Showing 1 of 330 conversations about:
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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Hi there!Thanks to Cee Tee for his perseverance, he stuck with us for a long time to make this happen, and I'm really excited for us to be doing our first drop!
We tried to make the ETHER CX a unique product, and there is a lot in that's new. For example, it uses the original ETHER C driver but with a new tuning system delivering a unique and smooth voicing with gently lifted bass, and a really smooth transition from bass to mids. The new hardware is also a bit lighter and with no moving, as per our AEON design, and it sports a new ear pad. I hope it's a lot of fun for those who opt in the drop.
If anyone has any questions for me, please chime in.
EDIT: To make the information easier for people to see, I'm copying two of my posts contrasting ETHER CX to ETHER C and to AEON Closed. The format of the two posts is a bit different in style as I was sort of answering two different questions, for the editorially minded. :-)
ETHER C The original ETHER C had a tip toward the higher frequencies and also had some pad bounce that made bass a little unpredictable. With ETHER CX we have a new pad that reduces pad bounce for smoother and more impactful bass. By bringing the highs better into balance the whole headphone has warmer tone, without lacking air or shimmer, and the bass really pops on good source material (listening to Robag Wruhme's Wolluwe track as I write this and a lot of toe tapping going on).
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EC = Black ETHER CX = Orange
ÆON Tone: ETHER CX has a more neutral voicing with a bump to the bass, while AEON has a bit more of a V to the response and is less linear and smooth sounding. ETHER CX has a bit more heft at the lowest frequencies, it just feels like there's more power at the sub-bass even though they measure similarly. AEON Closed presents a bit more upper bass energy due to the V-shape to the response. ETHER CX has a smoother blend to the midrange which delivers better phase coherence, while AEON has a bit of a peak in the 5K region, something we worked to eliminate in the ETHER CX, and a brighter than neutral top. Dynamics are very similar. Soundstage they are close, ETHER CX seems a trifle larger. Efficiency: ETHER CX is 2-3dB more efficient. Comfort: The AEON is lighter and is a bit more comfortable for more extended listening. Isolation: ETHER CX offers several dB more isolation. The following chart is showing both headphones with no damping,orange is ECX and purple is AEON Closed, measured on a GRAS 45 CA with DF compensation. The main takeaway is the smoother response of the ETHER CX, with a less pronounced "V" to the response for better midrange-high coherence, yet with a fun bump to the bottom end. The smoother top end lets the mids and bass stand out nicely, too. I like to think of it as "audiophile fun" voicing.
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ECX = Orange ÆON Closed = Purple
Sep 25, 2018
jkster
12
Sep 25, 2018
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Dan, would these CX be upgradable to Flow? What is the key thing that separates these from Flow? Thanks
Sep 25, 2018
WongWay
65
Sep 25, 2018
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Not a big fan of pleather, thinking about pad rolling options already. Any comment on how the sound might change with either the Ether Flow angled ear pads or Ether flat ear pads?
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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The Flow upgrade essentially fills the spaces between magnets with a perforated material to create a better air load for the driver. In effect the driver "sees" a flat perforated surface as the load, which is much better than an array of bar magnets. Flow added top and bottom extension and a lot of detail to the original ETHERs.
We currently have Flow products on the market and we've removed Flow upgrades for this reason as most original ETHER owners who wanted to upgrade have done so in the last two years. The upgrade is quite complex and costly, so it wouldn't make sense for a CX.
Also, sonically I feel there's less benefit to adding Flow to the ETHER CX as the resolving power is bumped up with the new tuning and though it doesn't have Flow the CX falls between AEON C and C Flow in detail retrieval with great extension at the top and bottom.
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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I share your view of most pleather. In this case, the material we use is very high end, such that many pad makers don't even sock it due to cost of a bolt. It's good enough that twice I've had to correct pro-reviewers who thought AEON pads were leather.
But if they don't work for you, our angled pads work fine. and you'll get a little more energy from 5-6K range, with a little less output from 2-5-4K (this number is off the top of my head and I may revise it tomorrow), and arguably a tad more soundstage.
The Flat ETHER pads in leather have a different foam design and won't work as well on the CX as the stock pad.
Sep 25, 2018
jkster
12
Sep 25, 2018
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Thanks for the detailed response Dan! Much helpful.
