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Snoopchicken
32
Aug 13, 2016
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I don't know if I'm allowed to triple post, but here are some images I took:
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Aug 13, 2016
Sounds
3
Aug 13, 2016
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SnoopchickenThanks for the update, snoop! They sound okay? Besides the LCD-2, what other cans do you have?
Aug 13, 2016
Sounds
3
Aug 13, 2016
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SnoopchickenAlso, what;s your source and what type of music do you listen to?
Aug 13, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 13, 2016
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SoundsI don't know how I feel about seeing his response towards them being okay. If I had LCD 2s, the only way I'd be able to purchase another headphone is with another planar that's open back or a dynamic like the HD800S
Aug 13, 2016
Ian15
25
Aug 13, 2016
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SnoopchickenDamn, I thought Fostex headphones were made in Japan not China.
Aug 13, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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SoundsHi guys, sorry for the long wait. They definitely don't sound bad; I just think the problem is that there is a significant difference between them and my Audeze LCD-2 headphones (in my opinion). The mids are definitely a little recessed in these headphones; of course, the mids on the Audeze LCD-2 are at a different level. Also, the bass, contrary to what I've read, is not overpowering at all; in fact, I feel that the Audeze LCD-2 has more impact (keep in mind I have a Rev 1 Audeze LCD-2). The highs aren't bad, but there's also nothing to write home about them either.
I was using a Schitt Magni/Modi stack; maybe not a good combo? I don't know. I tried them through my phone, as well as through my computer, and they sound relatively the same. I don't think these cans are very hard to drive.
I have an Audeze LCD-2, an HE-400, and a Bose QC-25. Obviously the Bose QC-25 doesn't even come close in sound quality; however, the HE-400 sounds similar (recessed mids especially) to the TH-X00 Purplehearts. The HE-400 is a little harsher in the highs though, but they also have a wider soundstage than the TH-X00 Purplehearts.
These also don't feel like closed cans; you can tell that the moment you put them on, as there is barely any isolation. The soundstage was a lot wider than I expected. I wouldn't say it's the best soundstage, but it's definitely a lot better than a legitimately closed can, like the Bose QC-25.
The headphones are really comfortable though! I was worried about the earpads, but my ears fit into the cups nicely. The top headband could have more cushioning though.
I don't know, maybe these headphones haven't burned-in yet? I've only listened to them for like an hour. I'm not one to believe in any burn-in effects with the actual drivers of the phones; however, there may be a burn-in effect with my brain! Also, maybe my amp/DAC combo isn't an ideal pair for these cans. At the end of the day, I'm no expert audiophile, so please take my opinion with a grain of salt.
I want to thank Massdrop for this collaboration; I think it's excellent that they can offer cans like these to us at relatively affordable prices. I also want to thank them for sending me a serial #2 model! However, if I had the choice, I would rather buy one of the (cheaper) planar magnetic options from Hifiman. There's something about planar magnetic headphones that I find lacking with dynamic headphones. Planars just feel quick, clear, impactful, and effortless. I guess the old adage may be true; once you go planar, you can never go back.
Aug 14, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 14, 2016
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SnoopchickenThat's just a bummer. I don't know what to believe anymore. Of course these weren't going to compare to planar bass, but still from all the graphs and reviews, the Purplehearts should have had the best bass for a closed back. Only trumped by the 900 and sz2000. I'm sure the Schiit stack would be enough, I just feel let down.
It makes it sound like the ebony are superior now because of their refinement and control.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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KTMDOh I hope I didn't ruin your hopes! Keep in mind that it really just is my opinion. There definitely is more bass quantity than the Audeze LCD-2 (although I could say the same about the QC-25; it's really about the quality of the bass rather than the quantity). Also, I'm not only comparing the TH-X00 Purplehearts to a planar, but I'm comparing them to the Audeze LCD-2, which is known for having some of the best bass. Those headphones are around double the cost for a reason. I think all of the people that hyped up these headphones as being better than the Audeze LCD-2 (and some even said that these are better than the TH-900) may have been a little overzealous with their reviews. But please, listen to the headphones first - all the graphs and reviews online are meaningless if you happen to like what you hear with these cans. Listening to music is a personal experience - don't let my opinion, or anyone else's opinion, ruin that!
Aug 14, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 14, 2016
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SnoopchickenIt could just be my high expectations. I appreciate your review and response though. The planars are known for their quick, responsive bass that appears out of nowhere. My final upgrade should be some LCDs as well or a hifiman, maybe that 800S, but for closed backs, would you say that it's at least a fun V/U shape signature? Like edm or hip hop worthy. Also are they heavy? I know the LCDs are heavier, but do these ache the neck?
