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Showing 1 of 1466 conversations about:
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 1, 2017
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Hello friends, welcome to our latest Massdrop collaboration announcement! From our first conversation with Fang, we wanted to work on an accessible priced, open back, planar driver headphone, based on the HE-400 line (HE-4, HE-400, HE-400i, HE-400S, etc). Initially, the conversation wasn’t going anywhere, but following the success of the HE-350 and RE-00, we started to make progress. In the year since those launches, we’ve worked closely with the team at HIFIMAN to develop the 4XX, based on the related Massdrop community activity. Here are some of the parts I’m most excited about:
HIFIMAN Planar Drivers - This is the tech that put HIFIMAN on the map. When reviewing planar magnetic headphones, most people talk about the speed of the driver and the low frequency “slam”. Speed (as a subjective term) generally creates a greater sense of realism; after you reach the point of diminishing returns on resolution, speed is (imo) going to have a huge impact on your experience. Through our collaboration, this technology is available at an all time low cost of $169.99. Focus-A Earpads - Earpads have a massive impact on the sound, and an even bigger impact on the comfort of the headphone. Unfortunately, we often have to compromise here, choosing a less comfortable earpad because it results in better acoustic performance. Focus-A pads are universally regarded as incredibly comfortable. Soft velour is the only material that contacts your skin, and the foam inside is soft to match.
New Headband + Colorway - Where HiFiMAN’s original headband design had some structural challenges (heavy materials, small contact points), they had a stylistic elegance few would debate (unless you’re a Float fan, then you get to complain). In working on this collaboration, we were able to bring back the original headband structure, while solving the construction problems cited in Massdrop discussions. The colorway is new as well, featuring midnight blue earcups with black accents throughout. Thanks for your interest and feel free to respond here with questions. That said, if the answer to your question is clearly stated in the description, I will apply a 10 day shipping delay to your next Massdrop order (jk but please read, our team spends tons of time making the descriptions as useful as possible).
This has been a great project and we’re excited to finally make the announcement : )
Aug 1, 2017
jdeoxys
235
Aug 1, 2017
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Will Do these use the 400i driver, 400S driver, or something else entirely?
Aug 1, 2017
JacobR34
17
Aug 1, 2017
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jdeoxysI have the 400s and the photo showing the planar structure looks identical to mine so I'd say 400s drivers.
Aug 1, 2017
ahanuban
3
Aug 1, 2017
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jdeoxysDefinitely interested in hearing the answer to this. I have the HE400S and love them but build quality is not great. If these use the same driver I will definitely consider it.
Aug 1, 2017
The_Jniac
322
Aug 1, 2017
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jdeoxysLooks to be 400i. Same impedance and Sensitivity.
Aug 1, 2017
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 1, 2017
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jdeoxysPer our agreements with HIFIMAN, there is a limited level of information we can share regarding the drivers. What I can say is, they hit our acoustic goals and they don't want us to talk about how. Take that for whatever you please, but we'll be posting FR graphs on the description shortly.
Aug 1, 2017
Astral_Abyss
84
Aug 1, 2017
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jdeoxysI'm going to say it's the 400i driver. The specs for the 4XX and 400i are both 35ohm, 93dB sensitivity, and even have the same Focus A pads. The 400S is 28ohm, 98dB, and velour pads.
Aug 1, 2017
Heefty
1387
Aug 1, 2017
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Will@Will, Are the transaction servers ready for this one? I'm not going to be incredibly happy to repeat my experience with the HD6xx first drop.
Aug 1, 2017
luvmusik
120
Aug 1, 2017
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Will@Will Exciting new product. Since HiFiMan offers the 400"i" and 400"s" sets currently selling, can you please tell us how these new MassDrop HE4XX sound differently from each of those two models, with as much sound description as possible please ? With 3 model choices, it can help many sort it out soundwise in deciding between models. Thank you.
Aug 1, 2017
Vigrith
4081
Aug 1, 2017
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WillWhilst @Petronas44 clearly has the wrong idea regarding how to go about this I'd like to pose the "problem" differently - two points to note before all else:
1. I love the way (most) Hifiman headphones sound. 2. I tend to dislike/disagree with the way they conduct their business and treat their customers.
Without going into too much detail, I as well as many others know Hifiman's had a few shortcomings when it comes to community outreach and customer care (the Susvara thing, the HEK thing, the other thing...), Dr. Fang is perfectly aware of this himself too - not telling people what drivers are inside the headphones they are trying to sell is really not the way I'd personally handle the situation. I'm sure plenty will still sell, hell I might buy a pair myself even though I own much higher end HFM headphones already, but still I feel like there is a lack of openness when it comes to their dealings a lot of the time.
I personally wouldn't go as far as saying they're shady, I've yet to be disappointed with their products (though some are not for me), but there is something about the whole dealio that people will feel irked by and for good reason. Would I like to know what kind of driver is inside of the headphones I'm buying? Yes. Do I need to? Not really.
If you can't get that information for your clients that's up to you, as said I personally don't mind much, I just think it may reflect poorly on both companies even if sales are left unaffected. Might be worth considering/debating with Dr. Fang and/or the HFM team.
Aug 1, 2017
Heefty
1387
Aug 1, 2017
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VigrithIt could well be that they're not sending this information along due to caring for their existing customers. I've read numerous times on other drops (HD6XX anyone?) where people who just bought the full shebang get on here crying because they bought the full priced cans and then found the the exact same thing on Massdrop for a much better price.
As seems likely in this case, Imagine you just bought the HE400S for $300 then got on here and found that they were selling the exact same driver with a little different hardware for $170. I'd guess you'd be a little angry about that. Not necessarily the same thing as the HD650/HD6XX thing since there are clear differences between the HE4xx and the HE400S, but I think you can see my point.
Aug 1, 2017
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 1, 2017
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Petronas44I mean, maybe I'm trying to deceive the headphone community, or maybe our partner needed certain parts to hit our acoustic targets and wants to minimize backlash from their other retail partners.
Go back through every headphone collaboration we've launched and you'll see me explaining the details of the driver where our agreements allow for it. Interestingly, there are always people who make up their own stories. I'm particularly fond of the 50+ page discussion on Head-Fi around what driver is in the K7XX when we state in the first paragraph of the description that it's based on the K702 65th anniversary edition.
If you think I'm a bamboozler, that's up to you, but the historical evidence would suggest otherwise.
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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VigrithI didn't say hifiman are shady it's massdrop hiding behind companies saying hifiman won't let them give out to much info that's the shady part you don't think so great throw your money away
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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HeeftyThe 400s and I both have the updated headband this is old stock so there's your price difference and by the way I bought the real hd650 instead of 6xx willingly along with k712 over k7xx and paid more money for both if People want to cry about pricing thats there problem I highly doubt this is why information is being hidden or else it would have been the case with all there other collaborations but they didn't they gave away driver info because it's necessary I don't care about price but I sure would like to know what I'm buying
Aug 1, 2017
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 1, 2017
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VigrithHey Vigrith, thanks for your post! This is a great summary of the issue. Essentially it came down to a situation where we could pick two of these three things: hit the target price, hit the target sound, disclose what model the driver is based on.
We picked the two we felt would result in the best offering for the community. Is it perfect? no. I'd like nothing more than to share details on every part (we spend tons of time solving these hard problems with our partners and can rarely talk about it, kinda sucks) of our collaborations, but to make these releases possible, we have to compromise.
Responses like yours help the issue. By summarizing it in a civil fashion, you've created a post we can share with HiFiMAN and try to convince them it's worth the risk of sharing. I've gotta run to a meeting but thanks again!
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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VigrithThink I might have replied to the wrong person but sry for the confusion I don't think hifiman are being shady I posted that about massdrop hiding behind hifiman as a company to not show us the info. And if it really was hifiman that doesn't want specs shown there would be a dam good reason for it think about it it's not just because price difference because these are not 400i or s look at the headband.
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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WillHello FRIENDS deception ENGAGE!!!!!
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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WillNo you didn't description was about k7xx driver info we took what everyone liked about the k701 k702 65th anniversary and k712 and put that all into one headphone, which was laughable joke
Aug 1, 2017
gb21011971
159
Aug 1, 2017
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Petronas44Can you please use proper punctuation? This word salad is really hard to read.
Aug 1, 2017
AudioNinjaphile
36
Aug 1, 2017
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VigrithWell said.
Aug 1, 2017
Quigimon
37
Aug 1, 2017
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Petronas44Never hear of a non disclosure agreement? In instances like these an infraction to that agreement can end in punitive damages including but not limited to inability to cooperate with massdropin the future. If it's a good manufacturer, we lose. Yes it's $170. Sure it would be nice to know exactly what you're getting. But if they said they can provide you with what they can; pushing the envelope on the matter isn't going to get more information.
