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xWarewolfx
Aug 12, 2018
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cadure
17
Aug 14, 2018
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xWarewolfxMeh. I have one that is 3 years old and used approximately 60 days a year and it looks new. Be specific to this jacket instead of a generalist troll. Thanks,
xWarewolfx
Aug 14, 2018
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cadureMeh indeed.
You are taking your specific experience with one jacket and extrapolating a pattern vs me who actually has been involved with the supply chain, production, logistics, and (specific to this issue) returns tracking at Columbia Sportswear.
Seriously- who exactly is trolling? If you have insider information having actually worked at Mtn Hardware or COL, please step up, otherwise you just appear to be shilling.
You are taking your specific experience with one jacket and extrapolating a pattern vs me who actually has been involved with the supply chain, production, logistics, and (specific to this issue) returns tracking at Columbia Sportswear.
Seriously- who exactly is trolling? If you have insider information having actually worked at Mtn Hardware or COL, please step up, otherwise you just appear to be shilling.
cadure
17
Aug 14, 2018
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xWarewolfxWhy don't you prove this dribble: "Now, these jackets just fall apart."
You may be a shunned ex employee or maybe not, but you make generalizations that are clearly not ture (see my experience).
You may be a shunned ex employee or maybe not, but you make generalizations that are clearly not ture (see my experience).
xWarewolfx
Aug 14, 2018
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cadureOut of thousands of jackets produced, you have one that you claim is holding up. Congrats, but again that does not prove a pattern at all. Additionally, I don't know how old your jacket is, only when you claim you bought it. It's possible you got a sale on old stock and your jacket is one of the good ones.
Yes, I was generalizing. Does that mean I am incorrect? At worst, you can call me hyperbolic, but what you are doing is being a pedantic irritant.
Let me ask you something: If after a dramatic corporate change, what percentage increase in returns on a product line would make you consider the changes to be bad? Serious question- where would you draw the line in the sand? I don't know you from anyone, but I suspect that the actual percentage of increased returns due to quality issues is FAR larger than you would guess. To that end, I will confidently stick to my guns on this- These jackets just fall apart.
Look man, be a loyalist to what is now a poor representation of a once great product if you want to be. It's your money. I'm only sharing my perspective having been in the game for quite a while. You don't have to listen to me, but please don't lock horns with me on this.
Side note: The word is drivel, not dribble.
Yes, I was generalizing. Does that mean I am incorrect? At worst, you can call me hyperbolic, but what you are doing is being a pedantic irritant.
Let me ask you something: If after a dramatic corporate change, what percentage increase in returns on a product line would make you consider the changes to be bad? Serious question- where would you draw the line in the sand? I don't know you from anyone, but I suspect that the actual percentage of increased returns due to quality issues is FAR larger than you would guess. To that end, I will confidently stick to my guns on this- These jackets just fall apart.
Look man, be a loyalist to what is now a poor representation of a once great product if you want to be. It's your money. I'm only sharing my perspective having been in the game for quite a while. You don't have to listen to me, but please don't lock horns with me on this.
Side note: The word is drivel, not dribble.
cadure
17
Aug 14, 2018
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xWarewolfxNo, its dribble. I visualize someone in an armchair barely able to contain their saliva when spouting off verbal diarrhea. Am I right? Here is the thing. You must be a scorned ex employee because why else you would come onto a site that sells the jacket unless you wanted to get back at MH at some level?
And yes, you are generalizing. It doesn't make you incorrect. What it does is produce a strawman argument and invalidate your original hypothesis - that 'these jackets just fall apart.' What is your motive by posting on this site (apart from promoting a competitors jacket? What relationship do you have with EE? A quick Google search confirms that there are not widespread failures of this jacket.
And yes, you are generalizing. It doesn't make you incorrect. What it does is produce a strawman argument and invalidate your original hypothesis - that 'these jackets just fall apart.' What is your motive by posting on this site (apart from promoting a competitors jacket? What relationship do you have with EE? A quick Google search confirms that there are not widespread failures of this jacket.
xWarewolfx
Aug 14, 2018
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cadureAn amusing picture you paint, but you still used the word incorrectly. Nice attempt though.
My original thesis statement, if you will, is that the quality has been purposely reduced. Since you are so clearly a fan of Google searches, I can only assume that you purposely didn't include the very easy to find corporate statement which clearly established that COL was intending on changing direction and moving out of the high-end market for outdoor clothing. This is not me making a angry statement, this is the direction of the company publicly announced by CEO Tim Boyle.