Sep 25, 2018
WongWay
65
Sep 25, 2018
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@CEE_TEE Hopefully you guys are able to publish measurements of them soon!
Sep 25, 2018
raansire7
1160
Sep 25, 2018
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When I saw Tyll's video of your factory tour, I vowed to purchase headphones from you some day. Why? Because of your work ethic, dedication and attention to detail. I saw a passionate guy who could get my money and I would feel good about my purchase. We have liked what we've seen from you and appreciate you, Dan. God bless you, friend!
Sep 25, 2018
HawaiiR
68
Sep 25, 2018
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UGGGH! I'm broke but ... I'll have to find a way to make this happen. Any potential for an Aeon Closed in the foreseeable future?
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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Sorry, future product questions are the only thing I can't answer...
Sep 25, 2018
jaydunndiddit
3222
Sep 25, 2018
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Would you be able to shed light on the sound differences between this drop and the Aeon Flow Closed? While I thought the AFC was very detailed and analytical, I found them to be a bit lean for my taste. I've had many recommend the Ether series to me but I know this variant will differ from the old reviews out there.
Sep 25, 2018
TheRequiem
204
Sep 25, 2018
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Thanks for answering our questions. To clarify, what does lifted bass mean exactly? Does that mean the extensions has improved or the low end has less emphasis than prior? I found the original Esther C to be a little lgiht on Bass for my tastes... will these updates be better for the low end or mid range?
Sep 25, 2018
ludachris
314
Sep 25, 2018
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Hello Dan, in this drop are the headphone cables made by you? Are we able to order a mr speakers headphone case from you directly?
Can you post a graph for the ether CX compared to ether C and ether C flow?
I would let to see the differences before I join the drop. Thanks Dan.
Sep 25, 2018
4109174
3
Sep 25, 2018
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Hey Dan,
Is this a one-off or will it continue to be offered in the future after the initial drop?
Thanks.
Sep 25, 2018
joemou
5
Sep 25, 2018
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What is this headphones suitable for ?classical or vocal?
Sep 25, 2018
Moonwolf
63
Sep 25, 2018
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Hi Dan. Does Ether CX come with DUM cable or the standard stock cable? If I may ask one more question, would you think it's a good match to V281 on balanced out? Thanks for bring a wonderful product to MD and sorry for my wallet..
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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Sure. This is a really complex question and I'll try to give a full answer, but I'm also getting ready for RMAF and so can't put as much time as I'd like to, and not being a professional reviewer I'll probably not be so amazing in my nuanced comparisons. I've edited this to shorten it and make it more to the point.
Tone: ETHER CX has a more neutral voicing with a bump to the bass, while AEON has a bit more of a V to the response and is less linear and smooth sounding.
ETHER CX has a bit more heft at the lowest frequencies, it just feels like there's more power at the sub-bass even though they measure similarly. AEON Closed presents a bit more upper bass energy due to the V-shape to the response. ETHER CX has a smoother blend to the midrange which delivers better phase coherence, while AEON has a bit of a peak in the 5K region, something we worked to eliminate in the ETHER CX, and a brighter than neutral top.
Dynamics are very similar.
Soundstage they are close, ETHER CX seems a trifle larger.
Efficiency: ETHER CX is 2-3dB more efficient.
Comfort: The AEON is lighter and is a bit more comfortable for more extended listening.
Isolation: ETHER CX offers several dB more isolation.
The following chart is showing both headphones with no damping,orange is ECX and purple is AEON Closed, measured on a GRAS 45 CA with DF compensation. The main takeaway is the smoother response of the ETHER CX, with a less pronounced "V" to the response for better midrange-high coherence, yet with a fun bump to the bottom end. The smoother top end lets the mids and bass stand out nicely, too.
I like to think of it as "audiophile fun" voicing.
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Sep 25, 2018
jaydunndiddit
3222
Sep 25, 2018
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Truly, thanks for taking the time to make such a thorough response.
You had me at, "more heft at the lowest frequencies ." This variation sounds like it "fixes" the one sticking issue I had with the AEON Closed.