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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gb21011971Can you please [moderated] in [moderated] thank you
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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QuigimonYea just like pushing the envelope on the price of the hd6xx wasn't going to get it lowered oh wait it did work and tons of people saved 50 dollars so don't be a sheep and complain until you get what's right
Aug 1, 2017
Quigimon
37
Aug 1, 2017
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Petronas44Are we talking specs or price? Help me out here.
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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QuigimonJust specs
Aug 1, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 1, 2017
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QuigimonReally I don't even want the specs myself I know I don't want these I think it's bullshit to tell a customer oh I can't tell you if these are just another headphone that you already own or dislike wrapped up in an uglier package, that's the fucked up part of this
Aug 1, 2017
bharker
78
Aug 1, 2017
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HeeftyThey made a post about upgrading their infrastructure since the first HD6XX drop. The second drop went without a hitch.
Aug 1, 2017
Quigimon
37
Aug 1, 2017
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Petronas44I get it but also working in spec sensitive departments where NDA's are a thing. They are usually strong enough to discourage breeching. Essentially at those points a lawyer is required to walk the tightrope of the terms. Obviously bringing in a lawyer any time there's a question isn't feasible. So the usual best course of action is a safety net of little if any disclosure. It sucks but in these situations I just avoid the unknowns and keep searching for the deals. It's a gamble, could miss a great deal or could dodge a disaster.
Aug 1, 2017
RShack
180
Aug 1, 2017
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WillI don't think you're a bamboozler... but you must admit it would be a great handle... maybe The Great Bamboozler? If nothing else, it would do wonders for your legend ;-)
Aug 1, 2017
Derhosenstein
17
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44The last sentence says it all . I want to know what I am buying. If the seller won't tell me it sends up a red flag. I don't think that is an unreasonable initial response. Intellectually I know you know that withholding information to sell a couple hundred lemons is really bad business so I don't think that is the reason. Talk to the manufacturer and ask them to let you release the information. If they say no I wouldn't do another drop with them.
Aug 2, 2017
Airosmithx
21
Aug 2, 2017
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WillWill they ship internationally?
Aug 2, 2017
Zimtron
23
Aug 2, 2017
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WillAnd you expect people to buy these based on that response?
What a joke.
Aug 2, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 2, 2017
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QuigimonWho are you a salesman for massflop it's very simple your going to sell something be clear about what it is would you buy a car if the salesman told you well the manufacture said I can't tell what engine it has or really anything except the other cars this manufacture makes are really just great!
Aug 2, 2017
audible
602
Aug 2, 2017
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hahaha yep! that's some high-functioning crazy skills right there.
Aug 2, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 2, 2017
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Never "threatened to quit" once before please show me were I have and by the way I did already but go try to do it yourself you can't just close your profile you have to put in for a request to close and I did do that right before I posted that and am still waiting for any email response so have nice night [moderated]
Aug 2, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 2, 2017
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[Removed]
Aug 2, 2017
Petronas44
236
Aug 2, 2017
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Clearly I'm trying to get them to respond quicker and delete my account info but until then [moderated]
Aug 2, 2017
audible
602
Aug 2, 2017
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It's like the death throes of a wounded animal. I hope Massdrop has the heart to put him out of his misery soon. poor little thing.
Aug 2, 2017
heysplangy
344
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44the only thing you are "disgracing" is yourself if that's even possible anymore.
Aug 2, 2017
NeverPaySticker
8
Aug 2, 2017
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WillIs there any sizing info you can share? I'm looking at the headband and concerned with the adjustable size. The Sennheiser HD5xx - 6xx line fits within the last two notches on me personally.. but it's hard to tell the sizing of this Hifiman one. I'd hate to buy these and have the cans sitting out at a 45 degree angle on either side of my head because they won't reach. ha
Aug 2, 2017
Heefty
1387
Aug 2, 2017
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bharkerThe second drop wasn't nearly as popular. The initial price was offputting enough that it trickled at the start as opposed to the first where 5000 units sold out in a matter of minutes. I'm expecting this drop to be popular as well.
Aug 2, 2017
staticoverdub
12
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44If you found your way in here, then you must be able to find your way out.
Your concern has been addressed by a previous comment and the ignorant consumer rage is not flattering.
Sigh.
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44I have both of those and will gladly pay more for the real deal. I also like to know what I'm buying and what warranties I'll recieve. I don't have any Hifiman phones, but I've read good things about the 400s. I'd want that. I wonder how this compares to the Monolith 1060 and if it has had any affect on Hfm. Anyway, It looks like a nice phone for a good price.
Aug 2, 2017
dwane5
292
Aug 2, 2017
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Elsiddid u read the write up? 1 yr warranty
Aug 2, 2017
JimMorrisonsLiver
8
Aug 2, 2017
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Let him have his opinions. Nobody mentioned politics, so keep it civil (even though some people will try not to). Disagreements happen and it's okay.
Aug 2, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 2, 2017
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JimMorrisonsLiveropinions? he's not expressing opinions. He's just a vile, bitter loony trolling for attention. Politics? WTF are you even talking about?
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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QuigimonJust wait, they'll drop it again and if they dont, it wasn't good in the first place. I'm not getting up at 6am and then wait for bad Santa.
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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dwane5M1060 5 years.
Aug 2, 2017
gb21011971
159
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44No need to regurgitate in an open forum, but thank you for your suggestion to do certain things to myself. Given the apparent human physical limitations, this might be difficult to accomplish. However, judging from your abundantly revealed psychological profile, you might have ample experience in this field.
I made my earlier comment, because I truly think your comments are incomprehensible. Yes, sign of the times (I will heed JimMorrisonLiver's advice not to get political), but if you want others to take you seriously, then you have to stop the verbal incontinence.
Cheers
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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DerhosensteinUnfortunately, I've seen this before. Deals with the devil and the devils in the details or lack of. I do think md thinks they are bringing a great deal to the table. They can't possibly forsee all the issues, which I'm sure can be disheartening. Live and learn. I guess people want to know what they are buying. Who knew.
Aug 2, 2017
Quigimon
37
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44An incredible accusation, however I am not. It's really simple. Don't like it don't buy it. They don't tell you what it is. Don't buy it. Don't want to gamble a purchase for an unknown item. Don't buy it. As the mod said, it falls within their specs for concideration. Not good enough, don't buy it. It really can't get much more simple than that. But showing your ass for the community to see because the mod wouldn't accommodate your request. That's comedy right there. Thank you for accommodate fun and interesting thread.
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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WillCivil this time.
Aug 2, 2017
Quigimon
37
Aug 2, 2017
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ElsidI mean this is a place for deals. Sometimes there are sacrifices to the product to accommodate these prices. The irony here is that massdrop acts as an intermediary purchase agent. The polls guage interest. Then m/d calls the manufacturer and says I can drum up an order for X quantity of product. What options do we have. They use that purchasing power to bring us items they think we might enjoy. Through that purchasing power we get to enjoy deals on products that may be amazing or may be crap. But wither way your still not usually paying full price for it.
Aug 2, 2017
gasmaskdude
78
Aug 2, 2017
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WillHi Will, thank you and mass drop for setting up this drop, please ship internationally. Pleeaaassseeee (UAE and others deserve t too).
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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QuigimonBelieve me, your paying full price. Either in quality or wait time. Everybodys making plenty of money. The real issue here is that this is like buying the bluebox surprise thingy and no one wants to be surprised,especially if you already own it. Maybe they should have stuck it in a bag and said this is our $169.99 Xmas surprise. That could be fun. Anyways, kinda entertaining reading some guy go crazy. Maybe he's had a glass of wine and gone to bed. Or maybe it was too much wine. Hopefully he'll feel better tomorrow. Peace.
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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Personally insulting someone who has a valid point, only aggrevates.Thats kinda looney.
Aug 2, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 2, 2017
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ElsidPhht. When that clown has a point valid enough to warrant his bile, I'll let you know.
Aug 2, 2017
Rejjy
1
Aug 2, 2017
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WillAny idea whether shipping will be available to Singapore? And if so, will it be affordable?
Aug 2, 2017
simon--poole
57
Aug 2, 2017
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VigrithIt could also potentially be a new driver intended for use in other products in future, so they don't want to harm sales of those products.
Aug 2, 2017
Vigrith
4081
Aug 2, 2017
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Elsidhttp://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/massdrop-x-hifiman-he4xx-measurements-and-impressions.4815/
Read this thread. If you don't know Marv then I guess you have no reason to believe him but I do. I agree HFM should divulge the driver but I also have no issue believing this will be a good pair of headphones for the price.
Aug 2, 2017
Adamus
1
Aug 2, 2017
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JacobR34It is very likely to be old classic he-400 driver...
