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MiTo
13793
MiTo
Jun 8, 2017
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As a bit of an update, last Friday I received samples of the Text Modifiers, Betas and Icons as well. The prints clearly look much bolder (thicker) than intended, even for Betas and Icons. Something happened when the files got translated to the machines, or prints, I don't know.
Therefore, I spent the past weekend (Sat/Sun) adjusting all of the files and the stroke on every single glyph/symbol, in order to compensate for the thickness that's occurring during the print process. The lines were significantly adjusted and trimmed thinner.
From the prototypes received so far, I can see that the manufacturer seem to be able to achieve thin and delicate lines (bars, dots, accents, etc). It's a matter of adjustments and prototyping until we achieve the vision.
Massdrop agents are currently in China inspecting production and getting new prototypes, making sure we will have a great final product shipped to the warehouse.
Thank you all for the support and patience! I hope to share great news and photos with you soon.
Jun 8, 2017
mostlysmart
20
Jun 8, 2017
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MiTo thank you for taking the time to insure these are done to your specifications. I speak for myself, but I would rather wait for the best possible product instead of rushing through for a slightly less desirable product.
Jun 8, 2017
MiTo
13793
MiTo
Jun 8, 2017
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At your service, thank you for trusing my eyes and supporting our decisions. We appreciate the support. You can rest assured we are working hard to deliver what you guys have been waiting for!
Jun 8, 2017
b1g_b1rd
61
Jun 8, 2017
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Thanks for putting in the extra effort. Do you anticipate the ship date being pushed back further because of the correction?
Jun 8, 2017
pomk
97
Jun 8, 2017
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Please do fix the scaling and positioning of the glyphs while you are at it, or do you plan on having a second 'calibration' round just for that later on?
Best option would be to 3d print, with color, a sample keycap that is 100% accurate with the render and let them worry about how they mangle your files in order to get their machines to print stuff according to the designs.
Surely this is a problem with the calibration of their equipment for the most part, and not your design files?
Jun 8, 2017
MiTo
13793
MiTo
Jun 8, 2017
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That is unclear to me, I don't know exactly how the logistics work, hopefully not.
Jun 8, 2017
MiTo
13793
MiTo
Jun 8, 2017
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I believe I adjusted everything accordingly, now I'm waiting for the results. I believe the errors were a combination of files, calibration and communication. I think it's resolved for now, I will keep you all updated. They can do great dyesub, that's for sure.
Jun 8, 2017
eapdang
558
Jun 9, 2017
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Thank you for the update! I'm very excited for the next round of photos now!
Jun 9, 2017
Pavarotti
49
Jun 9, 2017
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So, four months after this drop closed, and a week after it was originally intended to ship, you still don't know what happened to cause the lines to come out much bolder than intended. "Something happened". Do you think, in retrospect, that you might have managed this project a whole lot better than you did? Why don't you give us an honest estimate of when you think this might ship. I think that's not too much to ask.
Jun 9, 2017
MiTo
13793
MiTo
Jun 10, 2017
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I understand your frustration but I don't think it's fair from your part to question the effort all parts involved are putting into the project, nor the way you are wording your concerns. It's taking longer than expected, yes. But that's because we are not going to force a mediocre/unfinished product down the participants' mailboxes. Don't take this personally, but it seems that you're not very experienced in creating custom products overseas, let alone a mostly visual one. Prototypes must be done and adjustments must be made. This takes time to get done, and it's taking longer than Massdrop initially anticipated.
Regarding your question, I'm being as transparent as possible. I don't know the exact reason the lines came out thicker then designed but I adjusted them anyway, as soon as I received kits with word legends - as the kits' communicate with each other. Adjustments were made by compensation of strokes and adjustments to the glyphs, matching specifications, like I was told to do. I never been to the manufacturer plant myself, but Massdrop agents did and we work together. Had you bothered to read my latest update more carefully, you'd be able to see that I clearly stated that I suspect that it was a combination of issues while translating files between different softwares and machines, natural imprecision and possibly lack of communication. Some kits presented discrepancies that made no sense, things we didn't request showed up. Massdrop agents are in China and we are communicating everyday, and I feel that we improved in all of these areas.