If you were to ever gain access to COL HQ in Portland, OR, you will find that literally no one on the design team purchases or wears COL clothing (including Mtn Hardwear). I am far from the only one who is frustrated with the direction the company is going. While some protest is extremely overt here- such as refusing to wear the company brand- other forms of protest happen online. Notwithstanding, my motivations are hardly the issue. The issue is the jacket.
You say that a Google search 'confirms' that there are not widespread failures of this jacket. Google doesn't 'confirm' anything, friendo, it only pulls data. I can produce just as many poor reviews of this and other jackets as you can find positive reviews.
I was going to ask you to respond to my question about percentages (which you conveniently ignored), but it occurs to me that you are little more than a fan boy so any further conversation is a waste of time. Be sure to respond with something really, really witty. Its absolutely important that you get the last word in.
My original thesis statement, if you will, is that the quality has been purposely reduced. Since you are so clearly a fan of Google searches, I can only assume that you purposely didn't include the very easy to find corporate statement which clearly established that COL was intending on changing direction and moving out of the high-end market for outdoor clothing. This is not me making a angry statement, this is the direction of the company publicly announced by CEO Tim Boyle.
If you were to ever gain access to COL HQ in Portland, OR, you will find that literally no one on the design team purchases or wears COL clothing (including Mtn Hardwear). I am far from the only one who is frustrated with the direction the company is going. While some protest is extremely overt here- such as refusing to wear the company brand- other forms of protest happen online. Notwithstanding, my motivations are hardly the issue. The issue is the jacket.
You say that a Google search 'confirms' that there are not widespread failures of this jacket. Google doesn't 'confirm' anything, friendo, it only pulls data. I can produce just as many poor reviews of this and other jackets as you can find positive reviews.
I was going to ask you to respond to my question about percentages (which you conveniently ignored), but it occurs to me that you are little more than a fan boy so any further conversation is a waste of time. Be sure to respond with something really, really witty. Its absolutely important that you get the last word in.
cadure
17
Aug 14, 2018
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xWarewolfxYou aren't that bright, are you. Look up the definition of 'dribble' and report back.
Generally, when someone has a strawman argument, they inherently defend their statements by transferring the onus of proof on the individual who opposed the argument. In addition, someone that makes strawman arguments often changes the subject. Which you did ("If you were to ever gain access to COL HQ in Portland, OR, you will find that literally no one on the design team purchases or wears COL clothing (including Mtn Hardwear)").
YOU claimed the jacket is low quality and subject to a high rate of failure. Therefore, YOU have to provide percentages of failure. The onus is on you to provide suitable back-up to support your claims. Which I suspect you can't.
What I want to know is, do you work for EE and / or why did MH fire you?
Generally, when someone has a strawman argument, they inherently defend their statements by transferring the onus of proof on the individual who opposed the argument. In addition, someone that makes strawman arguments often changes the subject. Which you did ("If you were to ever gain access to COL HQ in Portland, OR, you will find that literally no one on the design team purchases or wears COL clothing (including Mtn Hardwear)").
YOU claimed the jacket is low quality and subject to a high rate of failure. Therefore, YOU have to provide percentages of failure. The onus is on you to provide suitable back-up to support your claims. Which I suspect you can't.
What I want to know is, do you work for EE and / or why did MH fire you?
Stepbystep
549
Aug 16, 2018
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xWarewolfxOk, so you put it out there...can you share what specific changes were made to the GW insulated pieces that made them worse? Materials? Construction/sourcing? They chose a much better fabric over the original versions (twice, I think, but maybe just once during this 5-year period you mention)...it's stronger and softer and less apt to let plumes through. I'm not crazy about the treated down but from what I've been able to "feel" without eyes-on, it seems like the same high quality fill, not cheaping out on that but maybe I'm wrong there. The last one I bought was I think current (then) 2013 seasonal stock and it was great until it met a sparky death a couple years later (never loan ul gear to friends who like campfires...). I know the entry level MH rainwear lost some when COL stepped in, but the GW seems as good as ever for the most part, fabric is definitely improved. So....what exactly?
xWarewolfx
Oct 31, 2018
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xWarewolfxI missed your response. Sorry.
I can't address specific changes as I was not on the design team. I can state from an overview perspective that the materials purchased for production were less expensive. My understanding is that the design was also changed to be less labor intensive.
At this point, my response isn't worth much, but here you are.... Again sorry for the delay.
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Few of you were probably on the ”inside” when the decisions were made, but I was physically present when Tim Boyle made the announcement that all COL products were going to be redesigned for the mide to lower end market because there were too many players in the higher end. Effectively, he wanted to make things cheaper and of less quality so the items would be more affordable. He wanted to cut corners. That was about 5 years ago. Now, these jackets just fall apart.
Buy if you want, but be warned: this is not a quality jacket. You would be much better off spending a little bit more on a different manufacturer.