I'm just stoked. Missed the mahagonies and got in on this.for the fun wooden backs sound.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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KTMDDefinitely sounds good with EDM. Actually, for EDM, it reminds me a lot of the HE-400, but with more bass quantity, and less harsh highs. The HE-400 beats it with bass impact and soundstage (probably because it's open-back, and the mids may be slightly more recessed, which can give the impression of a larger soundstage), but it's not something I could listen to for long listening sessions. I also wouldn't say that the TH-X00 Purplehearts are too V-shaped; I only listened for around an hour, but I don't think I'd get fatigued if I listened for more. And they're not heavy at all! They're actually very light and comfortable - more comfortable than the Audeze LCD-2. Your neck shouldn't ache, and your ears should fit nice and snug in the cups, given that you're not an elf or something.
I still remember when I upgraded from some generic Sony brand headphones I found at Ross to the HE-400, and I was blown away. Right now, I barely listen to the HE-400 after owning the Audeze LCD-2. If you've never listened to some of the more expensive headphones (like the Audeze LCD-2), you may very well be blown away with the TH-X00 Purplehearts. Especially with something like EDM.
Aug 14, 2016
AmpHi
100
Aug 14, 2016
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SnoopchickenDid you buy these with the expectations they would be better than your $1000 Audeze LCD-2?
Aug 14, 2016
imbroglio
16
Aug 14, 2016
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Hell, I'm inspired about the PH after reading that he bought these while already owning the Audeze LCD2!
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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I did compare them to the HE-400 though, and in my review, I said a planar offering from Hifiman would be my preferred choice over these cans. I don't think they're worth $450. Also, used Audeze LCD-2 cans go for (likely) around the same price as used TH-X00 Purplehearts - I actually bought my Audeze LCD-2 for $500. Also, don't forget that Massdrop is actually advertising these as being $1000 originally, which is the price of a new Audeze LCD-2. I don't think my comparison is unwarranted.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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AmpHiThe Audeze LCD-2 is a great headphone, but it doesn't do everything perfectly. After reading how amazing the bass was on the TH-X00 Purplehearts, I frankly expected that these would be more fun cans to complement my Audeze LCD-2. They weren't. Also, I'm not sure if you remember, but when these were getting hyped (i.e. 6 months ago when I joined the drop), people were saying that they thought these were better than the Audeze LCD-2. Hell, some even said these were better than the TH-900. Also, as I said before, these are being advertised by Massdrop as having a price of $1000 originally, which is the price of a new Audeze LCD-2. Regardless, I was more thorough with my comparison of these headphones to something in their price range - namely, the HE-400, which is actually cheaper. And I concluded by saying I'd prefer the planar offering.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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imbroglioCan't blame me! Do you remember when these were hyped 6 months ago? Many were saying they prefer them over the Audeze LCD-2! Also, let's not forget that Massdrop actually advertises these headphones as having a $1000 price tag originally...
Aug 14, 2016
Ian15
25
Aug 14, 2016
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KTMDJust goes to show little all the graphs actually prove. It's mostly just advertising. You can't expect a change in wood in the earcups (which are likely a laminate not solid wood) to make a new pair of headphones. The difference between all 3 would be miniscule at best.
My point was that these were advertised as relatively neutral headphones. You can't expect the purplehearts version to transform into "bass cannons' as some seem to be expecting. Most of the sound is coming from the driver not the wood.
Also laminate is not even a bad thing, it's just layered wood.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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What do you mean by "of course?"
Also, we could argue as far to say that cost doesn't necessarily equal value. I'm sure there are $1000 headphones that some may find that sound worse than this. It's also pretty much universally agreed that these sound better than the TH-600, which is a $599 headphone (as of now, it was much higher before). A new Audeze LCD-2 can occasionally be found near the $799 price range, but you know, without the hassle of having to wait 6 months to receive it. And for the record, the extra $300 or $400 that someone would have to pay to get a new Audeze LCD-2 is a far cry from the difference in price between a Ford Focus and a Mercedes, to address your analogy before. If people are spending $450 on these headphones (with a 6 month wait), I think they very well can afford the Audeze LCD-2.
Also, in the context of Massdrop, saying that the original price is $1000 is more akin to a scam rather than just a marketing ploy. The whole purpose of this website is for us to receive discounts on items by all agreeing to buy in bulk. We all come to this website for deals, not for paying the market price. I wouldn't be surprised if many of the people in this drop are hoping that the TH-X00 Purplehearts sound more than their price. I, personally, think they're not even worth $450 - I would prefer a cheaper planar option from Hifiman instead. Regardless, this is just a hobby, and that is my subjective opinion. What my ears like may not be what other people's ears like, and that's why (as I have stated before) my review should be taken with a grain of salt.