Aug 2, 2017
dwane5
292
Aug 2, 2017
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Elsidsounds like they corrected the design flaws of the 400 line. if u take care of headphones they will outlive u. but i get you 5years is better than 1. but 1 is better than nothing
Aug 2, 2017
Kresterz
9
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44@petronas44 Why be such a big cynic? If you don't want them then don't buy them
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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dwane5True, it looks like a good deal. Whatever the driver is, your probably get your $170s worth.
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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VigrithThanks, looks good. I looked at the 650 comparison graphs and they look good. I think folks would get their $170 worth, especially if they've never had planar before.
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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MotorradThere you go again.
Aug 2, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 2, 2017
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ElsidThat's so cute that you are so excited about headphones now!
Aug 2, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 2, 2017
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MotorradIsn't it? Sometimes a little research can change your mind. I'm glad when others can get something they can enjoy at a good price. Someone made a good point:"This could be a new driver". In which case, if it were, you would be one of the first. Wow! Open minds continue to learn. Peace.
Aug 2, 2017
Philimon
59
Aug 2, 2017
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WillHIFIMAN is known for their shady marketing and pricing tactics, and their lack of control quality. But$170 is probably competitive here as far as sound quality, so good deal.
Aug 2, 2017
geemoneybe
118
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44Flagging this. English may not be your first language, or there is another issue, which is fine and understandable. What isn't is that sort of language.
Aug 2, 2017
Will888
119
Aug 2, 2017
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geemoneybeI agree his comments about HiFiMAN is unwarranted.What shady marketing are you talking about?.
Aug 2, 2017
gardibolt
11
Aug 2, 2017
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VigrithI have the 400S and while I'd be interested in trying out a Massdrop 400i (despite the Massdrop 350), I can't see any point to a 4XX if it's the same as the 400S; I can only wear one pair of headphones at a time.
Aug 2, 2017
Vigrith
4081
Aug 2, 2017
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gardiboltThey're not the same, at the time of my post that wasn't known yet (to me at least) but now it is, read more about it here;
http://superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/massdrop-x-hifiman-he4xx-measurements-and-impressions.4815/page-3#post-153979
Would it be worth buying if you already own the 400S? Questionable, that's up to you, all I mean to illustrate is that they're not identical drivers to any of the ones in HFM's current production models.
Aug 2, 2017
CoffeeOtt
5
Aug 2, 2017
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Petronas44What...are you talking about? The HD6XX are blue 650s. that price difference, first off is over a hundred dollars. Get off whatever beats inspired high horse you're on and stop eating paint chips man. Let people have things.
Aug 2, 2017
geemoneybe
118
Aug 2, 2017
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Will888The one where s/he tells gb21011971 to "go f_ck" his or her self in their "diseased a_hole". Sure seemed inappropriate to me... 23 hr mark. I replied directly to it, not sure why my comment ended up down here.
Aug 2, 2017
gardibolt
11
Aug 2, 2017
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VigrithThe 400S are really quite wonderful for classical music; nice soundstage and detailed sound. I did a shootout on head-fi of a number of mid-fi headphones on classical music and the 400S came out the winner with the most lifelike sound overall. Among those it beat out were the Oppo PM-3 and the AKG/Massdrop K7XX. If the 4XX is anything like that this is an insanely good deal.
Aug 2, 2017
Heefty
1387
Aug 2, 2017
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WillCare to share what the acoustic goals were?
Aug 2, 2017
CoffeeOtt
5
Aug 3, 2017
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Hah, it's like a YouTube comment. B*tch Lasagna and all that
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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MotorradWhat makes you an expert? I've read your stuff. Always picking a fight over some ones opinion. You want to show me some more pictures. I'm sure they will impress. I dont judge people by the content in their home, I judge them by the context of their character.
Aug 3, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 3, 2017
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ElsidHonestly just ignore him. That guy seems worse than Petronas44. At least Petronas is arguing for something, albeit in the wrong way. Motorrad is just looking to pick internet fights. Probably bored with nothing to do ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Aug 3, 2017
eguan88
19
Aug 3, 2017
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jdeoxyslooking at frequency response graph, it's likely to be a 400i driver.
Aug 3, 2017
Volly
328
Aug 3, 2017
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VigrithWell said mate!
Aug 3, 2017
Je_Saist
162
Aug 3, 2017
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WillI kind of wanted to step in and give my own take on how I'm reading this thread. I'm a few years removed from having considered myself an audiophile; most of my earned money goes to paying down medical bills for Glaucoma and a Nerve Injury. I'm not dropping hundreds of dollar's on high-end Oxygen chip sound cards; Via Envy mixers; or amps and subwoofers that can make the Earth quake from Teminite bass.
That being said; I try and keep an eye on what falls into my budget for audio products (e.g.; not a lot). Careful shopping netted me some Velodyne reference headphone's a while back; which I love to death. However, Velodyne's not making headset's anymore; and tender loving care can only keep well-worn headphones going for so long.
So yeah... I want a Planar Magnetic headset. I've never had one... I've heard a couple over the years including some from HifiMan... but the $250+ entry point for Planar Magnetic is just more than I can justify for something that is basically a luxury item.
So... let's say that these headphones from Massdrop ARE just a re-branded HE400i... that's still massively under HifiMan's MSRP of ~$450.... and still ~$70 off the current sale summer price from HifiMan's webpage ($250).
Let's say that Massdrop did get that $170 price-point by offering to solve some of the infrastructure problems in getting buyers the headsets. Let's say that Massdrop did get that $170 price-point by guaranteeing a minimum number of headphones sold.
Let's say that these are the worst headbands that HiFiMan had sitting around in their warehouse coupled with the worst driver's HiFiMan had sitting in their parts bins...
Let's say all of that was absolutely true.
Does it really matter to anybody actually buying here? Does it really matter to somebody who just wants to hear what a Planar Magnetic could sound like before investing hundreds of dollars?
No. No it doesn't.
Is it shady that Massdrop is not openly specifying what drivers are actually in these Massdrop-Made tagged headphones? As a buyer now invested; the potentially shady aspects did not matter one bit. I saw the proposed price-point that Massdrop was offering; browsed over to Amazon; and did a quick comparison of what $170 could get me there; and sure... I could in-fact beat the listed specifications that I knew about... by buying used.
I decided that this "Drop" was worth the risk to buy... even if it was the lowest performing product HifiMan had to offer; because it's still a better price-point even assuming the worst headband with the worst driver's HifiMan has to offer.
Aug 3, 2017
simon--poole
57
Aug 3, 2017
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Je_SaistI don't think people are arguing the value but the quality. With the QC issues from both Massdrop and HFM I'm not willing to purchase what looks like (I suspect) to be refurb OG HE-400 drivers, especially personally outside of the states making warranty returns a nightmare (like they aren't even there).
Aug 3, 2017
Je_Saist
162
Aug 3, 2017
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simon--pooleso... you're basically admitting... based on previous history... it's probably still no worse than buying a used or refurbished product off of Amazon.
And trust me; I've run into the no warranty returns issues buying cheap. $170 might be cheap for planar magnetic headphones; but that still is a LOT of money. It's quite a gamble.
Aug 3, 2017
simon--poole
57
Aug 3, 2017
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Je_SaistYes, and having bought "certified refurbished" from Amazon I've had to return 4/5. I imagine there will be second drop for these, so I'll wait for people's impressions. Or if the stock lasts long enough for some of the big reviewers (Jude, Marv) to post more detailed reviews. Frequency graph measurements from them look great but....yeah, QC.
Aug 3, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 3, 2017
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ElsidWhat makes me an expert? It's the internet! Haha. Even you can be an expert. Oh...and years of design and studio experience, but that shouldn't matter here. Phht. Picking a fight over someone's opinion? Pictures? Content of their home? Nah. Wrong guy. I'm the guy who makes a point of calling out sanctimonious aholes. If you are attempting to defend petronas, you are on the wrong side. Any opinion he may struggle to form does not warrant his vile remarks. Anyway, I think I had you confused as well. Not that I don't like to pick the occasional fight, but I do try to pick wisely. Petronas was a wise choice...and this goes across multiple topics.
Aug 3, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 3, 2017
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CoffeeOttMaybe it wasn't obvious but in the specific comment you replied to, he's using the second drop off the hd 6xx to further his point. What he said was, through community backlash, we were able to reduce the price of the second he 6xx drop from 250 to 200 so if there was enough backlash on the hifiman 4xx, maybe we could get hifiman to allow massdrop to disclose driver details.
Aug 3, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 3, 2017
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TanvirK175In the wrong way...that's really the point...and yeah it was a bit personal over several forums with the petronas clown. Maybe you didn't catch that because his vile comments were removed by MD. Probably bored with nothing to do...right backatcha! heh.
