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suquet.paul
27
Feb 23, 2019
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Single-bit DAC. Unless you plan on plugging this via optical to your amplifier and having it (your amp or preamp) do the decoding using its internal DAC, I'd avoid CD players with not so good transport and terrible DACs. EDIT: As Stoppablemurph mentions, Onkyo does claim a muti-bit DAC (Wolfson WM8726). Indeed, I think they've updated this unit and now are finally using a decent DAC as opposed to a couple of years back.
(Edited)
Feb 23, 2019
Stoppablemurph
44
Feb 23, 2019
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suquet.paulIt says "It features a multi-bit D/A converter and 128x oversampling for an ultra-precise sound with little to no sound errors." in the description and the specs though.. Is this drop maybe a slightly different model from the one you commented on?
Feb 23, 2019
tw000
199
Feb 23, 2019
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suquet.paulThe specific text I found says: Single-bit DAC: Multi Trying to figure out exactly what this means seemed tricky but my best guess is that it uses a single-bit DAC per channel (2 for stereo?). Other sources mention a Wolfson WM8726 DAC. The Wolfson brand is pretty well regarded, but I don't know anything about this specific DAC. I'm not into the super-audiophile range but the reviews on this unit seem very good, especially at this price point. If I needed a CD changer at this price range, I'd probably go for it, especially considering the favorable reviews vs others in this price range (Harman Kardon seems to get bad reviews at this price point).
Feb 23, 2019
suquet.paul
27
Feb 23, 2019
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tw000My bad, apparently Onkyo upgraded their multi-disk changer now and they do mention this device uses the Wolfson WM8726 DAC. Wolfson and BurrBrown are the two most popular DACs around for consumer-grade CD players. This unit here, used to sport a single-bit DAC; which is the standard for carousel multi-CD players, portable cd player and car stereos. Onkyo makes a single CD player (model no C-7030) that does indeed use a slightly nicer DAC (Wolfson WM8718), with a sleeker body, that's also plastic, but painted and finished to look and feel like brushed aluminium; while this one doesn't feel much better than a plastic 90's Sony piece of equipment. It's not that this unit is a bad one; it's a decent enough CD player, but IMHO, if you're gonna go get a CD player in 2019, that's because you actually want to listen to CDs and you'd rather do that on your home theater or HiFi system, rather than stream from spotify or something; so if that's the case, I'd strongly suggest you get a good CD player. I personally tried a Cambridge Audio player with the BurrBrown 24 bit DAC that sounded very nice and warm, but had to return it as it kept having transport issues (the disc tray would get stuck). The C-7030 uses the Wolfson and looks clean, and modern and can be had for about this same price. I ended up with the Teac CD-P650-B . It's every bit as plastic-y as this multi-CD Onkyo player, but features the BurrBrown 1791ADBR DAC (which is 24-bit/192kHz) and not only a headphone out (and amp), but a volume control for it. Plus, it is cheaper than either Onkyos. All in all, I'd only recommend going for this particular Onkyo, if you absolutely must have a multi-disk player. Otherwise, a single-tray player usually has better transport and less mechanism to go wrong. As far as multi-disk, I've had positive experience with Yamaha's players in the past, but that was in the 90's, I am unsure if they still produce those, as at this point, not too many options are available. Now, remember if you eventually get a CD player and you actually want to listen to its internal DAC, don't use the optical out (as that'll just send digital data to your amp/preamp/head and have it be converted to analog audio THERE instead of the CD player), use the RCA out instead. Or even better, use both and give them both a go, find out which DAC you like the sound of better. CDs are a wonderful medium whose biggest flaw is possibly the lack of tactile experience present in vinyl records; but still, taking a cd out of it's case, putting it on, pressing a physical button on a player, and sitting down to listen while you look through the booklet beats asking Google Home / Alexa / Siri to "play whomever on spotify".
(Edited)
Feb 23, 2019
Axelay2003
9
Feb 23, 2019
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suquet.paulGreat read. Much appreciated.
(Edited)
Feb 23, 2019
VincentLeclerc
1
Mar 15, 2021
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suquet.paulThanks for sharing the information, is there really a difference between Spotify and CD talking about music quality? I don't think most of the people can tell the difference between uncompressed FLAC and 320k/bps MP3 songs. I used to download Spotify to MP3 and stream the same song on CD, I can barely hear difference.
Mar 15, 2021
suquet.paul
27
Mar 15, 2021
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VincentLeclercWell you're touching on multiple things here; I agree most of us can't really hear a difference between FLAC and 320kbps mp3. Either we can't hear the difference, or we simply don't have good enough equipment to get the most out of FLAC. I personally rip my cd's to 320kbps and find that's good enough for music on my phone or in the car. At home, I do most of my listening on vinyl and the occasional CD. Again, maybe if I had a better DAC, and a better amp, and a better set of speakers. I've no idea. But even in my recording studio, listening on studio monitors (Yamaha HS8's w and wo subwoofer), I may be able to hear a difference, but sure as hell can't tell which is which nor which is better. Now, the other thing you mention is Spotify. Spotify is not even close to CD quality, or FLAC, or 320kbps MP3. Spotify free uses, normally, 112~128kbps on desktop and 96~128kbps on mobile. Premium gets up to 192kbbps in certain cases, which, is pretty good, I'd say. They're supposedly launching "Spotify HD" later this year. We'll see what that means exactly. But even with Spotify Premium, I still find it super hard to enjoy music through the service. Even if I download the music beforehand and select the highest bitrate possible; there's something they do to their source that kills dynamics. It's particularly bad in the car I've noticed (tested on a 2013 Mazda 3 and a 2021 Mazda 3). So, yeah, I agree, most people either can't hear or don't have good enough equipment to tell the difference between FLAC and a high quality MP3; but Spotify vs either CD, or FLAC or a high quality MP3 is a much lower bar. I'd say most modest setups will be good enough for you to hear a difference there. It may be tricky because volume is often different when you switch sources, but listen carefully, find an instrument in the mix and focus on it, cymbals are a good tell imo; they sound harsh and distorted in spotify; while, if they're not intended to, they won't on even a 196kbps mp3. IMHO the take away is that Spotify (and every other music streaming service as well) is a fantastic tool. It's a great music discovery platform that I believe has value to offer for everyone. But that's all it is. Just a tool. You discover music there, only to go to the musicians merch page (or amazon or discogs) and buy a record or a cd to listen to and rip to take on the go. I've paid for Spotify on multiple occasions. Every time they offer me the 3 months for the price of one deal. But I never end up using it any more than when I don't pay for it. It could also be linked to my age... I grew up listening to vinyl and recording vinyl on tapes to take with me. I was skeptical of CD's as a kid. Preferred the fun of buying a record and recording it onto tape. So maybe streaming just isn't for me.
Mar 15, 2021
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