Aug 14, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 14, 2016
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Ian15It was mostly his description of the bass. These were supposed to be bass heavy, but comparing it to the planar he cleared it up a few posts later. The bass types are different. I'm sure these have more bass that extends lower and more impactful subbass. It's never going to reach planar quality in control, because planar is just a different system. So chart wise, it does match up. There's more quantity, but the quality isn't as high. I expect that comparing $800 planars to a $400 dynamic. At first he made it seem like Purplehearts didn't even have quantity, but for a closed back that seemed off. This is why I mentioned people compare to what they have and the experiences are always different.
Aug 14, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 14, 2016
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So well said, you pretty much nailed it and got my tone down also.
Aug 14, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 14, 2016
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I had a whole response laid out for you with everything wrong with these drops, but my phone froze.
-merged the purple and mahagony threads together -didn't allow purple to upgrade to ebony, they did before with mahagony to purple (the drops were close together) -drops were back to back -2 purpleheart drops ship at the same time when they were dropped at different times, early buyers gained nothing -special treatment to one guy who complained about the mahagonies when all should be treated equally and fairly -early buyers of mahagony get theirs shipped later than a smaller batch
There's more, but I'm tired of retyping.
Also, thanks for covering me with my disappointment for the hearts. I knew about LCDs and planars in general (I have modded T50RPs), I was just bummed that these being a closed back didn't seem to match up and the original THX00s were fun, bass cans. We know they have more quantity now I guess, but his review left me with a lot to desire. I just want my bass cannons like other reviewers on headfi said. I wish someone had these already and a TH600/D2000/D5000 to compare em to.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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No worries JimK, I can tell you're frustrated and I won't bother with that. I agree that Massdrop could be a little more transparent with these drops.
However, to address the bass (for both you and KTMD), I must once again stress that I have given a fair comparison of these to something in their price range - the HE-400. Those headphones do bass better - if you're not afraid to EQ the harsh treble away, I would suggest those cans any day of the week.
KTMD, I understand you're buying these for the bass. But these have never been advertised to be bass heavy; on the contrary, Massdrop and Fostex collaborated to make cans that were more neutral, so if anything, these should have less bass than the Denon models. Also, these are semi-closed cans, and I still feel more bass quantity with my legitimately closed cans, like my Bose QC25. Regardless, quantity is meaningless when the bass has little impact - the only way you're going to get bass that is super quick and super punchy for EDM music is with a planar. There's just significantly more control, by design, with a moving diaphragm rather than with a moving coil. And if you're not satisfied with the quantity of bass with some planar options, you'll be pleased to know that they EQ very well, especially since most have flat curves near the bass region (yes, that includes the HE-400).
I would assume most people would buy closed headphones for either isolation or stronger bass. These cans don't do as well as I thought in both of those domains. With that, I'll once more remind you guys that my disappointment in these headphones, and my conclusion that they're not worth $450, has little to do with the Audeze LCD-2; instead, I feel the HE-400 (which was selling new for $299) is a better option. I have said that numerous times now. Don't even get me started on how these compare to the HE-500.
If you're disappointed with my review because I wasn't so impressed with these cans, then please, stop putting so much emphasis on other people's opinions of a product and just wait till you get to hear the cans yourself (I have mentioned this before). If you're disappointed with my review because you're disappointed in how Massdrop is dealing with this drop, I apologize, but realize that I cannot give a stellar review to keep you guys excited when you receive your cans in the future when, in reality, I personally was not impressed. For some of you, you may be disappointed with this purchase - it's a sad reality you will have to face. The good news is that these sell well online, and you won't lose much of your money.
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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I also apologize for these long posts guys, I'm typing these out on my phone and, for some reason, my browser won't let me view my text as I'm typing, which makes it very hard for me to monitor my concision!
Aug 14, 2016
Snoopchicken
32
Aug 14, 2016
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No need to apologize! You have every right to be disappointed with how Massdrop has been dealing with this drop! I was also quite disappointed when I realized I wouldn't be allowed to transfer to the TH-X00 Ebony drop; why couldn't they tell us at the time of the Purpleheart drop that Ebony cans were going to be released in the future?