Aug 3, 2017
OldTomBombadil
8
Aug 3, 2017
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WillCan these be balanced driven?
Aug 3, 2017
MrBreakfst
66
Aug 3, 2017
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OldTomBombadilI find it hilarious that this post is in this thread. An upvote for you!
Aug 3, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 3, 2017
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MotorradWell yes, you definitely have a point to be made. I did notice the comments were removed and if things like "go fuck yourself" are actually allowed was discussion, I can only imagine it was something very derogatory and definitely uncalled for. But eventually you just have to step up and be the bigger man. Petronas has a lot to learn in the art of debate and I completely understand his point but his delivery was way off. I've read all the comments so yeah you're right haha! I was up through the night cause I couldn't fall asleep and so I read through all the comments on this post so I could see if these were worth it. Ultimately I decided not to purchase since I have the 6xx's coming in near the same time. I'll wait til user reviews are out and the second drop before considering purchasing again. My main reason for telling Elsid to ignore you though is because you seemed to take the heat from your discussion with Petronas and also aimed it at her. Very easy to do while in a heated debate and an understandable mistake but it continued on for more than one comment. In my opinion, it seemed kinda aggressive. Just my two cents on the matter.
Aug 3, 2017
CoffeeOtt
5
Aug 3, 2017
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TanvirK175ohhh, I didn't catch on to that at all. Thanks for the clarification
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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CoffeeOttOops, I did it again. Sorry I replied to the wrong person. It happens,
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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TanvirK175Oops, Im sorry! That was meant for MOTORRAD.
Aug 3, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 3, 2017
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ElsidLmao no worries
Aug 3, 2017
OldTomBombadil
8
Aug 3, 2017
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MrBreakfstThanks! I do my best to avoid the shitposts altogether
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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MotorradWell, I diffenatly got confused between the lines, however, in the beginning of the blog, patronis? was upset and made some very valid points and then your initial comments to him were personal and really set him off. Maybe you have history with him. I dont know. Personal and demeaning comments are disrespectful to the whole community. ( Im also guilty).In writing, we can't see each others expessions or hear inflection in someone's voice. You dont really know me, and I dont really know you, so if we can keep personal comments out of the discussion and only comment on the deal at hand, it would run much smoother. People are allowed to have an opinion without being attacked. So, lets start over and keep it nice. Sincerely.
Aug 3, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 3, 2017
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ElsidHa. That was a bit pedantic but Ok...I assure you he was 'set off' long before any (justifiable) comments I may have made in his direction.
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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Je_SaistMaybe they arent divuldging the identity of the driver because it's new. It could be a test run on a new product. Then, we would really be the lucky winners. Awe, Isn't speculation fun?
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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gardiboltI read that. It was really good! If I remember correctly, you had a hugh amount of phones and quite a few people to listen. That must have taken a lot of time and dedication. Thanks!
Aug 3, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 3, 2017
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MotorradThat reply wasn't very convincing. I know I had run on sentences. I'm only trying to make Peace . I forget what pedantic means, so now I have to look it up. However, I'm sure it was another unnecessary personal statement. I will try no further. Spam.
Aug 3, 2017
sloowhand
25
Aug 3, 2017
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Petronas44" I really hope this site crashes and burns" Really dude? Sounds like someone needs a nap.
Aug 3, 2017
ElectronicVices
2937
Aug 3, 2017
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Petronas44Honestly it more than likely comes down to cannibalization of Hifimans current line up. They don't want to lose margin on their own line while people wait for the next drop to happen here. Same reason some company's straight up refuse to have sales. If people know they can wait and save money on something.... many will.
Aug 3, 2017
sloowhand
25
Aug 3, 2017
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Petronas44" Can you please go Fuck yourself in your diseased asshole thank you "
Again. Dude. You're getting way too emotional about a pair of headphones. Especially when you're not even going to buy them. Go lie down. You'll feel better after a nap.
Aug 3, 2017
hyp36rmax
169
Aug 3, 2017
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HeeftyThe price you pay is time. This is basically a crowd source production meeting an MOQ to fulfill the target price. If a person chose to buy an HE400 series set of cans then that's under their own discretion. It's really not any different to seeing a retail model go on sale 30 days after you bought it even if it is a large price cut. Although there are slight differences between the two HP's that we know of they should be happy to have a pair well in advance.
Aug 3, 2017
Audiam
8
Aug 3, 2017
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WillI own HE-500's (Amazing) and the previous Massdrop/HIFIMAN HE-350's(Meh), and am still buying these... it's $170.00... but, that said, I have a problem with buying audio equipment.
I'll probably end up giving these out as a gift to someone who I feel is a budding audiophile, but I NEED to hear what they sound like when compared to my HE-500's.
I am excited - Thanks for offering this drop!
Aug 3, 2017
Shure
68
Aug 3, 2017
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WillI think it's a very big mistake not to be transparent here , sends the wrong signal unless your more explicit and there's a really good reason!
Aug 3, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 3, 2017
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Lolwut. Did you really feel so threatened you needed to make a new account? Gg kid.
Aug 3, 2017
sloowhand
25
Aug 3, 2017
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Look dude. I know it makes you feel like King Baddass to tell people on the internet to "choke on a dick and lose your life" or whatever. I get that. But no one has any other reaction than to sigh and roll their eyes at you. Because we all know that you would never say this things like that to people in real life. You probably don't say much of anything to real people. Comments like yours just demonstrate to anyone reading them that you probably get picked on a lot. You probably get bullied a lot and this is your way of getting back at the world. Again, I get that. But you're really not doing yourself any favors. You're just making it worse for yourself because you're just reinforcing in your own head that this is the only way you can feel like a tough guy which makes you feel even weaker in the real world and makes you permanently angry. This isn't going to help you make friends. This isn't going to help you get a girl to like you. It's just going to drive them further away. Work on yourself and being a better person and that will make people like you. Good luck. I wish you the best.
Aug 3, 2017
sloowhand
25
Aug 3, 2017
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Yeah, that's kinda my whole point. You're not pissing anyone off. At most you get a sigh and an eye roll. And why would you so much effort into pointlessly pissing off strangers on the internet? You are clearly a very lonely person. I wish you well.
Aug 3, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 3, 2017
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You would think parents would think twice about giving their 12 year old a computer without parental guidance. Sigh...
Aug 3, 2017
MikeyBikey
50
Aug 4, 2017
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JacobR34The response curves look just like the 400S to me ... http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE400S.pdf but physically in the body of the old 400 with the new cables.
search

search
Aug 4, 2017
Supersport
36
Aug 4, 2017
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Petronas44Yup. shady for sure That they can't talk about the driver used. No info. No money.
Aug 4, 2017
audible
602
Aug 4, 2017
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Welcome back Petronas!
Aug 4, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 4, 2017
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Elsidjeez. I thought we were laughing at ourselves now. All I meant was that you don't really have to explain yourself to me. I get it. Peace was made. In other news...Petronas is back... with a vengeance. Still trying to figure out this business about me posting photos of stuff I own...
Aug 4, 2017
Motorrad
2898
Aug 4, 2017
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Yes, Petronas, that makes sense. Please go on about all these pictures of "stuff I own", it's VERY fascinating.
Aug 4, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 4, 2017
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MotorradCool. I dont know. Some confusion. Well, it looks like the phones are selling pretty good. I look forward to the reviews. Off topic: Anyone going to totality for the solar eclipse? I think we're going to Tennessee for a couple of days. 8/21 . Should be like a massive Woodstock within a 70 mile radius from the west coast to the east coast. Wear your glasses!
Aug 4, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 4, 2017
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sloowhandBooze or drugs. Detox and rehab.
Aug 4, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 4, 2017
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sloowhandCouldn't piss off a fire hydrant. Sad Dog.
Aug 4, 2017
PolygonBronson
195
Aug 4, 2017
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WillOkay, Will, I have a serious question that at least a few of us are wondering. It has nothing to do with the driver. I know you get a lot of comments but I would really appreciate it if you could clear this up. Are the HE4XX going to ship with the Focus Pads or the Focus Pads-A? The description and your comments say Focus Pads-A but the photos show the Focus Pads. The thread on Super Best Audio Friends says that the Focus Pads-A sound different than the regular Focus Pads which is why I'm asking. Thanks! :)
Aug 4, 2017
TanvirK175
1101
Aug 4, 2017
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PolygonBronsonAccording to Tyll Hertsens review on InnerFidelity, they use the Focus Pads-A and he says they drivers most resemble the HE400i. https://www.innerfidelity.com/content/massdrop-x-hifiman-he4xx-planar-magnetic-headphones
Aug 4, 2017
ebjred
53
Aug 4, 2017
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PolygonBronsonUnrelated, but that Super Best Audio Friends thread went to crap. What an embarrassing conversation.
