couple steps to the left. Empty oval = diaphragm Rectangular bars = magnets Fang makes lots of versions of products and does in-line revisions, so it's totally possible there are different configurations of DIVA out there /shrug So engineering diagram from HiFiMAN's engineering team, vs a quote from a fang on a youtube show, seems like a coin toss. I'd bias toward the engineering drawings, but at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter from my POV. We didn't design the DEVA, we designed the 5XX. I'll likely remove this whole post in a couple days, not adding much to the discussion either way and coin-toss odds it's confusing people to your point.

(Edited)

Resolve

112

Oct 30, 2020

WillThanks for that. To be clear, this isn't some sort of 'gotcha' on the HE5XX, the only reason I bring up the Deva driver is because I had originally made the same assumption about it based on the diagram, and so I stated that it was single sided in my review of it. HiFiMAN then reached out to me via email, saying they confirmed with the factory that it's double-sided and they asked me to amend that information in my review - which I did. Thankfully, we don't have to rely on either the diagram or the official word from HiFiMAN on it. Just to make sure there's no more doubt on the subject, I've taken the Deva driver out of the housing. Here you can see both sides of the driver (note the different screws on either side, so it's not just the same side twice).

So you can see the array is very similar on either side. Moreover, the magnet strength is similar as well - at the moment I don't have instruments to measure magnetic force to confirm 100%, so this is really just the eye test (and physically how it feels). But at the very least we can be confident that the Deva does in fact have magnets on both sides, and that they're of fairly similar size/shape.

Oct 30, 2020

ResolveYou are THE MAN... THANK YOU for the definitive answer on the Deva and magnets being on both sides and as you pointed out, it’s not about it being a “gotcha” on the 5XX, as there are other factors obviously and until you (or someone else with a Deva) gets a 5XX in hand, it’s speculation by others (not you) to pretend that dual-sided magnets on the Deva and other similarities to the 5XX prove they’re the same headphones with a different color and headband. I’m still stoked for my HE-5XX, none of this has tempered my enthusiasm. 😌

Resolve

112

Oct 30, 2020

trellusHaha yeah same, I'm definitely still hyped to hear it. Also, I really like the look of the HE5XX, so even if it's 'Deva-like', I'd still most likely prefer the HE5XX.

LifelongCaboose

598

Oct 30, 2020

Audioholic924The fact Hifiman stopped selling a wired version of the Deva right now is kinda sus. But I have placed an order for the HE5xx and im looking forward to checking it out and I still have a Deva in and I can take them both apart and compare the driver assembly, Along with listening to them side by side. Either way this whole situation is kinda unfortunate, and the confusion over it is just kind of a shame. I dont think Hifiman should stop selling the wired Deva just because the HE5xx exists, the same or different both can exist in the market at the same time. There are many reasons I could see people picking the He5xx over the Deva wired even if they end up being the same.

mbvjmc

188

Oct 31, 2020

LifelongCabooseReally? The Deva (wired version) is still available on Amazon (US) and it is currently "in stock" unless I'm mistaken and the batch on Amazon is the last run.

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LifelongCaboose

598

Oct 31, 2020

mbvjmcIts not listed on the Hifiman store now. If you went to the Deva page before you could pick wired only or with Bluemini. Not there is no wired only option. They could have been out of stock and removed the listing and its just a coincidence.

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Aznablerey

244

Oct 31, 2020

Will... but it’s what plants crave!

Audioholic924

Nov 5, 2020

LifelongCabooseI assume that it's just because you cannot remove the stock from Amazon immediately as you can't find it in their eBay store as well. Let's see whether it is their last batch at Amazon warehouse.

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Elnrik

Nov 5, 2020

WillWhat's the warranty on these Will? I've asked before and been ignored. People have a right to know.

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mbvjmc

188

Nov 5, 2020

ElnrikFrom the product detail's tab, it lists a 1-year manufacturer's (Hifiman) warranty. One could pay extra for a 3-year extended accidental warranty coverage that replaces the 1-year manufacturer's warranty: https://helpdesk.drop.com/hc/en-us/articles/360021664374-Drop-Extended-Warranty The helpdesk link should be updated to include the HE5XX though, as it is conspicuously missing there.

(Edited)

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