Time for an obligatory "take my money" meme:
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Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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The original ETHER C had a tip toward the higher frequencies and also had some pad bounce that made bass a little unpredictable. With ETHER CX we have a new pad that reduces pad bounce for smoother and more impactful bass. By bringing the highs better into balance the whole headphone has warmer tone, without lacking air or shimmer, and the bass really pops on good source material (listening to Robag Wruhme's Wolluwe track as I write this and a lot of toe tapping going on).
Black is the original ETHER, and you can see that it is tonally brighter than the ETHER CX, or the AEON Closed for that matter.
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Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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Posted the graph in my prior post. Yes, the cables are sourced from us, and the headphone is also compatible with our DUM cables for other lengths or terminations like a 2.5mm.
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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I think that depends on all of you and Massdrop. :-)
Sep 25, 2018
Bikr
2
Sep 25, 2018
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Will you have a pair of the ETHER CX's at RMAF?
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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I've always found answering genre-specific questions on voicing to be difficult to answer. In part, this is because I believe a well voiced headphone sounds good on anything and headphones that are genre specific, at least to my ear, tend to ultimately end up being fatiguing or too limited to just put on and use all day regardless of my mood or music.
ETHER CX is warm, smooth, dynamic and has extension at both ends of the spectrum so it's an easy and fun listen with pretty much anything from Tom Petty to Shpongle or Yo Yo Ma.
So, long answer to a short question is I really enjoy this with both vocal music and jazz, but also EDM and quality rock recordings. If the source material is heavily compressed I would suggest some damping pads to make it a bit less "in your face."
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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It comes with an XLR DUMMER cable with a pigtail that has a 1/4" and 3.5mm dual tip. I haven't heard the V281, sorry I can't answer that.
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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Yes.
Sep 25, 2018
HawaiiR
68
Sep 25, 2018
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No worries. Totally understandable!
Sep 25, 2018
Moonwolf
63
Sep 25, 2018
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Thanks. Any plan to provide an option to add 2.5mm balanced connector?
Sep 25, 2018
Moonwolf
63
Sep 25, 2018
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The frequency chart above looks beautiful to my eyes!!
Sep 25, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 25, 2018
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That's a better question for @CEE_TEE
Sep 25, 2018
rdodev
628
Sep 25, 2018
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Feeling the same way as I believe we have fairly similar tonality tests. That slight bump in the lows makes all the difference.
Sep 25, 2018
CEE_TEE
3475
Sep 25, 2018
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Hey Moonwolf, I believe we have had 4-pin XLR to 2.5mm TRRS adapters available in the past, I need to check with Matt T. to see if I can link to any previous drops...
Sep 25, 2018
jeffri
139
Sep 25, 2018
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Oh wow, this seems like something I might like. I always wanted a bit of bumb on the low end from the AFC. Ahhh, so tempting... :/
How about comparison to the original C and maybe also add C Flow? Thanks Dan!
Sep 25, 2018
CEE_TEE
3475
Sep 25, 2018
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Sep 25, 2018
jeffri
139
Sep 25, 2018
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Ah, thanks. I read that as ETHER and thought that was the open version. Turned out it was the C. :D
Sep 25, 2018
rdodev
628
Sep 26, 2018
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Hey Dan,
Thanks a bunch for all the information. You mention Aeon flows have a slight upper hand in terms of comfort for long sessions. I'm an all-day (8 hours) listening use case and was wondering what your thoughts were which of the two, if comfort is the deciding factor, would you recommend (of note: I have a rather large noggin and ears).
Sep 26, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 26, 2018
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Some people are particularly sensitive to weight, and of course AEON is lighter by a few ounces. The trade off is sonics, as the larger ETHER CX driver has some benefits as previously noted. For myself I have the luxury of both, and I can wear either all day. I have a friend who has an injured neck and for him ounces are make or break. Beyond that, both fit about the same head sizes, have a similar level of clamp. Very few "large head" customers have ever had an issue, so I think you can safely make your call based on your weight and sound perceptions. Right now I'm spending more time with the ETHER CX, it sounds fresh to me, and with what I do that is part of the fun...
Sep 26, 2018
rdodev
628
Sep 26, 2018
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Heh, if there's any non-monetary benefit to being the creator I think this is it :)
Thanks for your answer. It helps.
Sep 26, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 26, 2018
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I truly love my job. I waited longer than I should have to take this path, as it was what I always wanted to do, but happily I didn't wait TOO long.
