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Showing 1 of 31 conversations about:
oandakid718
39
Feb 7, 2020
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Plate mount??
C'mon at least make an effort for this DIY kit to sound remotely good lmao....
oandakid718
39
Feb 7, 2020
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graftPlate mount should be illegal.
All of the parts are stable when assembled properly, regardless of mounting style.
Plate mount sounds atrocious compared to pcb mount, always. I understand this is a budget offering, but enough with the plate mount builds ffs!
graft
171
Feb 7, 2020
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oandakid718Idk, I have about 30 boards and only one is PCB-mount. I would think that PCB mount would be the budget option if it's omitting a plate, no? Maybe I'm missing something
oandakid718
39
Feb 7, 2020
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graftYou have 20+ plate mount boards? What are they? Are you sure you know what plate mount is? Just sounds like something is off here lmao, perhaps you're confused.
PCB mount will have mounts on the sides on the bottom of the switches, as well as respective holes on the pcb. Plate mount wont have those pin mounts on the sides. Plate mount would be something along the lines of this keyboard and the Drop Alts.
(Edited)
fractl
112
Feb 7, 2020
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graftPCB-mount just means that the stabilizers mount to the PCB and not the plate. It doesn't mean that there isn't a plate for the switches. Spacebars just tend to sound a lot worse with plate-mounted stabilizers. Or at least they tend to sound a lot louder. It's a matter of preference if this is a problem for someone, but most people do what they can to reduce loud spacebars, which is harder with plate-mounted stabilizers.
graft
171
Feb 7, 2020
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oandakid718I think @fractl straightened it out. You're saying that PCB-mount stabilizers are superior, which I obviously agree with. I thought you meant PCB-mount switches, a board with no plate at all.
oandakid718
39
Feb 7, 2020
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graftPCB mount switches are superior too! But yes, referring to all scenarios including a plate because usually there is one.
Doman
0
Feb 7, 2020
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oandakid718plate mount stabs are fine with krytox 205 grade 0 - very crisp (just buy genuine cherry because others are almost trash). Though pcb mount stabs has more options which I like, but it is a more rare case to have pcb mount stabilizers and hotswapability at same moment (at least now) (only few boards like kbdfans67 mkii (which I have) and rama m65 I think does that)
(Edited)
YJ93
117
Feb 7, 2020
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oandakid718Why is there a need for such a overdramatic comment? “Plate mount should be illegal. Plate mount sounds atrocious.” I’m sure that everyone has their own preferences and I’ll respect that, but this sounds so exaggerated. The keyboard that I’m currently building, my first one, is based on a budget build with plate-mount stabs that sound good. It inspired me to make my own and make it sound equally as good, if not better.
SpencerL
2946
keeb weeb
Feb 7, 2020
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oandakid718Oops sorry, our mistake! It's actually PCB mount stabilizers - hope that helps!
fractl
112
Feb 7, 2020
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YJ93You can lube a plate-mounted stabilizer, but there's no point in clipping and band-aid modding, because those things are done to dampen the impact of the stabilizer sliders as they hit the PCB, and the sliders don't hit the PCB with plate-mounted stabilzers. Also, spacebars are louder with plate-mounted stabilizers because the sound of the spacebar bottoming-out transfers though the metal plate, as opposed to the fiberglass PCB which dampens the sound more. So, yes, a lubed plate-mounted stabilzer will be better than a non-lubed one, but it will still be louder than the PCB-mounted equivalent. Finally, the bottom-out sound will be deeper toned with the PCB-mounted stabs, again, because of the PCB material. The difference is like using switches with a metal plate vs. an FR4 plate (which is the same material as PCBs).
Of course, as I said, everyone is free to like whatever pleases them, and there's really no such thing as 'better' or 'worse'. On the other hand, a majority of people in the hobby, myself included, prefer the deeper 'thock' that comes from PCB mount. Personally, I don't use GMK/Cherry stabilzers anymore (since retooling has screwed them up pretty bad), so I don't have to worry about clipping anymore (using Durock stabilizers), and I used to electrical-tape-mod Cherry stabs, but don't anymore, since I really enjoy the deep 'thock' of a properly-tuned stabilizer without the band-aid/tape modding. For reference, if you haven't watched Nathan Kim's videos, check out Taeha Types, and compare the sound of his builds to videos of keyboards with plate-mounted stabilizers. He doesn't cushion the bottoming-out of his stabs in any way, and they always sound really good. (I know he builds expensive keyboards, but the same principles apply to keyboards of any price).
I can't stress enough that I'm not trying to tell anyone what they should or shouldn't like. My point is simply that the same amount of tuning will not produce the same results with plate-mount as opposed to PCB-mount, though you're certainly free to like plate-mount if that's what you prefer. Personally, I've never been able to use a spacebar with a plate-mounted stab without putting a silent switch, or a Frankenswitch with a silent stem, under it. On the other hand, on the Klippe I'm typing on right now, I put a Halo stem in the switch underneath the spacebar, just to emphasize the satisfying 'thock'. But that's just me and my personal preference, that's all.
I'm just explaining this because it's very easy to spend a lot of money on keyboards based on assumptions that don't pan out when you build the thing after spending hundreds of dollars. Stabs, lubing, plate material, switch choice, keyboard design, etc., they all provide different effects, and endless combinations. The more you know going in, the less time and money you waste finding what you want, I think.
