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rholdy
18
Oct 27, 2015
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Using the online configurator how do you get a double-quote " or a colon : ?
Oct 27, 2015
PaulElliott
40
Oct 27, 2015
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Configurator assumes US ANSI keys, so those would be the single-quote and semi-colon keys, plus shift.
Oct 27, 2015
rholdy
18
Oct 27, 2015
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So does that happen by default? I wouldn't have to configure all the !@#$%%^&*() symbols on a second layer if making a custom layout?
Oct 27, 2015
Iaeen
277
Oct 27, 2015
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That is correct, shift is handled by the OS, keyboards send a shift code to the computer just like any other normal key, then pressing the 1 key sends 1 and the OS then interprets that as !.
There are !@#$%^&*() options available in the configurator that send shift + the corresponding number to the OS without the need to hit any other key that you might have mapped to shift. This is only really useful (IMO) if you want the symbol keys on your base layer, otherwise you might as well hit shift + number (assuming you have numbers on your base layer).
Oct 27, 2015
KoviRobi
40
Oct 27, 2015
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But I am considering putting "(" and ")" on my homing keys as a lisper ;)
Oct 27, 2015
ArnoNym
95
Oct 28, 2015
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Only if you replace the shift keys entirely with your own custom layer 2 switch.
Oct 28, 2015
Qudeid
63
Oct 28, 2015
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But can the configurator do 'a' and 'A'? Last time I checked both resulted in 'A'. The Idea behind it, for me, is to always have the right symbol, no matter the layout selected on the PC. As I'm using colemak I don't want my changes to be installed on the PC I'm using the Dox first. Like at work where it's only QWERTZ (German). Is it possible to do this all by myself with the configurator? Or do I need to recompile the KLL?
As my kit is now on the way, I'm starting to look more into the configuration part.
Oct 28, 2015
OverKill
515
Input Club
Oct 28, 2015
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I think what you want is the locking layers. That way when you want to switch layouts you can lock that layer ON, but for macros you will need to compile your own custom firmware. Also you need to remember that to get capital a you need to press shift+a which is a macro and unsupported by the configurator. If you just want to be able to type a and then hold shift and press a to get A then you just put a where you want it, or replace a with any letter or number.
Oct 28, 2015
Qudeid
63
Oct 28, 2015
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Got that. Normal letters isn't really the problem. It's more about symbols. Like '@' is on shift+2 for any US kind of layout (even Colemak) but it is AltGr+Q while on shift+2 is double quotes on a German layout. Those things I'm talking about that change with the layout configured on the computer.
So, let's say, if I want '@' on shift+2 no matter what PC I'm on, I can't go with the configurator, as that doesn't do macros like this and on a PC configured with a typical German layout as shift+2 would equate to double quotes there. Is that right? Or wait... almost forgot.. since this is still only a macro, I'd be stuck with the same thing, right? The key press would just do shift+2 itself...
Hm, so in essence rearranging letters is a mundane task but symbols are bit more tricky as it seems unless I've misunderstood something there. Thanks for the answer! :)
Oct 28, 2015
KoviRobi
40
Oct 28, 2015
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You can make your own "shift" layer http://input.club/knowledgebase/configurator-faq then you can map which key you would use for shift to be that f-n button instead (with n being the "shift" layer number)
This won't work for games, where shift on its own is a key, but otherwise should be good for hacking
Oct 28, 2015
OverKill
515
Input Club
Oct 28, 2015
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It seems you have talked yourself through the problem perfectly :). You are correct!
Oct 28, 2015
boli
17
Oct 28, 2015
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Regarding your sentence: "The Idea behind it, for me, is to always have the right symbol, no matter the layout selected on the PC"
There is *always* a "software layout" on your PC, which "translates" the USB key codes the computer receives to a particular character. Because these software layouts vary wildly, what you ask is impossible.
But, most of your computers will most likely use the german layout I assume, so just keep in mind what USB key codes (in a US layout) convert to in a German layout, and configure accordingly (like yY becomes zZ, 2@ becomes 2" and so forth).
There is the option to configure most stuff in the keyboard firmware instead, and using a US software layout on your computer. However, doing so you would miss out on characters you probably want, such as ä, ö, ü, ß and whatnot.
Personally (I live in Switzerland and use Colemak) I configure all my keyboards with the US layout in mind, which is then translated to Colemak as I'm using the Colemak keyboard layout on my computers.
However, if I were to boot into the BIOS for example, the layout would be US, because there's no translation to Colemak in the BIOS. That's fine though, for these cases my QWERTY knowledge is still good enough and I don't need to be fast.
Lastly, I'm using a custom Colemak layout (in software, on my computer), which has all the umlauts in easier to reach locations, namely Alt+a = ä, Alt+o=ö, Alt+u=ü (this is different from regular Colemak).
A few friends of mine (also software engineers) use a similar idea: Because the US layout has the symbols one often needs when programming in more convenient locations than the Swiss layout, they use a custom US "software layout" on their computer, which also has the Umlauts on Alt+<base character> like I mentioned above. If you're using OS X you can make your own custom layout with Ukelele: http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.php?site_id=nrsi&id=ukelele There are most likely similar tools for other OSs.
Oct 28, 2015
Qudeid
63
Oct 29, 2015
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Damn :D. Sometimes just talking about what you understand how helps thinking about stuff more clearly. Thanks :)
Oct 29, 2015
Qudeid
63
Oct 29, 2015
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First, yes, I've got my own custom Colemak layout as well. With the same modifiers. And that's what I don't want to rely on. So yeah, I could just assume I'm on a German QWERZ Layout and arrange the Keys (incl. symbols, with my own shift layer) to assume that as well. I guess, that will be the best solution I can currently see for me.
I'm on Windows and created my layout with the Keyboard Layout Creator (KLC) by MS. But this Layout is a hassle to install and use on Win 10... once I get it in, it's fine, but getting that far seems very buggy to me. That's one of the major reasons I don't want to rely on that any more. And QWERZ is the most common here, so that is a very safe assumption
Thank you for your input, clearly helped me finding a solution. :)
Oct 29, 2015
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