Aug 4, 2017
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 4, 2017
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WillHey Folks, replying here for visibility. The HE4XX uses Focus A pads. It looks like the sample we were provided for photography had the standard Focus pads. The difference in sound is small, with most measurements I've seen showing a difference around 4k, with Focus A pads coming in ~1-2db lower than standard Focus pads. Thanks for your patience with this unnecessary confusion.
Aug 4, 2017
yoda709
34
Aug 4, 2017
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NeverPayStickeryou must have a massive head :p
Aug 4, 2017
WhichwaydidheGo
285
Aug 4, 2017
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ElsidI live here. We are having a party
Aug 4, 2017
NeverPaySticker
8
Aug 4, 2017
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yoda709You have to deal with the hand you are dealt. Or head in this case. haha
Aug 4, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 4, 2017
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WhichwaydidheGoYour funny. Must be into the good stuff now or just had a nap. You did have some valid points. It all just got a little to aggressive with many people. Keep cool. Peace.
Aug 4, 2017
WhichwaydidheGo
285
Aug 4, 2017
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ElsidYou seem to have gotten the replies mixed up. But that's fine. I was talking about having a party for the eclipse. I'm really looking forward to it.
Aug 4, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 4, 2017
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WhichwaydidheGoOops! Sorry about that. I thought you were the guy who keeps making new accounts, so as to be in cognito. The Eclipse! Gonna be awesome. Your lucky to already be in totality. We're about an hour away. Pray for clear skys. We might have to take the backroads. I'm not sure how the traffic might be. I think I'll wear my Einstein t-shirt. I'm glad people now know that it's not the end of the world and we're not being punished for our sins.LOL! They say during totality that the brightness will be that of a full moon. Cool. Enjoy!
Aug 4, 2017
WhichwaydidheGo
285
Aug 4, 2017
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ElsidYep. I'm wondering just how busy it will be. It is the middle of the day on a Monday.
Aug 4, 2017
Philimon
59
Aug 4, 2017
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simon--pooleJude? No. He is pure shill.
Aug 4, 2017
RShack
180
Aug 4, 2017
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Aug 4, 2017
RShack
180
Aug 4, 2017
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WillYou're listed as "Custom Products". Do you mainly do audiophile-like things, or other kinds of stuff too? Regardless, that sounds like a great job to me... even if you do have to put up with some of the no-class idiots who seem to enjoy polluting this place.
If you want to get into heaven, I think getting us some new-and-improved ATH-like Leatherhead's would do the trick. I'm sure it's unlikely, but is it impossible?
Aug 4, 2017
jefe32
149
Aug 4, 2017
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JimMorrisonsLiverLOL yep. I didn't think any other Massdrop comment section could get worse than the Mojo one...and then I checked this one.
Aug 4, 2017
Elsid
697
Aug 4, 2017
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WhichwaydidheGoI'm finding out that a lot of hotels are booked. Still, totally worth it. I hope you have a great time! Get some good pictures of the Eclipse spattering through the leaves of trees. If you take a map and put a hole through it where you are located, you can get a picture of yourself holding the map with hole location and the Eclipse will shine it's progress on the ground through the hole. I hope I descibed well enough to be understood. Anyways, heres to realitivity! Oh yeah, um, buy headphones.( thought I should make this realevant.) If you put a hole through 4xx you can listen to music and watch the eclipse on the ground.( was that good?)
Aug 4, 2017
Derhosenstein
17
Aug 5, 2017
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sloowhandJust leave it alone sloohand, it's over.
Aug 5, 2017
eguan88
19
Aug 5, 2017
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MikeyBikeyThe Curve is more like 400i and the drive is 400i too.
HE-400 Frequency response: 20Hz to 35 KHz Sensitivity: 92.5 DB Impedance: 35 Ohm
HE-400s Frequency Response : 20Hz – 35KHz Sensitivity : 98dB Impedance : 22 Ohms

HE-400i Frequency Response: : 20Hz-35KHz Sensitivity : 93dB Impedance : 35 Ohms

HE-4xx Frequency response: 20 Hz–35 kHz Sensitivity: 93 dB Impedance: 35 ohms
Aug 5, 2017
meir
2
Aug 5, 2017
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eguan88 8/5000 The weight, too
Aug 5, 2017
ElectronicVices
2937
Aug 7, 2017
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AudiamAs an HE500 owner I almost picked these up out of curiosity... I have a couple pairs of planars but neither were below $350 in price so curious to hear your thoughts.
Aug 7, 2017
beyondBp
6
Aug 7, 2017
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WillReally exciting stuff happening recently. BUT WE NEED THE NFB-11 to come to Massdrop. Make it happen already! :p
Aug 7, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 8, 2017
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eguan88I do not see the correlation from he-400i to he-4xx in the graphs.
Aug 8, 2017
eguan88
19
Aug 8, 2017
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kltp567Here's check out the graphs for 400, 400i, and 400s, The 4xx graph is most resemble the 400i, there are some minor variance probably due to different ear cup and mesh filter.

https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE400.pdf
https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE4002014.pdf
https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE400S.pdf
Aug 8, 2017
horseman612
31
Aug 8, 2017
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beyondBpHeck with that - give me the NFB-28.38! :D
Aug 8, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 9, 2017
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eguan88I saw the measurements comparison on a certain forum and I do not see the resemblance of the HE-4xx to the HE-400i.
Aug 9, 2017
Will888
119
Aug 9, 2017
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kltp567I agree...if the charts are like the 400i I be part of this drop,if its more like the original 400's Im out.
Aug 9, 2017
eguan88
19
Aug 10, 2017
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kltp567I doubt hifiman would R&D a new drive for the drop.
Aug 10, 2017
dwane5
292
Aug 10, 2017
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eguan88based on what? a lot of the massdrop exclusives involved a tweak or 3. the only one advertised as the same would be the HD650 to the HD6XX
Aug 10, 2017
The_Jniac
322
Aug 11, 2017
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WillYour measurements differ from those posted by others. Which is representative of the actual performance of the product?
Aug 11, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 11, 2017
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The_JniacI think you should rely on the measurements made by Massdrop. They made quite some Massdrop creation headphones so I think they are reliable. Measurements from big or trusted websites should also be good ones.
Aug 11, 2017
The_Jniac
322
Aug 12, 2017
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kltp567I am worried that you are right. I do not feel that there is any reason to buy a planar that rolls off as much as MassDrop's measurements show this to. The whole point of getting a planar, to me, is about getting that excellent bass linearity and extension, along with low distortion.
Aug 12, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 12, 2017
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The_JniacI think the frequency response measurements in the bass section is quite normal. Maybe I am wrong? I mean, every headphone that I saw had that kind of sub-bass roll-off measurements.
Aug 12, 2017
The_Jniac
322
Aug 12, 2017
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kltp567It is normal for lesser dynamics, but large-diaphragm planars are usually pretty close to ruler-flat from 1kHz down. Even some dynamics do better.
Aug 12, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 12, 2017
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The_JniacI went to look at the hd6xx measurements. The HE-4xx actually has better bass linearity from 250 hz then them up to 50hz. The bass starts to roll-off at 40hz, but you will not even noticeably hear much at that range.
Aug 12, 2017
The_Jniac
322
Aug 13, 2017
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kltp567The roll off starts at ~70Hz, not 40Hz. Roll-off is measured from where it begins to taper off, not where it drops below the baseline. The HD6XX are also a more linear headphone overall, though they have poorer distortion. The K7XX outperforms both in that area, although it is not quite linear, it has better extension thanks to its shallow roll off, and has comparable distortion.
Aug 13, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 14, 2017
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The_JniacRoll-off should only be considered when the frequency drops consistently below average.
Aug 14, 2017
Proven
9
Aug 18, 2017
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The_Jniac6XX or these? and why? I might get both.
Aug 18, 2017
mathees
89
Aug 18, 2017
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ProvenThe 6xx wont' be available again for a while
Aug 18, 2017
tessierpg
Aug 18, 2017
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matheesI wouldn't say that. There are 3500 add'l units which have not been sold on the HD6xx last drop. I would bet that another HD6xx drop is to be expected soon.
