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tanyacwood
27
Dec 8, 2018
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Very interesting tent-I just finished the PCT in the solplex and the material is starting to degrade. While it was pretty much the perfect pct tent weight and waterproof-wise, it was drafty, albeit robust, in high winds. How do you think your tent would compare? it looks as though you can get the fly lower to the ground so it might be better? I also found the solplex a bit claustrophic with the tent a mere inch or two from my face and feet (with occasional condensation); is the fly more distant in your design? I note yours is a couple of inches less wide and a couple of square feet smaller-I do like stowing bits of gear-water bottles and miscellaneous- to the side of me so this is a bit of a concern, but the advantages of durability and PRICE especially may well outweigh this. Can’t face the thought of forking out so much cash for relatively limited use again!
Dec 8, 2018
dandurston
5116
Dan Durston
Dec 8, 2018
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tanyacwoodHi Tanyac, First off, congrats on finishing the PCT. Hopefully by "just finished" you don't mean that you rolled into Manning in the first week of December, although kudos to you if you did :) In terms of wind and draft the X-Mid would be far better because the fly is designed to extend basically right to the ground, whereas the Solplex almost unavoidably has a very large gap. You can pitch the X-Mid with anything from almost a zero gap up to several inches, depending on how much you extend the cord at the four corners. The advantages of a fly that extends to the ground are that it blocks the wind/snow/sand and that it's easier to pitch because the length of the side sets the distances between the stakes, as you can see in the X-Mid video. But you still want the ability to be able to lift it up if you want more ventilation, and the X-Mid provides this with the adjustable cord at the corners. Normally it pitches almost right to the ground like this:
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Conversely, the Solplex has a rather large gap in its normal pitch, as you know. It looks like this:
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And this gap is even larger on the backside where it can be more than a foot off the ground (photo is from Zpacks overview video):
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Some ultralights tent like the Solplex opt for this raised fly design. This is done mostly to save weight but I don't think it's a good compromise because it sacrifices weather protection. Folks will also say this is to improve ventilation and there is some truth to that, but you can tell that they aren't really serious about ventilation because there aren't peak vents and since your breath rises, peak vents are the most effective form of venting. A few inch gap at the bottom plus peak vents is a much more effective venting setup because you get airflow through the tent, rather than a really drafty bottom but stale at the top. So the best design is a small gap at the bottom plus peak vents, whereas a raised fly provides a lighter tent with inferior functionality. The other disadvantage to a raised fly is that that the tent is harder to pitch because the sides don't dictate the stake locations. Folks will say you can pitch the Soplex right to the ground - and indeed you can - but it's super small like this because it also drops the roof height by 8" or so. Much too small to be practical. So overall the X-Mid design isn't quite as light because it doesn't sacrifice weather protection and venting. It's a more well rounded shelter. You also mention space. Overall the X-Mid has substantially more headroom/volume than the Soplex because it has dual 46" peaks, rather than a 48" peak and a short 32" one. And importantly, the X-Mid peaks are much further apart (~50" vs 30") so you have that tall height over much more of the tent. There is enough height to sit up anywhere inside the inner, rather than just near the pole in the Solplex. So it feels like a much larger tent even if the floor is slightly smaller. Basically the X-Mid preserves that floor area almost all the way up, whereas the Solplex roof slopes down a lot more. The floor of the Solplex is a bit bigger at 30" x 89" rather than 28" vs 86.5". However, because the X-Mid is a double wall design with full mesh separately you from the fly, you don't have to work about bumping the potentially wet fly, so you are more free to use the full area. The X-Mid inner does have space to store extra clothes and small items at the ends. In the diagram below a 20 x 72" pad is shown properly scaled in the tent.
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In terms of other differences, the Solplex is also much lighter. This isn’t because of the size nor geometry of the X-Mid, but rather because the Solplex uses DCF and is a single wall. Hypothetically, if you made a DCF single wall X-Mid it would be lighter than the Solplex because the X-Mid geometry is more efficient. I like DCF but it's a much more niche material. As you know, it wears out much faster than other materials and it's also bulky to pack. The silpoly used here has a much longer life due to far higher abrasion resistance and also packs much smaller. In terms of other differences, the X-Mid also had dual doors, the fly doors use tough #5 zips rather than fiddly clips, the mesh doors don't fall into the dirt so the zips last longer, a lot more vestibule area, two great peak vents (large, struts, closable) rather than none, it’s modular (you can use just the fly or inner tent), no pole in the way of the door, a lot more headroom, double wall protection and a much simpler pitch with 4 stakes and no guylines instead of numerous stakes and guylines. Overall these two tents aren't really that comparable because the Solplex is a single wall and uses DCF which makes it much more of a niche tent. Even if the Soplex used the same material as the X-Mid and used a double wall design, the X-Mid would still be a much more well rounded tent (e.g. stronger performance in any weather conditions) due to the aforementioned functional advantages.
