SMSL SP200 THX AAA-888 Balanced Headphone Amp Discussions | Drop

Jun 20, 2020

Dmac6419Compared to the 789, the SMSL's treble dynamics and spaciousness are inferior. It also only has 2 gain settings, no pass-through, no replaceable (external) power supply, and less-satisfying knobs/switches. In my view, the value proposition is lost considering other amps that are available... or coming soon. For instance, the made-in-the-USA Geshelli Labs Archel 2.5, which would likely match or best this SMSL in almost every way... for $86 less.

Jun 20, 2020

Florimer

Jun 20, 2020

mattrisI've heard this so many times i am getting tired to explain. Not everybody has Amazon. In Ukraine we do Not even have IKEA yet. The world is not limited to USA or Western Europe. There are still African, Asian, Eastern European countries, yknow...

Jun 20, 2020

Jun 20, 2020

FlorimerYou should not waste any more of your time explaining that, especially if the comment has nothing to do with you.

Jun 20, 2020

Florimer

Jun 20, 2020

mattrisIf you imply that Amazon is cheap and fast, it has a lot to do with many people (me included) . Because you are wrong. P. S. But you are correct in one thing. I feel like explaining simple things like that is not worth it. If you dont get it, you dont get it.

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Jun 20, 2020

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Jun 20, 2020

FlorimerI'm not "wrong". I said one "could just pay $24 more (on Amazon) and have it in a few days." The word "could" dictates conditionality. That is, one 'could buy the unit on Amazon if they had the means and/or the desire to do so.' Pick your battles wisely, my friend.

Jun 20, 2020

Jun 21, 2020

mattrisJust curious what kind of DAC you've paired the 789 and this guy with. I found no discernable difference on sound or sound volume between a Magni 3 and the 789. As far as the switches go, if the SMSL is even worse than the 789, you're right and there's no reason discussing anything else. I was also wondering how many internal power supplies you have seen fail on such amps since the 789 comes with what looks like a $20 laptop inverter that I would expect to replace in a year or two. Just my impressions. I was seriously considering the SMSL so any input on your experience would be appreciated.

Jun 21, 2020

Jun 21, 2020

SquirlyHappy to help. To be clear, I do not own the 789 or the SP200, nor have I ever heard them. Having said that, I have read/watched numerous reviews. A DAC with balanced XLR-outs provide a higher voltage (usually double or more) than its RCA-outs and will yield a noticeable improvement from the amp used in conjunction, especially true with a differential (discrete dual-channel) amplifier, which the 789 isn't. If you already have a 789, why get the SP200? May I ask, what headphones and DAC do you currently own? Internal power supplies usually don't fail, but they are an unnecessary risk, as external ones are easy to replace/upgrade.

Jun 21, 2020

Jun 21, 2020

mattrisHi, I've briefly had the 789 but had to return it due to the poor quality of the construction and my perceived lack of improvement over the Magni 3....which I still have. Just talking mechanical design, the 789 looked like it was designed by interns and assembled by children. I'm still waiting on the Topping DT70 to replace the Micca Origen currently in use. I'm using that into the Magni to properly drive my DT 1990 Pro or the Aeon Flow Open. I guess XLR inputs would be nice to have now when the Topping arrives.

Jun 21, 2020

Jun 21, 2020

SquirlyI assume you meant the Topping D70. Have you already bought it? If so, I recommend getting a Geshelli Labs Archel 2.5 amplifier use its XLR inputs. I expect you'll perceive a major improvement compared to using a Magni 3 sourced from the entry-level Micca Origen.

Jun 21, 2020

Jun 21, 2020

mattrisYes the D70. Sorry for the typo. Thanks for the suggestion. I'll check it out. Any particular seller that you've had good experience with?

Jun 21, 2020

Jun 21, 2020

SquirlyOne more question...after reading through some of the Archel reviews, I also came across suggestions for this guy: https://rupertneve.com/products/rnhp-headphone-amplifier/ While significantly more expensive, would this make a better long term solution? I don't want to keep switching amps.

Jun 21, 2020

Jun 22, 2020

SquirlyNah, with basically the same features and footprint as the Geshelli's Archel amp, the RNHP would not be worth the extra few hundred dollar investment. If you don't need a balanced-out, the Archel 2.5 is probably the most-accurate headphone amp under $500... and stil has balanced-ins. I'd go ahead and get it... and then wait for something a truly special to come along before upgrading.

Jun 22, 2020

Jun 22, 2020

mattrisThanks for all the feedback. I'll likely get the Archel.

Jun 22, 2020

Jun 22, 2020

SquirlyYou're welcome. If you do get the Archel 2.5, I'd love to hear what you think of it, paired with your D70 over XLR. I think you'll be impressed. Could you give me 'likes' on my posts here, please? (I did just that for you.) Thanks!

Jun 22, 2020

Jun 22, 2020

mattrisSure thing. No idea when I'll get the DAC at the rate of which everything seems to be falling behind. I'm still waiting for items that were supposed to ship May 21st.