Sep 26, 2018
Moonwolf
63
Sep 26, 2018
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I will be ordering CX in Oct once my statement closes. :) I hope three years later you can graciously drop Voce in MD. I will be saving for it!
Sep 26, 2018
Heefty
1375
Sep 26, 2018
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Hi Dan,
Can you post some isolation curves? The 2 points given in the specs don't cover the always troublesome 200Hz ish range where isolation often fails in closed cans. If not, maybe just answer the question of whether I can expect it to be different than the legacy Ether closed. I know I can find isolation plots for that.
Thanks
Sep 26, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 26, 2018
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We don't have a proper setup to measure isolation, though we plan to build one early next year. As noted we relied on Tyll's numbers at Innerfidelity. Because this is passive noise blocking vs active cancellation, it won't block rumble well, but it does start to block a bit below 200 with a pretty sharp attenuation above that, as you can see here... https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/MrSpeakersEtherC.pdf
For travelers IMHO noise blocking is more useful as it blocks announcements and crying babies, while ANC tends to eliminate rumble but not the stuff that actually disturbs me, like the babies.
Sep 26, 2018
Yosho
26
Sep 27, 2018
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Are you planning to develop / sell some mods for ECX? That would be great! Thanks in advance!
Sep 27, 2018
verifonix
1105
Sep 27, 2018
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Mods, like?
Sep 27, 2018
Heefty
1375
Sep 27, 2018
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The problem isn't so much low isolation as the small amplification (resonance in the ear cups I presume) that some closed cans manage to produce. I.E. the red circled portion of the innerfidelity plot for these where it's greater than 0dB:
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I'll take a reminder of where I came from at the hands of the baby I'm on a plane/train/bus with over amplified plane/train/bus noise any time.
Looks like I'll keep using IEMs for travel. I may need a set of these for the office at some point. I haven't gotten many complaints about my open back cans yet though so motivation is low.
Sep 27, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 27, 2018
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Yes, there is potential gain of noise in that region. The only way I know of the kill that is ANC or a more semi-closed design. I fly a lot and it doesn't bother me, but that's for sure a YMMV.
Sep 27, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Sep 27, 2018
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We don't "plan" mods per se, we always keep an eye out for new ideas or techniques we can retrofit. If we could do them for sure, we'd already have built them in. The best way to think of this is that we keep an eye open and if we can do something sensible we will.
Sep 27, 2018
Volly
328
Sep 29, 2018
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Dan, you reckon you have time to do a 'Mr. Speakers Classic' Maddog one day soon?! :D
Would be interesting to see what you could do with the MK3's.
Sep 29, 2018
ludachris
314
Oct 6, 2018
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Hello Dan, is it possible to throw in Mr speakers headphone case in this drop? I think that would be the cherry on top because I would like to bring this headphone around work instead of a bag. I highly suggest it Dan. Please let me know when you get the chance. Thank you.
Oct 6, 2018
jrkong
0
Oct 8, 2018
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Quick question about the Aeon Closed vs the ECX, how does the comparison change when you're using the foam inserts?
Oct 8, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Oct 8, 2018
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Sorry, the ETHER case is made in the US and there's just no way we could include it. It's $$. Our focus was to deliver the most performance into the headphone we could with some nice accessories and investing in flexible cable options as the top priority...
Oct 8, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Oct 8, 2018
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The foam inserts will soften the top for the AEON, and warm the tone. I generally use the white felt option. Vs the CX the CX will still have a "bigger" sound from tone and dynamics, but the soundstage is a little smaller.
Oct 8, 2018
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Oct 8, 2018
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Nope. It's far to difficult to deliver products with the level of consistency and precision driver matching when you can't control the whole production process.
Oct 8, 2018
ludachris
314
Oct 9, 2018
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No worries I'm looking forward to save up for your ether flow 2s one day. Keep jamming thanks for the response.
Oct 9, 2018
verifonix
1105
Oct 10, 2018
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Why are top end products so damn top end expensive lol. I feel your pain
Oct 10, 2018
raansire7
1160
Oct 10, 2018
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I think it hurts everyone, even people with the money to spend. If I have $10K in my account and I need to spend $1K, I still feel the pain of the expenditure. Anyway, I assume they're more expensive not only because they aren't mass produced, but because better materials and better equipment are needed to build them. Also, more man hours are needed to be spent when designing them and while/after building them. That's without including the cost and man hours of prototyping. It makes sense to me.
