Showing 1 of 1275 conversations about:
View Full Discussion
Damn, someone comment says this headphone doesn't produce much bass, some says does.
Which one is it?
he-4xx sound dull and boring. They have bass, but k7xx sound warmer with a bit more. While 6xx have tons more bass when turned up loud.
Then again I don't have a headphone amp, and that would definitely help in all regards but especially bass.
I joined the drop yesterday. I buy this by trusting some review and opinion. I would have get 6XX if it ships to my country and that's why I got this.
Look at the frequency response plots. The bass is quite well extended for an open back design, but is not overpowering. It is right in line with the treble, and the mids are somewhat recessed by comparison. The key to these isn't bass quantity but quality.
I'm not really an audio hardcore guy. I just started to join this "audiophile world" so the graph kinda alien to me. But, if this is better than my old ATH-M30x then I'm a happy man.
I've never listened to the 30x, but I'd have a hard time believing that these would not out perform them handily.
However, if your metric for that is how much bass you can hear, you'll probably be disappointed, because you have to listen to it as a part of a song instead of listening to bass.
It's a really cheap headphone. I mostly listen to electronic music or EDM from it. Sounds good but probably would be 10 times better on 4XX. Due to my currency exchange rate, I can't really a afford high-end products. This drop is my most expensive purchase.
Looks like I'm a happy man now.
both the 6xx and this headphone require a headphone amp to hear what they're all about. Without you're not even close to unlocking their potential or how they're meant to be heard.
From my stock, I can't really say that mplanar headphones are bassthumping compared to standard dynamic drivers. Although these out of the box had the most noticeable bass out of my budget mplanar offerings (M560, M1060, OPPO PM-3), so take that how you will.
I guess you get what you pay for.
Btw, I just got the estimated shipping date on 7th of dec. Does that mean they will ship my drop on that date?
If you haven't already gotten a tracking number, I would assume Dec 7th is when they are going to ship it.
With regards to these and other headphones in general, a headphone amp is something of a necessity. It isn't a matter of needing a massive amount of power, but only relying on the source for sound, and a separate amp for increasing the volume to any meaningful degree. That is to say, you would have no problem plugging this into a smartphone or PC, but you are only going to hear what it really sounds like with a proper amp.
Thanks for clarifying the shipping issue.
Would FiiO E10k do? I own that
E10k should do. I don't have one to test myself, but I haven't heard anything entirely negative about FiiO amps.
I own the pm-3 and am considering these. The pm-3 sounds great but can be a bit dull. Can you share a bit more how the he4xx compares?
It's tough making comparisons as I'm more of a collector than an objective critic.
the 4xx takes a bit more power to drive, where I can 2 o clock my Black Label on Eco/low with the PM-3, I have to set it to normal 2 o clock to achieve similar levels of volume. So if you want mobile options, the PM-3 is still more lax. Although, the PM-3 I do need to crank it a bit to enjoy it while the 4xx on modest volumes still can perform.
If you're specifically looking at bass, the PM-3 benefits with the closed back to let you feel it. The 4xx to me has more bass, but the open back will only let you hear it as opposed to "feel" it, which isn't necessarily a bad thing (I prefer PM-3 for electronic vs the 4xx) but it's worth it for anything string. You'll also notice a bit more of a hiss with vocals pronouncing "s" on the 4xx, which can be irritating. Overall the 4xx is a pretty dirt cheap entry point for an Open Planar (and they are pretty open - sound leaks mercilessly) and I'd say go for them if you're into strumming.
They will sound "good" no matter what you drive them with, but if you want to really hear what they can do you want a better amp than E10K. The problem it will have for the 4xx is that it can't drive the current they require. Particularly since they sound best at a loud volume. It can be something to grow into in the future though.
Yes but then again if the guy is on tight budget, even a budget amp like the O2 or NX1s or NX2s could do it.
IMO, O2 is a good fit for the he4xx. That's what I've been driving them with. It's got plenty of V overhead for their needs, and can actually supply the current they require, at least for short durations.
And it's "portable" so that's an added benefit.
i totally agree. anything to drive a bit of power to them. he's obviously not getting the anything near the full benefit of his headphone collection.
And here I thought the higher the impedance, the powerful amp you need. I guess I'm wrong. I'll just stick with my E10K for awhile. How long does international shipping takes? 1~2 weeks?
A high impedance headphone will require more voltage and less current, compared to a low impedance headphone will require a lot more current and far less voltage. Apart from impedance, not all headphones are equally efficient relative to a 1v or 1mw output (these are two different ways of comparing headphone efficiency, do not confuse them). In other words, relative to a 1v output, some headphones may produce 93db, 97db, 104db, etc. Each +3db of efficiency on these scales require 50% less power at equal impedance. It’s the same for speakers At 8ohms. A 89db efficiency (at 1 watt, at 1 metre) speaker will require 2x the rms power from an amp than a comparable 92db/1w/1meter speaker.
So basically what you need is an amp that draws enough current and voltage relative to the impedance and efficiency of your required headphones, no more, no less. This is why some headphones may need a small low power amp, and another headphone a very powerful amp. Impedance is only part of the story, relative efficiency is the other part...
I think it said 3-14 business days, so that's up to nearly 3 weeks. But i guess this really depend on where you live. Also customs duty could increase this further...
that depends on the drivers and if you use an amp. from my experience high degree of variability from. pair to pair. second my hifimans are bass anemic straight out of my v20, smsl idea, sabaj d3. However once i connect them to schiit stack or 02 etc their sound changes.
