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Showing 1 of 22 conversations about:
Aleskb
449
Mar 12, 2019
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Looks ok, but not sure what is has above the original Flieger from Stowa, which can be had at roughly same price, with a better movement, better lume, blued hands and a fantastic finishing? Oh and was nearly forgetting: and is one of the 5 original manufacturers of Flieger watches. Beat that, Muhle! ;)
GtrJohnny
2
Mar 13, 2019
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AleskbBoth great watches. The main difference is water resistance. The Muhle is a little more than double the Stowa. Otherwise, they're both quite similar.
Aleskb
449
Mar 14, 2019
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GtrJohnnyFair enough about the WR, hadn't seen that. Personally, chosing between thermally blued hands, historic weight, top grade ETA movement, direct contact with manufacturer + real warranty vs WR and no warranty via MD , the choice is clear. But I appreciate that to some WR is more important.
Mordekai
47
May 19, 2019
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AleskbOr you could go for the Stowa Classic sport with 200m water resistance. I know it’s priced higher and the size is 43mm. I don’t usually go for larger watches but the flieger style are meant to be bigger. 
A community member
Sep 30, 2019
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AleskbPersonally, I prefer a watch not associated with the Luftwaffe, bombing the shit out of Britain,
and bundling Jews into ovens - so a certain lack of authenticity sits just fine with me.
made in Germany, tick; high legibility, tick; flieger inspired, tick; sellita movement, tick; not commissioned by nazis, tick.
(Edited)
A community member
Oct 2, 2019
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AleskbWell, you you know what they say about making wild guesses... they are usually completely wrong.
(Edited)
Aleskb
449
Oct 2, 2019
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Assuming I'm wrong in my asumption, should I also assume that you don't use computers, ATMs, and never traveled using a plane equipped with a jet engine? Because guess what, these were also commissioned and invented by the Nazis! Anyhow, copy-pasting what I wrote in my blog review about this aspect of the watch a couple of years ago, you make what you want of it ;) :
Let’s make a small pause here, as I have read some people posting on forums that they wouldn’t want to wear such a watch, as they consider it a homage to Adolf Hitler; I’d like to address this first hand before going further.
The second world war was a terrible episode in human history, where millions of all nationalities were killed, with Russians paying the heaviest tribute to Hitler’s barbarianism, but people from every country, colour or race paying their price also. And yet, does this mean we should totally erase it from our common memories? Shouldn’t we rather try to see the little good that came out of it, and that enabled humanity to stay on its feet and move forward despite all that had happened? The war gave birth to many heroes like Jean Moulin, Raoul Wallenberg, Dwight D. Eisenhower, Oscar Schindler, George Beurling within others. It also gave birth to countless inventions without which our lives would be very different today. To name only a few: penicillin, computers, ATMs, jet engines, radars, photocopies, synthetic rubber… Last, my grandfather, who was a British soldier, met my grandmother in Belgium when he liberated the town of Charleroi with his armoured company. One can say that, without the second world war, I wouldn’t be here to write these lines!
For all these reasons, and because of a duty to remember what human beings are capable of when populism and fake information become state policies (hint-hint), I don’t believe we should erase WW2 and all its attributes from our memories.
The second world war was a terrible episode in human history, where millions of all nationalities were killed, with Russians paying the heaviest tribute to Hitler’s barbarianism, but people from every country, colour or race paying their price also. And yet, does this mean we should totally erase it from our common memories? Shouldn’t we rather try to see the little good that came out of it, and that enabled humanity to stay on its feet and move forward despite all that had happened? The war gave birth to many heroes like Jean Moulin, Raoul Wallenberg, Dwight D. Eisenhower, Oscar Schindler, George Beurling within others. It also gave birth to countless inventions without which our lives would be very different today. To name only a few: penicillin, computers, ATMs, jet engines, radars, photocopies, synthetic rubber… Last, my grandfather, who was a British soldier, met my grandmother in Belgium when he liberated the town of Charleroi with his armoured company. One can say that, without the second world war, I wouldn’t be here to write these lines!
For all these reasons, and because of a duty to remember what human beings are capable of when populism and fake information become state policies (hint-hint), I don’t believe we should erase WW2 and all its attributes from our memories.
A community member
Oct 2, 2019
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Aleskb
the ‘computer’ was as much developed by the work of Alan Turing at Bletchley Park, by the British, and the US Navy as it was by wartime Germany.
the ATM was developed in the 90s, not in Nazi Germany. Radars - developed in pre-Nazi Germany, became highly developed by the Allies, not the Nazis who had inferior resolution radar. Penicillin was developed by an Australian scientist in Britain.
positing that nazi Germany was a good thing because it lead to earlier technological development and, indirectly, in your conception is very poor reasoning, unless you believe that your conception was worth the deaths of tens of millions of people.
I find Luftwaffe inspired watches to be poor choices because they harken back to the Air Force of a fascist and highly militaristic society. A watch is a symbol and an aesthetic choice and I don’t wish to be associated with the Luftwaffe, which was involved in the bombing of civilian targets and was the tool of a fascist regime.
i have no issues with modern Germany, I speak some German, hav3 visited there and own a Bauhaus design watch. But I would never wear a watch inspired by the Luftwaffe any more than I would parade in a nazi inspired uniform. I don’t care that you do, or others do but at least own the connotation that you project with it and don’t hide behind the fantasy that Nazi Germany was a Good Thing.