Aug 14, 2016
KTMD
195
Aug 15, 2016
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SnoopchickenI still have to go back and reread your post. There was a lot to address. As for the bass with these. The THX00s in general are highly regarded as V/U shaped with emphasis on bass. These are one of the few dynamics that touch upon subbass, which is why they're popular. It could be the wooden cups, which are somewhat harder to find, Fostex name and biocellulose drivers and diaphragm, etc. These specifically were emphasized as bass heavy. Purpleheart wood being denser and having a frequency that goes lower than the original, hence the higher cost and weight. Denser woods have different properties. Massdrop did advertise that it justified the extra cost over the originals. The ebony cost more because of the more expensive wood being heavier, rarer and having different properties. In short, all 3 variants have different sounds that are subtle, but should be similar.
The mahagony should be the baseline. Purpleheart should have been the bassiest of the bunch and most "fun" sounding and the ebony are the most refined. There was uproar because the ebony are a smoother mahogany. That's why many people tried selling their Purplehearts before they even shipped.
I wasn't disappointed that you were disappointed, I was disappointed because your review touched upon something these headphones should have been superior in. Yes, granted, planars are a different breed, I know first hand, but your wording made it as if these were inadequate in what they excel. I definitely will give it a chance and review them myself compared to what I have and in my experience.
You were right though, most people, I included, did look for these for their closed back sound qualities and advantages, along with the added bass. That's another reason why I'm disappointed. I needed a good wooden, closed back to complement sounds I crave in certain moods that my open backed can't.
Your review was fine, although it was a little biased and you tried to stay neutral. Comparing open back planars as a baseline is tough.
PS. I'm not mad at you or anything, I agree with what you said about the LCD and HE400is. I feel the same way about those 2. My feelings towards the Purplehearts would probably mirror yours. So you kinda get why I'd be disappointed? I wanted a good closed, wooden back that excelled in what it did.
Aug 15, 2016
Nrde
12
Aug 15, 2016
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Before jumping into conclusions, maybe the new drop consists of headphones returned or not claimed from the previous 3 drops. There must be many orders like that from the PH drop also. I'm just guessing though.
Aug 15, 2016
Nrde
12
Aug 15, 2016
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Ian15Maybe few minutes of googling for "th-x modification" was in order before continuing your guest of commenting the qualities of these headphones. I mean you start to sound like a certain president candidate. Maybe you can elobarate how did you come to the conclusion the cups are not solid wood? Or maybe "people are telling" you? And yes, most of the times you can't tell how a headphone or speaker or whatever sounds from graphs. You can however find clues why something sounds like it does from them.
Aug 15, 2016
Nrde
12
Aug 15, 2016
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Thank you for making this personal. I offered one somewhat possible alternative to "let's order another batch and deliver them before earlier orders" madness.
Aug 15, 2016
Ian15
25
Aug 15, 2016
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NrdeHow did you come to the conclusion that it's made of solid wood? My opinion is based on the fact that even instruments that are $1000+ use laminate wood, especially those that come from China. Laminate just means several layers of wood glued together, it's not a bad thing. Furthermore, these headphones are made in China not Japan like the TH900 so I don't believe they are using the same process for the earcups.
Maybe you misread what I said. I never said they are for sure laminate wood. I just believe they likely are a laminate because it logically makes more sense to me. I asked Massdrop for clarification and they never responded.
Laminate is not even a bad thing. But it just means the tonal qualities of the woods would be less pronounced. I know ebony is on the verge of extinction so it would make sense to waste as little as possible and make a laminate for something relatively inexpensive like headphone earcups.
There is no way to tell by looking at them either so it's total speculation unless Massdrop/Fostex confirms it.
Aug 15, 2016
Nrde
12
Aug 15, 2016
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No harm done, cheers. There seem to be something odd going on with the later drops, hopefully it solves before end of September.
Aug 15, 2016
Nrde
12
Aug 15, 2016
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Ian15Because I know something about wood turning, I have looked at good quality photos of the cups, it wouldn't make any sense to do by laminating and disguise them to look like one piece wood. And I also think I saw it mentioned they are carved/turned from solid wood.
Main thing with the TH900 cups when it comes to the labor is the outside finish, they are different model, so you can't really draw conclusions how TH-X's are manufactured - country, material etc. based on them.
To me, they look as being carved from a solid wood block, nothing indicates they would be laminated.
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Aug 15, 2016
Ian15
25
Aug 15, 2016
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NrdeYeah that's actually a good point. But it would probably cheaper to carve/turn them out of block of laminate wood (HPL) than solid wood and there would be no way to tell from pictures. But I could very well be wrong I don't know much about turning wood. I'll take your word for it.
Aug 15, 2016
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