If I could have handled the project a little better? Yes, there's always room for improvement. I recently migrated to a full three dimensional presentation of the designs. Another aspect is that despite me providing files and instructions on the fly, sadly prototyping takes a bit too long to get done and samples are flying across the world facing 3 different custom clearances - China, US and Brazil. Therefore, next time I'm hoping to fly directly to China, together with MD agents, so we can work things out more quickly, in person. This was the first time a fully custom XDA keycap set was done via Massdrop - and the biggest XDA project to the date. You can rest assured we are doing the best we can to deliver it, and we will deliver it. The upcoming ones we have lined up will unfold more smoothly.
I understand your frustration and I also hoped to have this project delivered more quickly. We are sorry about that. But we are getting there, the manufacturer is working day and night on our keycaps and I remain with my ears up, ready to assist them if needed. I'm also posting updates the soon as I'm informed about them. I'm not going to give you an "honest estimate on when these will ship", because I have absolutely no control over logistics. Massdrop handles the logistics and customer service, I handle the designs and to some extent, in this particular case, quality control.
Thank you for joining the drop, I appreciate your support and patience. I hope you have a blast and enjoy your weekend.
Jun 10, 2017
Pavarotti
49
Jun 10, 2017
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Not good enough. Regardless of Massdrop logistics, you surely have an answer for the "no way in hell this is going to be ready in less than xxx weeks" question. The last delay estimate we received (2 or 3 weeks) is laughable, and of course no one has stepped up to give us better estimates. Even though we all know that we're in the process of blowing straight through this delay. Note that I am happy to wait as long as it takes - I am just asking you to have the courtesy to give me an idea when this will be. I was also very careful to only quote your comments about the cause for the current problem, and I didn't question your efforts. But, in all honesty, you should have caught this problem way sooner, and reacted way quicker.
Jun 10, 2017
Morning_Coffee
125
Jun 10, 2017
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As MiTo said, you must not know how prototyping a custom product works. It is beyond disrespectful of you to repeatedly question MiTo like this on a public forum. He gave you a lengthy detailed answer and you still challenge his credibility.
Jun 10, 2017
valniro
43
Jun 10, 2017
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Believe it or not, the creation from scratch of a brand new product isn't even close to how easy you'd like to make it sound. Meeting milestones on something that has never been done before it's _extremely_ hard, even giving timeline estimations is, especially when you're working with a 3rd party and the tuning phase is out of your domain of control. For sure MiTo can overview the whole process, but he is not directly responsible for any delays caused by manufacturing issues. He could accept the prototypes without even trying to make the product similar to the renders and you'd be forced to deal with it, but he is working hard to get things done properly, and the least you could do is to respect that and give the guy some peace of mind. I'm pretty sure he is already stressed enough by the current situation.
Jun 10, 2017
RichardV
201
Jun 10, 2017
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Thanks for the update! I'd mentioned before, I don't mind the delay and wait. Looking forward to getting more updates from you soon
Jun 10, 2017
Vigrith
4081
Jun 10, 2017
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Just thought I'd let you know that your "not good enough" is irrelevant. Mito doesn't work for you, he is the designer and most the time after the product has been DESIGNED the entire process is left up to Massdrop to handle as that is their job. If you think there should be a new estimate to be given, contact Massdrop, Mito's already doing more than he has to in order to keep the community happy and give people what they paid for so that there are no tragedies and complaints after the set ships, the least we can do is supporting him through the process.
You don't know if he has an answer regardless of MD logistics. You act as though you own the guy and/or have the right to witch hunt just because he designed a set you bought - this is the equivalent of buying a ticket to see Drake live on the 26th which then gets pushed off and you call up his ghost writer like "yo bro, ok listen you really gotta fix this shit, I paid for my ticket on the 26th, how the fuck can you allow it to pushed off an entire month?", the guy then apologises and thoroughly explains the situation but "na that's not good enough".