(Edited)
Dec 8, 2018
tanyacwood
27
Dec 12, 2018
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dandurstonI am in awe of the time you took to make that response. That’s extraordinary.
Dec 12, 2018
junkiegear
3
Dec 16, 2018
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dandurstonPlease make a 1P single wall DCF X-Mid!!! I and so many other gram weenies will buy it in a heartbeat! Hell, we'll fund your 1st production run in advance via prepayment! DCF tents may be niche, yes, but there is probably a bigger pool of buyers out there than you might think. Others like TarpTent with their upcoming Aeon are trying to soak up this demand. Seems innovative but I'm not a fan of what I see as a fiddly strut system when it comes to packing the tent into size that will fit a small pack. People bemoan that Zpacks axed their Hexamid even though it has so little interior space. The Plexamid has what I think is a fundamentally flawed double crisscrossed carbon fiber rod peak design. The rods literally saw into each other at 2 spots whenever wind blows, guy lines are tightened, or the tent otherwise moves, which seems ripe for catastrophic failure in the field. I returned mine. Six Moon Designs seems to have found an offshore contract manufacturer to outsource production of their DCF Deschutes and Haven, but they seem to be having teething issues. Their first run of Deschutes have serious seam and reinforcement tape peeling issues. Tape at 2 of the corner tie outs, snaps, and random places all over either are starting to peel or are peeled up to 25% on my Deschutes that arrived yesterday. Needless to say, this is going back. So 6MD is trying to innovate on the production side of things by outsourcing to ultimately soak up some of this DCF demand. So I revert back to the Solplex as my main 1P shelter whose flaws you point out so eloquently. However, I have yet to find a lighter 1P fully enclosed shelter without fiddly struts or rods. I think there are alot of us around waiting and hoping for someone like you to offer us a better fully enclosed 1P DCF shelter. Our credit cards are ready!
Dec 16, 2018
dandurston
5116
Dan Durston
Dec 16, 2018
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junkiegearI want to do this so bad. It's going to be awesome but it'll be a while. I think we'll be able to get the design refined enough to do a presale around the summer but it's hard to say. I've got all the design drawings done and we are working on finding someone to build it. It looks like the same folks that are building the DCF tents for Big Agnes are going to be able to do that. That factory has been working closely with Dyneema Corp. on bonding methods so they have the seam technology dialed in, but of course I'm going to use 0.5oz DCF not the crazy 0.3oz stuff that Big Agnes is doing. It's going to be so awesome. With the dual pole layout, the X-Mid geometry is more efficient than the Solplex/Plexamid/Aeon/Deschutes (e.g. fewer seams, better surface area:volume ratio, fewer stakes and guyouts, no need for struts). As a general principle, I don't think it's wise to start adding struts to make up for a lack of volume when you could just use your second trekking pole. If you add the second pole and still want more space, then maybe add struts. The current design for the X-Mid 1P DCF will be lighter than the Plexamid, quite a bit more storm resistant, and quite a bit more spacious both in terms of floor area and headroom. I emailed Massdrop yesterday urging them to push this forward so hopefully we can get rolling with the prototyping.
Dec 16, 2018
Tullochgorum
15
Dec 17, 2018
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dandurstonYes - the ability to bring the fly down to the ground is vital in a big wind. In the UK and Scandinavia, these American designs with short flies are pretty much unknown - you won't see this on a Hille or a Vango. I'd never use a short fly above the treeline - even if it didn't blow away it would likely flap like crazy. The original TT Scarp had a short fly, which seemed illogical on a shelter designed to be robust. After feedback from UK customers they produced a "European" version with a full fly and it performed much better for a minimal weight penalty. So now it's the only version they offer.
Dec 17, 2018
Greg2
86
Dec 17, 2018
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dandurstonSummer pre-sale works if you can hit spring 2020 delivery. The only risk in a DCF x-mod not being a success is manufacturing quality risk and it sounds like you plan to use an experienced group to resolve that risk. my credit card is also waiting.
Dec 17, 2018
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