Massdrop x Apogee Vital 8-Inch Chef's Knife Discussions | Drop

Sep 13, 2018

Looks like the results @JonasHeineman promised are never going to come. He has repeatedly promised them and we have repeatedly asked, we are no longer being granted even a simple response like "it's coming". This is making me feel more anxious about the knife and very disappointed in massdrop. We deserve the data and at least need a response. I recommend that if they aren't forthcoming with lab results we obtain them ourselves.
Would anybody be interested in going in together on having a knife independently tested for hardness and composition? I'm willing to sacrifice my knife to the cause, the lab test itself would be $240 to get the Rockwell hardness and Steel Composition done by an accredited lab (http://metengr.com/)
Personally, if i have to go though the process myself, it will probably be the last massdrop/apogee collaboration I ever consider buying.
CC: @harveyfnj @JonasHeineman @AveryC @ajorcajada @HttpCasey @Mandrake @Deaomega1214 @faldor20

Sep 13, 2018

Sep 13, 2018

anteck7I expect to be contacting senior MASSDROP management within the next few weeks, and alerting them to the mismanagement of this particular collaboration. I bought 4 of these disappointing knives, and have spent literally thousands of dollars with MASSDROP over the years, and Heineman’s lack of response and dishonest treatment of MASSDROP customers is disheartening. I will get the word out regarding the response I get (if any) from senior management.

Sep 13, 2018

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Sep 13, 2018

anteck7Hey @anteck7 -- Very sorry about this, we sent the knife for testing on July 17th but we haven't heard back from the lab about results. They have been responsive in the past, but this one seems to have slipped - I will follow up today to find out why and let you know. I was expecting to hear back from them as my reminder to post this, and when I didn't I forgot about it - apologies for leaving you hanging there. I will have news for you by Monday of next week.
PS - I'm not sure who's charging you $240 for this test, we have gotten composition testing from Decisive with niton gun for $40 and destructive for $50. Rockwell tests should be practically free, but not more than $50.

Sep 13, 2018

Sep 13, 2018

harveyfnj @harveyfnj I understand that you're upset. I will acknowledge and apologize for the disappointing lack of response on my part, but there is nothing dishonest going on here on my part, or anyone else's. I believe that you've been offered returns or exchanges for all four of these knives, even though you sharpened them yourself so there's no way that we could tell what condition they arrived in if you did return them. If you contact support and your inquiry cannot be handled by a member of the team, it will be escalated to a supervisor. Our senior management meets regularly with support supervisors to review any 'problem drops' - but individual issues with dissatisfied members are handled by folks like @Duncan who is aware of your concerns.

Sep 13, 2018

Sep 13, 2018

JonasHeinemanPerhaps it costs more because you get the results in 3-5 business days 😁. But all joking aside I'm glad that there is a less expensive way.
For anyone interested in the breakout. I was wondering why there was a milling charge, but assume that's to cut a chunk out of the knife for testing. That being said, I don't have a lot of buying power. I think the main difference is between using a niton gun vs spectroscopy
$45 for hardness testing $37.5 for milling $85 for ASTM E415 or ASTM E1086 - Optical Emission Spectroscopy of steel. $75 for reaults prep and interpretation

Sep 13, 2018

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Sep 13, 2018

JonasHeinemanYou did tell us you sent the steel out for testing. Did you send it? Are you still waiting for results? After several requests, I have still not seen a responsive answer from you. Honest behavior on your part? I gave three as gifts, and am personally embarrassed that this knife did not live up to the hype (that you sold us on, and that I sent to my gift recipients.) I can hardly suggest to the gift recipients that they return the knives. I won’t be buying any new collaborations that have your name associated with them. I would doubt that the way you have interacted with customers is the way MASSDROP would like to have handled this. I was and am not interested in your apology. I want to know what steel was used, how the QC went so wrong, and what, if anything, you will do to rectify it.

Sep 13, 2018

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Sep 13, 2018

harveyfnjI have answered your questions in my reply to @anteck7 above.

Sep 13, 2018

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Sep 14, 2018

JonasHeinemanSeriously? You most certainly did not answer a single one of my questions.

Sep 14, 2018

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Sep 14, 2018

JonasHeinemanAh yes, you say you sent the sample out 7/27, and have not heard back. Do you recall when you said you had sent it out? I seem to remember that you said you would have an answer by mid August, which came and went a month ago. No apparent follow up, either with the lab nor your customers. If I ran my business the way you seem to, I wouldn’t still BE in business.

Sep 14, 2018

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Sep 14, 2018

JonasHeinemanAnd after checking the discussion chain, I see you never even bothered to respond to my question to you about knife sharpening for my giftees that I sent to you 6 weeks ago.

Sep 14, 2018

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Sep 14, 2018

harveyfnjHarveyfnj, it sounds like you have had more problems with the knives you received than the general community.
While I agree with you that on the agregate the knife isn't overly impressive and is overhyped, we need to tackle issues with individual knives and general assurance of the manufacturer as separate items.
It seems than @JonasHeineman is directing people to support for individual knife problems.
That being said I feel that he has a direct responsibility to provide certain information to the community based on what we have seen and what has been promised.
Let's give it a few days, trust that I'm equally as concerned, but he has asked that the community wait until Monday, let's give him that time.
I've started reaching out to people who may be able to provide affordable testing if he doesn't provide the data, and may have a contact at carpenter I can engage.

Sep 14, 2018

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Sep 18, 2018

JonasHeineman @JonasHeineman
Update on those lab results? You said you would have something by Monday. Looking forward to news, even if its that they lost the knife.
Thanks,
CC: @harveyfnj @AveryC @ajorcajada @HttpCasey @Mandrake @Deaomega1214 @faldor20

Sep 18, 2018

Sep 19, 2018

anteck7Hey @anteck7 I've been on the phone with the lab today and unfortunately they were not able to get conclusive results because their machines are not able to detect Nitrogen content. We're dispatching another unit to the lab they recommended (Element in Los Angeles) and I hope those folks will be able to get us conclusive test results quickly. Thanks again for your patience, I will let you all know when we have results or at least an ETA for them.

Sep 19, 2018

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Naftoor

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Sep 27, 2018

JonasHeinemanAny word from Element as to whether the knife was received for the next round of testing? Also, did the previous lab state they were unable to detect nitrogen as in it may not be there, or as in nitrogen detection is beyond their capabilities?

Sep 27, 2018

Sep 27, 2018

NaftoorYep, Element emailed to let us know they received the knife and asked to confirm that we approved the destruction of the knife (which is required to do type of testing needed). The previous lab doesn't have the right equipment to test for the presence of nitrogen (or any gasses).

Sep 27, 2018

Naftoor

291

Sep 27, 2018

JonasHeinemanAwesome, thank you for the update! That's good to know about the previous lab, when I read they couldn't detect nitrogen I took it as the steel wasn't found to have any which left me rather alarmed. Has Element provided a timeline for the testing completion yet?

Sep 27, 2018

Sep 28, 2018

JonasHeinemanThanks Jonas!

Sep 28, 2018

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Naftoor

291

Oct 8, 2018

JonasHeinemanDo we have another update from Element regarding the testing?

Oct 8, 2018

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Oct 8, 2018

JonasHeinemanLab testing should not take over three weeks to simply acknowledge receipt of the item. WHERE ARE THE TEST RESULTS??? More smoke and mirrors?

Oct 8, 2018

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