Oct 10, 2018
jaydunndiddit
3222
Oct 10, 2018
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You also forgot profit. It's reasonable to factor in that a manufacturer and/or distributor would need to be compensated accordingly (not even factoring in logistics, employees, etc).
Oct 10, 2018
raansire7
1160
Oct 10, 2018
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Yuppers. I didn't include profit because I thought that's a given. It's the first thing most people think, but they don't think of the time, cost and steps needed to translate the product from a mental state to a physical state, from concept to final product. But yeah, that too. Thanks for mentioning it! =P
Oct 10, 2018
Skylancer727
6
Apr 23, 2019
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Would you say the Æon is more detailed or the CX. I'm all about having the audio directly transmitted into my brain so whichever does that better is my go to. I've never had an issue with semblance so would love to know.
Apr 23, 2019
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Apr 24, 2019
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They're comparable in detail retrieval. AEON has a little more soundstage, but the CX is a bit more dynamic.
Apr 24, 2019
Rick_T
45
Apr 30, 2019
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Hi Dan, Thanks for the measurements.. Does the AFO also have the 5k peak?? Thaanks!
Apr 30, 2019
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Apr 30, 2019
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There's not really a 5K peak, that is a measurement artifact. The measurement is made using what is called diffuse field compensation, which creates the characteristic dip and peak shown in the plot. But if you run a sweep tone you'll hear only a minor peak in that area, nothing like the graph implies. This is one of the reasons I'm always a bit hesitant to post measurements; headphones just don't measure like speakers, and flat isn't flat.
Apr 30, 2019
Rick_T
45
Apr 30, 2019
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Thanks Dan.. I have the AFO’s. Just wondering ‘cause I don’t hear a peak circa 5kHz.. Maybe a slight peak a few octaves higher up but not that bothersome to my ears if there is... How would you compare the bass response of the CX to the AFO? Is it still more sure footed and more solid just like Vs. the AFC? Thanks again!
Apr 30, 2019
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
Apr 30, 2019
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Pretty much yes. The larger driver gives more dynamics to the bass, at higher SPL it becomes more obvious.
Apr 30, 2019
Rick_T
45
May 1, 2019
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Thank you for the thorough reply, Dan.. Much appreciated. I hope you also come up with a really effcient (around 98dB at least?) closed back semi-portable some day that retains the same even tonal balance and subtly nuanced playback, but with less demands on amping.
May 1, 2019
LuckyLuke575
552
May 23, 2019
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Hi Dan, I'm really interested in upgrading my closed cans, and the Ether CX seems like a great place to go next. I'm just wondering about the cable shown in the product picks; it looks like a balanced cable going to 4 pin XLR, and there is also an adapter shown. Does this mean that the cable shipped with the headphones is balanced, but can also be used with a single ended source using the adapter? I have equipment with both SE and Balanced outputs, so I'm wondering if the same cable can be used with both just buy using the 4 pin to 3.5 mm adapter?
May 23, 2019
MrSpeakers
252
Dan Clark, Designer/CEO
May 23, 2019
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Correct, it's a balanced cable with an adaptor for 1/4" and 3.5mm included.
May 23, 2019
LuckyLuke575
552
Jul 5, 2019
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I've been reading the comments, and I'm wondering what is the minimum amp output that's needed to make this headphone run at its full potential? E.g. 200 mW, 500mW, 1000 mW etc. The impedance is low, but people are saying that isn't indicative if the kind of amp one needs to have.
Jul 5, 2019
LuckyLuke575
552
Oct 13, 2019
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@MrSpeakers still waiting for an answer???????? Or maybe you've sold enough of these already so you stopped responding to customer requests????
Oct 13, 2019
jsmiller58
779
Oct 17, 2019
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You might want to go to their website and send mail to their contact email. They probably pay a lot more attention to their email than a forum.
Oct 17, 2019
LuckyLuke575
552
Oct 18, 2019
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Perhaps. But if this is how they respond to information requests on a product page, imagine how the customer support experience will be... They're not selling $3 toothpaste, so they need to explain their product.
(Edited)
Oct 18, 2019
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