Thanks for taking the time to help explain amp requirements for headphones like these.
For a noob who still doesn't quite understand how to decipher amp language, would you expect the Schiit Magni 1 to handle these without worry, or am I looking at missing out on some quality because of the need for additional current? I am also using a ZuperDac, which I believe does some amplification on its own. What's my outlook with this setup?
I do not know the SuperZac. The Schiit Magni 1, I don’t know either, but if it’s comparable to the Magni 2, I would say it may drive about any normal headphone at about any regular impedance (between 18 and 600 ohms) within normal listening levels. But I haven’t tried it myself. What are the headphones you’ll be using it for?
I'm with tessierpg on this one, I think there's a good chance that that your Schiit Magni 1 will be able to handle this.
To the rest with the general comments about the bass, open back planars won't knock your socks off with the bass power, but the clarity is incredible. I have both Monoprice M1060s and EL-8 Titanium closed backs and I can say, I don't get enough fun out of either of them without applying some amount of EQ to the bass.
That being said, the clarity is great where most headphones at this bass frequency would be incredibly muddy providing limited instrument isolation. I love the feeling of hearing precise drum hits in the music, it gives TH-X00s a run for their money (in clarity) and really only falls to some of the CIEMs I have. But for the price if you can drive them there's a way to enjoy them, even if you really like your bass with more power.
Thanks for taking the time out to elaborate, very useful info. It seems the 4xx goes in a different direction from the pm-3 then what I am looking for. Despite that though, they remain tempting at this price point...
Don't listen to anybody and just buy like I do!
Thanks. I'll be driving the 4XX when they arrive on Friday. When I get the chance to test them out, I'll post back.
Nice! Mine will be shipped on 7th Dec. Gotta wait 2~3 weeks for international shipping.
Hearing is different for everyone, I'm not having any bass issues with my pair. I recommend a decent headphone amp if its a problem
Yes Please do. i just got my pair of 4XX and I'm driving them with the Fiio E17K Alpen 2 that i got for some other headphones. and while it it is a great little dac/amp its not quite capable of driving these things they were meant to be driven. so i am looking a for a reasonably priced dac/amp that can easily drive these and my 6XX when i get those.
My first exposure to audio was 50 years ago and I've come to realize that while we can listen to a live performance and hear the same sound, when it comes to it's reproduction we all hear differently. There is no "right" sound, if your hearing is biased one way or another - some prefer a warm/laid back sound, others a more forward/direct presentation. I call them "concert hall Row 10 sound" as against "sitting in the middle of the band with the musicians around you".
There are headphones and there are "headphones". Some are (with respect to Walmart :-)) Walmart quality- but at at Macy's price point - how you are being asked to pay is NOT a good indicator, especially the higher up the price scale you go. Trying to re-play a tight punchy bass guitar and kick drum at 80Hz as well as a synth droning on at 28Hz is not an easy thing to accomplish! Few headphones can do that well. And if only listen for the 80Hz bass, you're missing out. Much of today's music has deep deep bass seldom heard and very much a part of the overall musical experience.
The best "quality" headphones first-timers can buy are the Sennheiser HD 6XX - there is no other way to say it. They have faults and I've stopped using mine. But for sheer pleasure and immediate audio comfort there is no better value. They are warm and comfortable, very forgiving of poor recordings. And keep in mind recording qualities vary - most are fine but some recordings in themselves are lacking in bass, or excessive in treble - or dull! The 6XXs are very forgiving in this regards.
But IMHO I find the 6XXs have a bass hangover, and are slightly dull. I sometimes listen to close-miked solo piano, and it is a very apparent failing.
I spent 2 hours in a headphone shop listening to the HiFiMAN HE400Ss when they were first released. At that time I had a pair of HD-650s and was looking for a improvement. The HE400Ss did not warrant enough of an improvement to pass the test. And they were nearly AUD $450 at that time. I did not buy them.
But I have placed my order for this current HE4XX massdrop! Whether they use 400, 400i or 400S or even more improved drivers, at this current price point of AUD $250, I'm sure they are a bargain.
The HE4XXs will have a relatively brighter treble than the HD 6XXs, and relatively 'thinner' bass, I'm sure. I am only hoping "burn in" will help quieten its treble and loosen the bass.
No transducer set is going to be perfect. What you cannot fix is hangover or ringing. The lightweight material of the HE4XX drivers would be a huge benefit to accurate transient response. Everything else can be EQed for. Just a touch (plus or minus 2dB) can do wonders!
(For EQ I use https://itunes.apple.com/au/app/equ-the-quality-equalizer/id403704212 on my iPhone and https://sourceforge.net/projects/equalizerapo/ on my laptop).
By the way, my main system are Magnaplaner MG12s paired with dual, non-mirrored 8" subwoofers (with DSP delay - to allow the relativity slow subs to catch up to the super-fast lightweight mylars of the planar MG12s), crossed over at 60Hz.
I hope when my HE4XXs arrive I don't have a missing solder (as some have reported) on one (or both) of the transducers!
The Magni 1 definitely has enough power to make my ears bleed with these. I keep the volume knob between 9:00 and 12:00. But I am using the ZuperDac, which has amplification as well. So my results might not be typical.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! I hope mine too doesn't have the missing solder as I'm waiting 2~3 weeks to arrive
The magni 1 will drive these to deafening levels. It’s plenty loud at 9’oclock on the dial.
Just received today and comfortable. Using E10k to power it. Sounds good. Probably even good on good AMP.
This is my first open-back headphone. I'm trying to get use to the sounds though. Been on closed-back since I was kid.