Aug 18, 2017
The_Jniac
322
Aug 18, 2017
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ProvenThat is a difficult choice, but the Sennheisers are the safe bet. The HD650 is rather famous for its warm, mellow sound. Unless you really like treble, the HD650/HD6XX are almost certain not to disappoint. I do recommend that you ignore the notion that they scale with upstream gear, since there is no actual science to support that. What the Hifiman do, is offer rather well extended bass, though not up to what a large-diaphragm planar should do, with low distortion. The distortion on the Sennheisers is part of what gives them their warmth, and gives their bass a bit of a fuzzy sound. The Hifimans will not have this, and will reproduce the bass cleanly, allowing you to rather easily correct their bass rolloff with EQ. That said, Hifiman is known to have issues with Quality Control and customer service. This is in stark contrast to Sennheiser being the gold standard with their dedicated store solely for replacement parts. I have HD600s, and am not terribly interested in buying a planar that does not extend linearly, so I will not be buying either. If you want more info, I suggest the Headphones and HeadphoneAdvice subreddits if you want more information. Before posting, be sure to read the rules. Good luck, and happy listening.
Aug 18, 2017
eguan88
19
Aug 19, 2017
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dwane5Pad and mesh filter is another method of tweak, just like how HD580 , 600, 650 uses same driver but different mesh filter to make sound a little different.
Aug 19, 2017
kltp567
60
Aug 20, 2017
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ProvenSennheiser hd6xx are a much more solid choice than this one because it has been released for a year already and has been reviewed by many many reviewers, some who are trusted by the community, who say it is good. Moreover, you do not know which driver is in these he-4xx. However, you might just try these and like the sound. From what I read from multiple online reviews about the hd650 which is the original headphones for which the 6xx is derived from, it seems to produce a tonal signature, that is to say bass heavy or not, mid heavy or not, or treble heavy or not, that a big number of audiophiles like.
Aug 20, 2017
beaucauchemar
41
Aug 22, 2017
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kltp567It's only a safer bet if the buyer prefers a warm sounding headphone. I was a part of the original 6XX drop and ended up selling mine since I felt that the sound was far too veiled compared to my K712 primary cans. Enough so that I constantly wondered what I was missing while listening to the Senns. I've also listened to the HE400i (which has been determined to have a similiar, if slightly more strident signature--chalk it up to the Focus pads perhaps) using the same gear and definitely preferred the 400i's sound over the 6XX/650.
Sure the 650s (and therefore the 6XX) are classics and well regarded, but with a giant *warm* grain of salt.
Aug 22, 2017
beaucauchemar
41
Aug 22, 2017
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I'm not sure if you've heard the 560s before, but based on the description (and my liking for the 400i) I thought I would love them. Turns out that after 2 weeks with a loaner set of 560s, I found them to be oddly bright (this coming from a K712 owner) with a weird peak at the lower treble. Needless to say I didn't find them to have superior resolution, imaging, or soundstage to the 400i and was kinda disappointed overall having gotten my hopes up. Basically, I'd strongly recommend you trying out a pair before spending the money if you haven't heard them yet.
Aug 22, 2017
Philimon
59
Oct 11, 2017
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Then you would be in the tiny minority of people who prefer the 400i over 650.
Oct 11, 2017
Philimon
59
Oct 11, 2017
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Your opinions are all your own, because nobody else would have them.
Oct 11, 2017
alvarg
235
Oct 21, 2017
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what do you mean are here?
Oct 21, 2017
BattlePanda
3
Oct 23, 2017
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It's the brand new "iplug" :-P
Oct 23, 2017
TWerk
5
Nov 29, 2017
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Petronas44Exactly.
Nov 29, 2017
spncrjcksn
1
Nov 29, 2017
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but still no punctuation . . .
Nov 29, 2017
Olsen
83
Nov 30, 2017
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WillBeeing in Scandinavian (Europe) I wonder why I get a promotion mail on these as I obviously can't order them beeing situated outside US..? I would love to purchase them, but can't ! MD, when will you create a European logistic terminal center to avoid silly custom taxes and reverse the fact we can't purchase some of your offerings ? Sure your turnover would expand by that excersise Mind you, we are in 2017, not 1967. Give a shout to your management please. Thanks !
Nov 30, 2017
simon--poole
57
Nov 30, 2017
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OlsenYeah, I feel like an EU warehouse/hub would really boost their sales. I for one would be willing to purchase stuff (last 2 drops I bought both arrived defective, and would have to ship them stateside again for replacement/repair...)
Nov 30, 2017
simon--poole
57
Nov 30, 2017
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PhilimonFor what it's worth, I do prefer my HE400s (+Focus A pads) over my (OG) HD650s for some styles of music.
Nov 30, 2017
Olsen
83
Nov 30, 2017
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simon--pooleSo these can be ordered outside US ?
Nov 30, 2017
simon--poole
57
Nov 30, 2017
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OlsenI just tried going through checkout (although not as far as ordering) and it seems like it. $15 for shipping to UK. Plus import taxes per your country, bear in mind. Plus shitty customer service/RMA hassle if there's any issues.
Nov 30, 2017
Olsen
83
Nov 30, 2017
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simon--pooleOk thanks I think I'll pass
Nov 30, 2017
simon--poole
57
Nov 30, 2017
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OlsenStandard HE400S aren't much more expensive in most countries, especially if you catch them on sale.
Nov 30, 2017
simon--poole
57
Dec 1, 2017
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Not if you're outside the US, unfortunately. Some of it is just unfortunate geography - RMA shipping is a lot more expensive, and slower for example. Plus, the US has much poorer warranty and replacement laws than the EU in general.
But part of it DOES come down to customer service - I was just bounced between Massdrop and the manufacturer for weeks with both of them saying the other should replace it. In the end I just gave up.
Dec 1, 2017
tmello56
6
Dec 2, 2017
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This is a terrible lie.
Dec 2, 2017
tmello56
6
Dec 2, 2017
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It's great you haven't had any issues but if you do just a little bit of research you'll learn your experience isn't normal. Both hifiman and massdrop are notorious for poor Quality Control and shit customer service.
Dec 2, 2017
tmello56
6
Dec 2, 2017
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No reason for insults, just correcting your misinformation.
Dec 2, 2017
tmello56
6
Dec 2, 2017
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Just saying your experience isn't normal and you're pretending like it is. You've even had issues with quality control and got lucky your issue was resolved quickly.
Dec 2, 2017
hyp36rmax
169
Dec 2, 2017
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tmello56This is anecdotal and will vary with everyone. I've had great support and experience with Massdrop most of the time, with the exception of one drop where communication was non-existent due to delays. This just comes with the territory when you're dealing with MOQ and world-wide shipping.
Dec 2, 2017
ikhan
80
Dec 7, 2017
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WillLost a few brain cells following this thread but I have faith that this is a good headphone, especially for $169 and free shipping. My friend has the K7XX, which are of solid quality, so Massdrop is certainly on the side of the consumer. Seems like people forget the context and expect a sub $200 planar to demolish everything without compromises.
Dec 7, 2017
Odinko
35
Dec 8, 2017
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jdeoxysI'd say they are closest to 400i. Specs look the same and the freq. response graph as well. ;)
Dec 8, 2017
Odinko
35
Dec 8, 2017
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Petronas44I can't comprehend how 81 ppl liked ur post...u need to chill...there is a thing called - contractual obligation. Of which u clearly have no clue... HiFiMan is the "boss" here, so f they say: "we will make the cans but u can't tell some things about them." This is what has to happen... However it's not something I completely agree upon, but the world is not black and white either, so going around and spitting, is not the way to go.
Dec 8, 2017
MarcSpence
180
Dec 10, 2017
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OdinkoThere is alot of chatter on these on headphone forums and its all pretty solid. This appears to be a winner and a great opportunity to get into planars for under 200.
Dec 10, 2017
Odinko
35
Dec 11, 2017
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MarcSpenceYe, checked some of them. However, I already own a pair of HE-400i and I have nothing bad to say about them. One note tho, the break-in period on mine was a really real thing here. The bass changed dramatically for the better after about a week, it was sounding really flat out of the box. ;)
Dec 11, 2017
Cyphre
2708
Dec 11, 2017
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OdinkoGood to know!
Dec 11, 2017
zippledippledoo
14
Dec 11, 2017
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OdinkoExactly the same for me. I owned a Beyerdynamic DT880 32 ohm with years of use on it and out of the box the 400i sounded "dead" in comparison-just flat. I felt like selling the 400i immediately. A week later (!) of running at moderate volume and the 400i improved substantially and became the better headphone everywhere - especially noticeable in the low frequencies. I have to say that my Hifiman's required a break in period - no fooling. I'd believe the same to be true of the HE4XX. After breaking in my 400i I then sold the DT880s! Lesson learned is don't sell the Hifiman's short until they're broken in/burned in/whatever it is that time spent playing them does.
Dec 11, 2017
MarcSpence
180
Dec 12, 2017
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OdinkoAgreed. It takes me a week or two for my ears to adjust to different sounds... imho, burn in is largely related to getting used to diff sound signatures :) I would think all the 400 series are similar and unless u have dozens of cans i would personally buy something else before buying 2 versions of 400 series I am already shopping for next pair of cans and i just got these and then there is the dac and amp rabbit hole..lol... one thing for sure, it nice that our products in this hobby get better the more we use them! Thanks for reply
Dec 12, 2017
DinoGerard
0
Dec 18, 2017
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WillHi Will, do these use the HE400i drivers? Thanks!