Long story short, you can get spacebars with plate-mounted stabilizers to sound decent, but it generally takes more work, and it will still sound different than a PCB-mount equivalent. No necessarily better or worse, but different... and it might be best to compare the differences in sound through videos, simply to determine your preferences before spending money. Whatever the case, enjoy your keyboards!
YJ93
117
Feb 8, 2020
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fractlI’ve only been in this hobby for a couple of months and only just started building my first keyboard. I’m learning something new almost every day, so I very much appreciate it that you’re trying to explain this to me, as opposed to OP basically saying “hurr durr plate-mount bad”. I just took out my GK64 PCB with a fiberglass plate and Cherry plate-mount stabilizers, because I wanted to test and see if you were right about the sliders not hitting the PCB, but I am definitely seeing the sliders hitting the PCB. I don’t know if they’re supposed to, like PCB-mount ones, but I am 99% sure that I installed mine correctly. However, if you feel like I might’ve done something wrong, please feel free to tell me. I can upload a video to show how they’re mounted, if that’s necessary.
The reason why I wanted to build my own mechanical keyboard is because I bought a Drevo Calibur V2 last year, but it was so noisy, mainly because of the aluminium plate, which is why I ended up returning it. That’s why I wanted to avoid aluminium plates and went with the fiberglass plate, which was made specifically for the GK64 to have the cutouts for plate-mounted stabs, since the GK64 PCB doesn’t have holes on the left 2U shift to mount stabilizers.
About Taeha Types, I actually stumbled upon his “how to clip, lube and baid-aid mod your stabilizers” video a while back, which is where I got the idea of silencing stabs. I haven’t watched any of his other videos, but just to be clear: he doesn’t actually use the band-aid mod for his own builds?
“The more you know going in, the less time and money you waste finding what you want, I think.” You’re probably right about that. For example, I tried to educate myself about mechanical keyboards before I started buying all the necessary parts, but I didn’t know the difference in sound between plate-mount and PCB-mount stabilizers. That’s something to think about if I want build another keyboard in the future.
I appreciate the detailed explanation and I’m happy to see that you’re neutral in this and that you just want to inform people about this topic :-)
fractl
112
Feb 8, 2020
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YJ93It's been a while since I've had a keyboard with plate-mounted stabilizers, so, if you say that yours bottom out, I believe you, and don't think that you did anything wrong. So, maybe I was wrong and just learned something myself. Everything else I said was based on personal experience, but, since it's been so long since I had a keyboard with plate-mounted stabs, maybe I was just repeating things that other people have said about that. I owned a K-Type, CTRL, and ALT before moving on to more-limited customs, and I never took those keyboards apart except to put some shelf-liner under the PCBs, so I didn't examine if the stab sliders were bottoming out or not... and everything I've built since then has had PCB-mounted stabilizers.
Also, I'm not saying that you shouldn't band-aid mod stabilizers if that's what you prefer. Tons of people do it. And GMK/Cherry stabilizers do still need clipping. It's just that a lot of enthusiast have moved away from them since a recent retool really screwed them up and people started searching for alternatives. Luckily, there are other good alternatives now, like the Everglide/Durock ones.
That being said, I'd definitely suggest watching a full build stream by Nathan Kim, Taeha Types. I've never seen him band-aid mod any of his recent builds, but I can't honestly say that I watch every minute of every 3-hour-long keyboard build. I'd definitely suggest checking some of his videos out. He streams on Twitch, posts on YouTube, and has a Discord, if you want to keep up on his latest streams. Beware of getting addicted and wanting to build very expensive keyboards, though.
I'm probably on my 13th or 14th custom keyboard, and I'm still learning what my preferences are. It can be pretty expensive to try all sorts of options, but at least the resale value of custom keyboards is quite high, and the more expensive the keyboard, the better the resale value, in general. I only have 3 customs at the moment, meaning that I've sold around 10 on mechmarket. It's taken a few years, actually, but I've gotten happier and happier with what I've built.
I never thought I'd get into things to this degree, but I have to admit that modding switches has made a big difference to me. Never mind stabilizers, trying tons of different switches, learning how to lube them with different lubricants, creating Frankenswitches that combine parts from different switches, swapping and lubing springs, swapping stems, using switch films, there are so many combinations and options just in regard to switches. It really takes things to the next level.
I never thought I'd get into keyboards as a hobby, but I definitely enjoy it. Hope you have some fun, however deep you want to go down the rabbit hole!
Daemonblade
36
May 5, 2020
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YJ93Some plate mounted stabs hit the PCB some don't. It depends on the board. The stabs on my alt do but a quick bandaid mod improved the feel and sound greatly.
nkostic
0
May 27, 2020
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oandakid718Are you talking about PCB mounted or PCB screw-in? I understand PCB screw in has the best stability, but whats the logic behind PCB mounted being better than plate mounted? I have no experience in the matter but it seems to me the plate adds more uniform structure and rigidity to the placement of the stabs, kinda how its better to have a plate if your switches don't have 5 prongs.
The reason I ask is, I'm building a keyboard almost identical to this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EW_RmzRUjR4&t=398s) and if you watch 1:59-2:50, he discusses how he cant use the screw-in variant due to case screw placement. In this scenario would you still recommend the PCB mount over plate mount?
Additionally my plate is carbon fiber so I dont think it will have the pinging issues that some aluminum plates have
Thanks
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