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Drop + THX AAA™ 789 Linear Amplifier
Xannen
63
Apr 26, 2019
Anyone care to comment on whether I'd do well to replace a Lake people G109 with this amp (Using the RME ADI-2 as DAC)? I am finding that the ADI-2 has superior SQ on the headphone amp as well as soundstage than the G109, which although providing great slam, does muddy the waters and close up the stage quite a bit. Wondering how much better this amp would do in this regard :)
JJayJJ
472
Apr 26, 2019
XannenWhat do you mean "do well"? The RME on it's own is fine as-is to be perfectly honest. As far as sound quality goes, you could simply opt for a JDS Atom and basically have the only amp that is essentially as good as the 789 that we know of (since reviewers seemingly don't do many measurments in this review sector).
If you want to see the comparisons of objectively how each compares:
Lake People:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-lake-people-g109-s-amp.7227/
JDS Atom:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-new-jds-labs-atom-headphone-amp.5262/
THX 789:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-massdrop-thx-aaa-789-amp.5001/
This is all I can provide.. I don't understand what metrics you're looking for when you ask something like: "Wondering how much better this amp would do in this regard :)" Better what precisely?
Xannen
63
Apr 26, 2019
JJayJJThanks for providing this!
Sorry for the nebulous question - what I'm finding specifically now with my setup is that the G109 offers good warmth and slam and better overall bass than the ADI-2 provides (as well as more power and weight) but comes at a pretty severe cost to sound stage and dynamics. Seperation, soundstage and imaging are far better on the ADI-2 output, but the sound is more neutral and somewhat lifeless in comparison.
So realistically if there was an amp that paired well with the neutrality of the ADI-2 yet upped the overall tonality, and maintained the dynamics and soundstage, that would interest me very much.
Appreciate the provided links, I'll take some time to review impressions.
JJayJJ
472
Apr 26, 2019
XannenA few things,
Warmth + Slam and better overall bass than ADI 2: Remove the warmth, and slam word, and you basically can validly say it has better overall bass reproduction I suppose.
Soundstage and dynamics. I don't know what "dynamics" are, and soundstage isn't actually a thing that is amp dependent, an amp should only do just that, amplify the volume level. As for soundstage itself, this isn't actually a thing outside the subjective mind for the most part. Sure we can attempt to describe the feeling of immersion into the music (and is why using speakers is the most "soundstage" we can get). Soundstage is depends on the way sound interacts with the ear, and because we all have different ear cannals, the only sure-fired way to even remotely have an objective "soundstage" test is to use IEM's that remove the external ear shape from having an effect on the sound attempting to hit the ear drum. You ever wonder why the HD800 and such have "good soundstage"? They're big and spacious and openback and simply great headphones.
The reason the sound on the ADI 2 is "lifeless" is precisely why you said before.. it's neutral, and not "warm with slam with good bass". Keyword being.. Bass. You're fortunate enough to have a built-in Parametric EQ in the ADI 2, use it. Fiddle around with the bass. The kick will return, of that I have zero doubt. Unless of course you listen to headphones at deafening levels (near max volume), then power output could be a limit.. Otherwise, this punch you think a device is "inherently" lacking is all in your head. Or simply not volume matched to properly account for.
"So realistically if there was an amp that paired well with the neutrality of the ADI-2 yet upped the overall tonality, and maintained the dynamics and soundstage, that would interest me very much."
Even the THX co-creator of the AAA technology said in an interview, the point is to present the sound source as transparently as possible. Coloring the sound is not the job of the technology they want to build. And any other amp that wants to do the same, can start with being as transparent (meaning devoid of as much noise and distortion as possible). Amps should do nothing else, as those things like "warmth" and "bass" and "impact" can all be done with EQ and other DSP.
This is why your hunt shouldn't involve looking at reviews of people talking about "oh this amp adds this, or that". The only thing you should be hunting for in an amp is transparency. Take the original source, and then color it yourself if you prefer a certain sound signature. Don't buy nonsense like 95% of tube amps that distort and half people that say it "feels warm". This is why no single professional would ever master content using tube anymore.
With respect to that.. The Atom, and THX 789 are currently top of the line amplifiers with respect to transparency (which is what you should want.. use your ADI-2 features if you want to color your sound, don't desire that from an amp, it's simply illogical).
postwarscars
1367
Apr 27, 2019
XannenSo I'm just going to give you a counter-perspective here. JJayJJ is a believer, in the fanatical sense, that all which is written is concrete.
The answer to your question is as nebulous as the question itself, simply put: it's hard to say if what you're looking for comes from the THX.
While you are being talked down to about your term usage, understand this: JJ's full knowledge and experience on this matter is based on his reading of scientific measurement reviews and the statements held within. Which clearly don't help you since you're asking for subjective opinions.
The objective stance is the Lakepeople amp should be just about as good as the THX. Which begs the question of what might even change. But that said, that you sense a change between the two amps you own means that, indeed, measurements simply don't tell the whole story.
What I'm getting at is there's a world for objectivity and subjectivity in balance. I would recommend reading reviews and doing research and listening to the opinions of people with the equipment in hand.
But also, to JJayJJ's credit, don't buy into snake oil. The THX is a great amp, but by his own link's accounts, not far removed from the Lakepeople. So it might make no sense to purchase something so, objectively speaking, similar.
(Edited)
Xannen
63
Apr 27, 2019
postwarscarsThanks for the reply.. you are correct in that I'm just looking for suggestions and experiences with this or other amps in and around the same price bracket, but now looking back what I really should have done is pose my question having already done more research which would allow me to articulate my question better and more succinctly, so that is on me.
In any event, research is what I will do and appreciate all the feedback regardless if it gets me closer to an answer, so thank you both for taking the time!
postwarscars
1367
Apr 27, 2019
XannenRight. I don't own the THX, but I've heard it's a great combo with your DAC. It likely sounds closer to the ADI-2, just with more headroom. It's a pretty capable amp in that regard.
What headphones are you using?
Xannen
63
Apr 27, 2019
postwarscarsCurrently for headphones I have the ZMF Atticus, and IEMs the Final Audio E5000 and the IMR R1. The e5000 I will likely replace with something better, thinking of perhaps the Campfire Atlas or similar, but want to demo them first obviously.
Let me clarify that I think the ADI-2 sounds great and part of this is just me getting used to a more neutral sound, I just feel that it lacks excitement somehow. This is also on account of the music I listen to (EDM mostly). In my case, even just using different headphones could yield the kind of sound I'm looking for, so that's not lost on me. if the THX though is similar then I may be barking up the wrong tree.
postwarscars
1367
Apr 27, 2019
XannenI think perhaps you're right. You may have the right equipment, but not the right headphones. I'd say rather than trying to find an amp to fit your sound preferences, it may be the other way around.
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