Aleskb
449
Oct 2, 2019
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Lol. Seriously, what's the point of writing such a long reply if it has to be totally overshadowed but your BS statement according to which I believe Nazi Germany was a good thing. Beyond some obvious high regard of your own self, maybe it would be wise to go back to some basics, being reading a text and understanding it for what it says. What you did is the contrary: you placed words that were never spoken in my mouth, and understood the exact contrary of what I wrote in my blog.
I will not go in the details, as it would take longer for me to write them here than for you to simply read the few sentences copy-pasted above with a clear and objective mind. Nowhere does it say the Nazi regime was a good thing. On the contrary, it even states it was horrible. But your eyes read what your ears want to hear, not what my fingers typed.
Based on the fact you twist my words in such an incredible manner as to write I believe Nazi Germany was a good thing, while you know as I wrote it that my grandfather fought on the other side, makes anything else you say totally irrelevant, as is exchanging with you on this or anything. I don't twist in dance, and nore do I in words.
(Edited)
A community member
Oct 4, 2019
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RayFDo they make Luftwaffe homage watches?
Apparently not.
(Edited)
A community member
Oct 4, 2019
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AleskbI get it. You like Luftwaffe homage watches. Watches that pilots and navigators of the Nazi Air Force wore when they were bombing both American soldiers and civilians in Europe.
No need to make a big thing of it, I totally understand how that could be your thing.
(Edited)
A community member
Oct 4, 2019
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RayFIs it pertinent what other militaries wore? This thread concerns Luftwaffe homage watches and pertains to what the Luftwaffe did and were associated with.
RayF
22219
Oct 4, 2019
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A community member
Oct 4, 2019
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RayFi refer you to my comments to Aleskb. I made my position very clear.
RayF
22219
Feb 21, 2020
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sparis145149I agree, it's difficult to know where to draw the line if taken to the extreme. I'm not unsympathetic to @wily-quixote comments and ideas, but that same conflict involved the Japanese and Italians too. Do we blame the entire populations of those countries, or just their politicians? Am I responsible for Trump because I'm an American? The past is the past, one should endeavor to make peace with it as soon as possible. To my way of thinking, it's the future we should most be focused on--it needs our help!
A community member
Feb 21, 2020
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sparis145149I think that you have misapprehended my case. if you read my comments you will find that I don't object to companies that were involved in WW2.
But, I wouldn't wear a watch created by a german company that was a homage to the Luftwaffe between 1939-1945 anymore than I would drive a Mercedes homage to a WW2 German staff car, or wear a German helmet of that vintage. I think that it is disrespectful to those people who are alive who were bombed by the Luftwaffe, and any victim of the fascist regime of that time and I don't wish to be associated with fascism. I mean what exactly is the attraction of a watch designed for use by the military arm of a fascist regime? The OP claims that the Stowa is better partially because it is more authentic an example of a WW2 german watch.... that's a good thing?
If you had it on your wrist I wouldn't complain or even care but I choose to eschew memorabilia of a fascist regime for the reasons I have outlined. I am not saying that you shouldn't buy a Stowa Luftwaffe watch but if you do and crow about how cool it is that it is authentic don't expect all people to share your enthusiasm.
A community member
Feb 23, 2020
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YeptxYes there is a difference. I doubt if anyone buying a Stowa reproduction is buying it to complete their neo-nazi cosplay.
My point is a different one.
An analogy is an American flying the confederate flag. Most people flying the confederate flag probably don't want to own African-American slaves, but to African -Americans it might have resonance to a time where there ancestors were enslaved. Therefore, many people eschew flying a confederate flag out of respect for the racist connotations of the period in which the flag was flown.
Now this is analogous but very different so I don't want to labour the point. My point is that a reproduction watch of the Nazi period is not free of resonance of the aims of the Nazis. 99.99% of people seeing that you are wearing a Stowa Flieger wouldn't know that it is celebrating the Luftwaffe from 1939-1945 when it was the air arm of the Nazis. Of that .001% who do know, only another 0.01% is likely to care. But for me that is not the point.
I know.
So, therefore, I won't be wearing a reproduction watch of the nazi period.
What you do is completely up to you but if you do crow publicly about your fantastic WW2 Luftwaffe watch don't be surprised if some people think you are either a tacticool wannabe or some kind of Nazi fetishist. But if you don't crow about it you just have a cool looking automatic watch.
So that is my position. I am not asserting that this should be your position.
(Edited)
A community member
Feb 23, 2020
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RayFI am sorry if everyone is under the impression that I have set myself up as some kind of arbiter on watch brands and fascism but I only have an opinion of whether I would or would not wear a flieger associated directly with the luftwaffe in WW2.
I know very little about panerai except that I associate them immediately with paunchy men, vulpine fake dentition, chunky jewellery, ferraris and mid-life crises; but perhaps I am being unfair.
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