Everyone's so quick to judge how fast someone should catch onto a problem, you seem fairly new to the whole mechanical keyboard thing so honestly, last thing I want to do is lose people/Massdrop sales but I think you should ponder another hobby; I think the last group buy for a custom set I purchased anywhere (including outside of MD) where the initial deadline was met was a year and a half ago. Shit happens and most if not every time that's got nothing to do with the designer.
Get a grip basically, is what I'm trying to say.
Jun 10, 2017
Raccatography
197
Jun 10, 2017
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@MiTo thank you MiTo. Just clarifying, both the Betas and Alphas are getting adjusted, yes? :)
Jun 10, 2017
tehmooo
60
Jun 12, 2017
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No worries, thanks for the update! Glad to hear you've got to the bottom of where they got confused and it's all being sorted :) - Also, for me specifically the delay works - because I'm going on holiday and wouldn't have been in to receive the parcel at home, so I don't mind the wait :P
Jun 12, 2017
JA_MAN
70
Jun 12, 2017
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Nice to hear, as I didn't think they would be revised. Thank you.
Jun 12, 2017
mrgrandis
619
Jun 13, 2017
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Thank you for the very detail updates regarding the current situation you were facing, keep up the good work!
Jun 13, 2017
geolchris
16
Jun 15, 2017
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Definitely a big thanks for working hard on 'making it right'. I know how disappointing it is to get something that isn't exactly to your vision, and even if this takes another month or so to get it right, I feel that you are definitely doing the right thing - and I would much rather have you iterate to get it right than accept something substandard just to make a deadline. Just please don't keep me waiting until Christmas, and keep the communication / updates coming and I'll be happy.
Everybody just needs to relax and let MiTo get the best possible version out to us! No sense in rushing it...this is custom art in the truest sense of the word and it will be worth the wait.
Jun 15, 2017
geolchris
16
Jun 15, 2017
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I can provide you the same estimate that I provide my clients when dealing with overseas custom artwork. It will be anywhere from 3 to 9 months. Please look elsewhere if you need unique and custom art that meets both your schedule *and* budget.
Wouldn't you rather have something that is a perfect representation of the mock up and late rather than unusable but on time? I'm also really happy that we even have this ability to purchase a low volume, high quality product with direct interaction from the artist. That alone is worth a wait. There's a lot of firsts in this drop - first with this manufacturer (I think), first with this type of keyset, certainly first of this design. It's a learning process - nothing is perfected yet. On top of all that, there's at least one language barrier. I feel that all of that was communicated clearly to us both from MiTo and MD in the beginning. Massrdrop provides an *estimated* ship date for a reason. It's an ideal - if everything goes to plan, I'm sure with a little leeway in case of any issues. There's been issues with the product, and they are being rectified. MiTo probably has a life outside of this keyset, and as much as I'm sure you would love him to dedicate more of his life to getting you your toy ASAP, that's a touch self-centered to say the least.
Perhaps you haven't heard of the rule of three. Things can be fast, good, or cheap. Pick two. We're getting good and (for all intents and purposes) cheap.
Please show some respect to the artist who is obviously working hard to get this to us. Especially when he has taken the time to write you a thoughtful and appropriate response.
Jun 15, 2017
Adereth
67
Jun 17, 2017
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Rude.
Jun 17, 2017
TTheuns
883
Jun 19, 2017
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I just found out about the QC issues. I'd still like to thank you and the Massdrop team for the hard work to ensure the caps will turn out as showed.
Jun 19, 2017
flyinglotus1983
358
Jun 21, 2017
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I am grateful to Massdrop and MiTo that the decision was to fix the issue (and accept any criticism for delaying the project) rather than just shipping something to customers that was fundamentally flawed. Thanks for accepting the criticism and acting on it. That takes a lot more integrity than just shipping bad product and getting defensive.
This was the right choice to make. Thank you.
Jun 21, 2017
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