Dec 18, 2017
Heefty
1387
Dec 18, 2017
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DinoGerardHe can't comment on that due to contractual obligations, but I'll give you the big hint that everyone is basing the claim on: The measurements are almost identical to the HE400I.
Dec 18, 2017
DinoGerard
0
Dec 19, 2017
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HeeftyYup, just wanted to confirm. Thanks anyway! :)
Dec 19, 2017
austriandude
49
Dec 28, 2017
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Heefty..some others I saw are different ;) more bass with 4xx
Dec 28, 2017
Indyhill34
9
Jan 3, 2018
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We'll see about this. I ordered these (received today) and the left side has no signal. I contacted Massdrop and received a prompt e-mail telling me I needed to reach out to HiFiMAN regarding this and gave me their contact info and let me know what information would be needed for support. Hopefully HiFiMAN returns my e-mail promptly as well.
Jan 3, 2018
Olsen
83
Jan 4, 2018
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Indyhill34Good to know this, makes me definately out of MD untill they get their Europe logistic and warranty issues ready to customer satisfaction. I joined a Fostex and Sennheiser massdrop, sold on the Fostex and crossing fingers.. no issues will happen with HD6xx.
Its simply a dealbreaker too, that we need to pay tax/customs for products allready manufactured in Europe Add the issue one could face if warranty need to be used, another hassle expenses for shipping back for repair.
Funny MD still notify me even the products are not available to Europe ! Will they ever get things done right ?
If I need other headphones in future I'll go back to Thomann or buy local.
Goodbye MD
Jan 4, 2018
Sitomanvoy
68
Jan 15, 2018
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OlsenLoL
Jan 15, 2018
heysplangy
344
Jan 16, 2018
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Olsen'goodbye Olsen', said nobody...ever.
Jan 16, 2018
rslatara
287
Feb 14, 2018
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WillI want to buy but it is over....?
Feb 14, 2018
ShrinkySmurf
19
Feb 14, 2018
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WillCame back after my long work day, thinking about these, planning to buy, and it’s gone. Oh well. That’s life.
Feb 14, 2018
SooSunny
19
Feb 14, 2018
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RejjyShipping o Singapore is us$15.
Feb 14, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Mar 2, 2018
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ShrinkySmurfThey're BAaaaCK!!
Mar 2, 2018
ShrinkySmurf
19
Mar 2, 2018
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Assimilator702Thanx. Wow, and faster than expected. Jumped on it! Did not blink when I saw it this time.
Mar 2, 2018
KennyS
138
Mar 3, 2018
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WillHow do these sound compared to the Oppo PM-3? Those are the only other planar magnet headphones I’ve listed to. I know they are closed back and these ones are open so not apples to apples. Just wondering if anyone has any feedback of sound between the two? Thanks.
Mar 3, 2018
HwoALanG
133
Mar 3, 2018
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WillI keep reading reviewers saying bass isn't tight and punchy as it should be.. any plan to tweak bass since its still in manufacture processing???
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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HwoALanGIf you are look more then how the original sound ether apply bass setting or get a good Dec.
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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KennySIt sound open space punchy is abit different unlike dynamic driver are direct.
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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ShrinkySmurfWell it came back again join now.
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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Assimilator702Go and get it Now!
Mar 3, 2018
HwoALanG
133
Mar 3, 2018
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SooSunnyI guess i should wrote more specific
It Bottoms out at 20hz rather 10hz.... i dont think EQ can make that much difference... but who knows... i may have to try one...
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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HwoALanGWell you have to try different Dac to get to the one that you one sometime spec. on paper just can't tell them apart.
Mar 3, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Mar 3, 2018
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SooSunnyHa! I JUMPED on it within 10 minutes of the email yesterday. Wasn't missing out this time. I actually had a recurring nightmare last night that the HE 4xx was thin, frail and bassless. All I thought about was how much of a HUGE mistake I made buying these cheap ass flimsy, over-hyped crap cans. Hopefully it was just a nightmare. Does it count as buyers remorse?
Mar 3, 2018
The_Jniac
322
Mar 3, 2018
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Assimilator702I do not blame you. Even Massdrop's own measurements show that it cannot manage the usual flat line that is planar bass. Frankly, DT-880 Pros are better. Also better built, and with official replacement parts available.
Mar 3, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Mar 3, 2018
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The_JniacOh great. DT880 250 ohms is almost bassless compared to my Fostex TH-X00 Mahogany.Well if I don't like them it won't be difficult to make my money back plus a few extra $$$. I laugh when people put down headphones that have good bass response. If it's in the music it needs to be conveyed by the headphone. Have they ever heard a REAL speaker system or attended a live performance?
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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Assimilator702Ya, low ohm in Hexx character and compare low ohm in dynamic drive sound different even what ever the manufacturer say low ohm doesn't need Dac and claim that plug into any phone and wow la it must sound good but surely can drive only.
Mar 3, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 3, 2018
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Petronas44That how business man run his business.
Mar 3, 2018
Serboom
27
Mar 4, 2018
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SooSunnyYa, but a budget amp will do just fine, but you're right, you know, marketing..
Mar 4, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 4, 2018
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SerboomThanks for sharing.
Mar 4, 2018
plynn
5
Mar 5, 2018
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WillI understand your nondisclosure conditions, but it is tough to buy a pig in a poke. I will listen to the 400i much more happily than the 400s.
I broke my first pair of 400i the second day I had them. Might be my fault, but I've had headphones for 40 years and never broken a pair. The U-shaped plastic piece that holds the earcups to the headband snapped.
Mar 5, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 6, 2018
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plynnWell plastic don't stands in time.
Mar 6, 2018
dwane5
292
Mar 6, 2018
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SooSunnysennheiser does
Mar 6, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 10, 2018
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dwane5I do have a pair of sennheiser and the quality are very good.
Mar 10, 2018
SooSunny
19
Mar 10, 2018
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plynnEach individual are tune differently, listening perferanceare you have try the one to your liking.
Mar 10, 2018
SooSunny
19
Apr 2, 2018
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RejjyYes, us$15.
Apr 2, 2018
Justaway
133
May 4, 2018
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jdeoxysI compared the frequency response in the description with the frequency responses for the HE400i, HE400, and HE400s shown here: https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE400S.pdf https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE4002014.pdf (he400i) https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/HiFiMANHE400S.pdf The 4xx matches the closest with the 400s, both having a low end drop off starting around 70HZ, which is not that great for planar magnetic headphones. Personally I'd rather have the 400 or 400i as they have a solid flat freq resp down to 10hz.
May 4, 2018
Assimilator702
184
May 4, 2018
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SooSunnyThere are MANY different grades of plastic. Hopefully they picked a good one for this can.
May 4, 2018
MarcSpence
180
May 5, 2018
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Assimilator7024xx uses metal yokes....plastic yokes on 400 i/s and 560 are prone to cracks... my 560s cracked in 2 weeks. Fwiw i thought the 4xx was similar enough to my 560 that i didnt keep the 560 4xx scale well with amps.. imo, planars need power... give yourself 100 hours or so and i think you will find the 4xx to be great cans.. I love em!!! ...great build and sound. Take a lot at all the comments on head fi......i find them very euphonic, good base p, noce treble sparkle and little to no fatigue on marathon listening
May 5, 2018
eguan88
19
May 7, 2018
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JustawayGod knows how they managed to make 400i drive and tuned into 400s sound.
May 7, 2018
bloodpig
157
Jun 8, 2018
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Will Guys i have just receive my pair of cans and wen i plug them into my rig the right speaker starts to do this brr brr brrr sound like its grinding to something. Its like a static brr when the lows are hitting:( Is this is a defective pair or what ? Can i fix it ? TY in advance for the solutions!
Jun 8, 2018
Heefty
1387
Jun 8, 2018
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bloodpigTake off the ear pads and make sure all of the screws you see under them are tight. If that doesn't fix it, it's time to contact customer service.
Jun 8, 2018
bloodpig
157
Jun 8, 2018
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HeeftyHeefty everything is screwed tightly. I have no idea what else to try :( Any other suggestions ?
Jun 8, 2018
Heefty
1387
Jun 8, 2018
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bloodpigAnything else I can think of will probably void any warranty (if there is one) on them so you should contact customer support from Massdrop or Hifiman first.
Jun 8, 2018
bloodpig
157
Jun 8, 2018
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HeeftyOMG i put the pads again and after a minute of purring again it completely stopped doint any sounds at all. Its dead ? I think its dead ! OMG Massdrop why are you doing this to me ?! :(
Jun 8, 2018
Heefty
1387
Jun 8, 2018
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bloodpigIt's Hifiman, not Massdrop. They are more and more becoming known for their poor QC. I'm guessing you've got a bad solder joint, but if you start messing with that kind of stuff, I'm sure Massdrop/Hifiman will blame the trouble on you...
Jun 8, 2018
bloodpig
157
Jun 8, 2018
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Heeftyill not touch anything. Just wrote to the supports i hope they will bee helpful and not leave me hanging with a their bad product. Btw i found a guy in whats hifi complaining from the same as me. No answers thou.
Jun 8, 2018
ScubaManLakeHuron
48
Sep 11, 2018
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HeeftyIs the lopsided quality issues still a thing? @bloodpig
Sep 11, 2018
bloodpig
157
Sep 11, 2018
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ScubaManLakeHuronif you ask me, i personally would go for the sennheiser 58x and skip those. Sadly i both them, so i stuck with a pair that sits inside a drawer.
Sep 11, 2018
ScubaManLakeHuron
48
Sep 11, 2018
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WillI appreciate your position, eh. These planar magnetic drivers are far less expensive than the offerings I have up here in Toronto. My HD6xx are performing like a champ, so I have faith Massdrop will do what it can to offer a quality product to "us".
Sep 11, 2018
ScubaManLakeHuron
48
Sep 11, 2018
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bloodpigI have a full stable of Sennheiser cans. Now, I'm lusting for a pair of 'phones that have different speaker technology. Headphone prices up here in Toronto are silly-inflated. Thanks for your response, eh.
Sep 11, 2018
bloodpig
157
Sep 12, 2018
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ScubaManLakeHuronim talking about not only the quality of the product as build, im talking about the sound signature as well. If you like the warmth of the hd6xx you will not get it with those. Plus he4xx need more amplification than my phone can satisfyingly provide and even amplified from a 2 W balance amp they still cannot provide, compared to hd6xx. If it eint having that bass thump is a no go for meh. I dont know why ppl praise them so much, am i missing something or what?! For those 170 dollars i would gladly go for the smaller hd6xx brother - the hd58x.
Sep 12, 2018
bloodpig
157
Sep 12, 2018
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bloodpig
search

search

search
Sep 12, 2018
ScubaManLakeHuron
48
Sep 12, 2018
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bloodpigThose images tell me MUCH (about what I should expect [finish, pivot-point-quality, trim] if I pick up this set). Thanks, eh.
Sep 12, 2018
bloodpig
157
Sep 13, 2018
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ScubaManLakeHuronIm just sharing my experience with this set. I read hear and there how ppl adore those sets how big buck for the bank is and how amazing they are and what not, so i bought them and i got disappointed. Maybe they are ok, maybe they are good, but for me, after hearing the other alternative, i just cannot look back to them sorry. Plus that faulty speaker turned me really hotheaded.
Sep 13, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Sep 13, 2018
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bloodpigYour front end isn't up to the task. Playing lossless files and just a Fiio E10K as a DAC and a Magni 3 there's PLENTY of low end slam. Magni 2 U also drives them and everything improves with the Modi 2U as a DAC. Granted it's not TH-X00 levels but it's there. And lack of bass is the first thing I notice. These would have been out the door in a heartbeat for me otherwise. Again these are not on the go cans. These are sit down at home connected to a respectable rig cans.
Sep 13, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Sep 14, 2018
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Hmm. Spamming? Projecting are we?
Sep 14, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Sep 14, 2018
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Ok thought it was directed at me. You sure do hate those 6 series Sennheiser cans. The HE 4XX are good.
Sep 14, 2018
darwin
90
Oct 27, 2018
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Assimilator702I'm a big Sennheiser 6 series fan and have long before the 6XX existed but man these are amazing. They have me looking at higher end Planars.
Oct 27, 2018
jaffe
272
Oct 29, 2018
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hmm. love the 4xx, but "next level"?
Oct 29, 2018
jaffe
272
Oct 30, 2018
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Farts, I agree (mostly) with you about planars, but I do not find the Potential of the 4xx to be higher than that of the 600/650, actually. It's what they say about scalability, I suppose. I've been mixing with 600's since they came out, so my ears are super familiar with them...maybe too familiar. I change it up a lot when listening and the 4xx always perks up my ears, but I always wind up back with the Senns. I've been into tweaking the Bottlehead stuff for a while now and have never loved the 650's more...such a cliche. I know they're not the be all/end all, but I'll be damned if I can't keep making them sound better. I have a pair of 800's that I just could not warm up to for years until I built a BH Mainline last year...that might actually be the be all/end all, though...hah...but really. Very tempted by the new HFM Edition XX.
Oct 30, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Oct 30, 2018
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Mountain biker myself. A hobby more expensive than audio when you start looking at the better gear. Or even just wanting to build a bike. I need a few more parts for my current build and they aren't cheap.
Oct 30, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Oct 30, 2018
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The bike I have now is a Trek SLR Fuel. Mostly single track and trail riding. I'm building up a 2005 Trek Liquid frame with high end parts. I got the Chris King headset installed years ago and of course the ONE PART that halted the build was the fork which were all in the $600 to $800 range when I was looking. So I kept putting off buying the fork and spent $$$ on other hobbies. I had a Manitou Minute 2:00 but decided I wanted air on one side so I sold it. Now the industry moved to tapered headsets around 2012-2013 so it's difficult to find a good fork since I'm not scraping this build. Too much $$$ into it. Even with 26" wheels and a straight headset it's gonna be one badass bike and I'll be able to hit the more rough root filled trails with ease.
Oct 30, 2018
Assimilator702
184
Oct 30, 2018
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Right now I'm seriously considering. Rockshix fork. Either Rena or Lyric and used of course. I'm building my own wheels just need a rear hub and I might switch to the newer style Shimano rear derailleur since I don't need a.long cage after the switch to one sprocket up front and a bash guard/chain retainer.
Oct 30, 2018
jaffe
272
Oct 30, 2018
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Brilliant. I too recently took delivery of a questionably pricy gravel bike that, right now, is getting way more use than the cans. So the xx will have to wait.
Oct 30, 2018
DeliriumTrigger
32
Dec 15, 2018
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Petronas44Dude, these are a bargain product that's obviously not aimed at you or anyone else that would rather just pay full price for the "known" product. If this is the only way massdrop can get these cans on here for us, then that's just the way it is, nobody is forcing anyone to buy anything. I feel like massdrop is not the place for you, or atleast x products.
Dec 15, 2018
Progfan2018
11
Dec 18, 2018
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WillHi. 12 hours of use and the right side has quit. Reversing the cables verifies it. I would appreciate some help with this. I really liked them too. 8-(
search

Dec 18, 2018
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Dec 19, 2018
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Progfan2018Hey there, this is covered under warranty. Reach out to support via your transactions page (click the dots next to your profile pic on the top right corner of the site, click "transactions" and you should see the 4XX on that list with a button "contact support" to the right) and we'll send a replacement your way.
Dec 19, 2018
yuanvanscheijndel
8
Dec 21, 2018
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Progfan2018so sorry for u :( f
Dec 21, 2018
Timothy468
0
Jan 21, 2019
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Petronas44I agree that not knowing specs can make one take pause. I spent a moderate amount of time (and had not read the explanation here first, which would have helped) in comparing the 440i and 400s models with the 4XX (I was confused - I did not even realize it was created just for Massdrop, so I wasted time trying to find the relevant information). But when I compared the specs that were available, I made a decision to purchase it. I can - as can you - decide to not make a purchase, if too uncertain. If I felt it was BS to withhold proprietary information, I would not buy it. Probably would not complain about it after the fact, though.
Jan 21, 2019
simon--poole
57
Jul 19, 2019
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I'd agree I prefer the HifiMan but to say the 650s are lifeless is unfair. Maybe you don't like the sound? Happy you had a good customer support experience too.
Jul 19, 2019
Bloos
76
Apr 28, 2020
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AudiamHow did the 4xx sound compared to the he500?
Apr 28, 2020
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 5, 2020
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WillHE-5XX going to be way better : )
Aug 5, 2020
Motorrad
2898
Aug 6, 2020
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WillYou sassy, little tease.
Aug 6, 2020
Zorker
2
Nov 13, 2020
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OldTomBombadilThat's my question, too! I'm hearing people talk about plugging balanced cables into the mini-stereo jacks on these headphones. I could be wrong, but I have never, ever heard of any mini-stereo jacks being wired to handle both standard cables and balanced cables. The wiring is definitely different and I can't believe the jacks can support both types of interface. Who knows for sure on these HE4XX headphones? I'm dying to hear.
Nov 13, 2020
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