Jun 22, 2020

redrich2000

Jul 15, 2020

mattrisSo, in your opinion, one amp you've never heard is not as good a value as another amp you've never heard. Thanks for that super useful input.

Jul 15, 2020

Jul 15, 2020

redrich2000I was merely passing on the assessments of respected audio equipment reviewers in an effort to inform those that may have been unaware.

Jul 15, 2020

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redrich2000

Jul 15, 2020

mattrisThat's really unhelpful. It gives the impression you know what you're talking about when you don't really. There's no info on what reviews or opinions you're basing it on. You'd be better to share links to the actual reviews so people can make up their own minds.

Jul 15, 2020

Jul 15, 2020

redrich2000That's good advice. But the only way for people to properly 'make up their own minds' would be to directly compare the amps themselves. But that's not really helpful either, as most people are likely not going to have the means, patience, or funds to do so. My advice was to skip both these hyped THX amps... and instead get a less-expensive amp that measures well. But really, why even concern oneself with measurements or cost? Ultimately, the goal should be to get an amp that sounds good with your DAC, your headphones, and your ears -- and not to worry about what's on sale at the moment or 'the flavor of the month'.

Jul 15, 2020

HeadJourney

Oct 5, 2020

mattrisYour advice bears thought. Trying to match one's existing balanced line-up makes no sense if the current components (source, DAC, headphones) are second rate. From a long-term perspective, it makes more sense to acquire first-rate components, first, one at a time (if total replacement isn't possible), such as the THX-888 or THX-789, and to gradually use it as a base to upgrade the rest of the components. (I got the Monolith THX-887.) The second component to upgrade might be the DAC or headphone. For the headphone, go for the best even if it's costly. If a person is into open-back, I'd suggest the HD800S and HD650 (HD6XX) as references. For the DAC, the Topping D90 is a good choice, but there are others just as good. I'm assuming that this person is into minimum distortion and prefers accuracy and clarity over warmth and thump. If the latter, then all bets are off.

Oct 5, 2020

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Oct 6, 2020

HeadJourneyIndeed, sound preferences are a personal matter with headphone systems. Some desire a somewhat lean, detailed (realistic) sound. Others prefer their music warm and dark. Then are are some some who like to customize the sound by using different headphones, earpads, DAC, and amps... or by implementing EQ. Further thoughts... "First-rate", "second rate", and "best" are subjective, relative terms. The THX AAA 887, 888, and 789 are amplifiers that represent a great value - but are absolutely not "first rate components". One's DAC is, by far, the least important component in one's audio set-up. The headphone and amplifier are vastly more important and should be chosen first. Being aware of the aural characteristics that headphones - or other components - can present (bassy, bright, lean, warm, detailed, veiled, sound-stage size, etc.) from first-hand experience is incredibly helpful when selecting a headphone, as is auditioning... and having 'reference headphones' to compare against. The vast majority of people cannot discern minor distortion differences between headphones or components. At the end of the day, specifications are simply measured performance - not a indication that one will be satisfied with a component affect on the resulting sound of their current system. A headphone system can feature "clarity" and "warmth and thump", as resolution is entirely independent of frequency response. And my last point for now... but certainly not the least notable: For most headphone listeners, comfort and the basic sound signature take priority over raw sound accuracy or low distortion. And for users of Bluetooth headphones, convenience features are also of greater importance.

Oct 6, 2020

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HeadJourney

Oct 6, 2020

mattrisRe rating equipment: I rely on distortion stats. First-rate = minimal distortion. The equipment I've listed are excellent in minimizing distortion. Stats take subjectivity out of the equation. A statement of "first-hand experience is incredibly helpful" -- No. These are subjective and based on a wide range of unknown factors. All major components (source, DAC, amp, headphones) are critical. A poor link in this chain degrades the whole. IF one's goal is accuracy, then selection should be determined by minimal distortion. "Clarity" and "warmth and thump" are at different ends of a distortion continuum. The greater the latter, the higher the distortion. Many prefer distortion, usually at the higher and lower ends. That's fine. Others prefer accuracy in replicating the source. "Resolution is entirely independent of frequency response" -- No, these are related. Frequency response is a measure of a system's response to a source.

Oct 6, 2020

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Oct 7, 2020

HeadJourneyYes, distortion stats take subjectivity out of the equation but do not indicate the final sound that will be produced with all components in use, being listened to with human ears... your ears. The THX amps you mentioned may have low measured distortion. But I remember that one reviewer noted that the 789's dynamic (peek amplitude) capabilities were inferior to his truly "first-rate" amplifiers. I'm all for being aware of a component's specifications. But I'll trust my own ears and "subjective" preferences over numbers... especially when using the multiple components that within a headphone system. The "wide range of unknown factors" become known if I hear them. Of course, "first-hand experience is incredibly helpful." Yes, a poor link in the chain degrades the whole. But I stand by my statement that one's headphones and amplifier are vastly more important than the system's DAC. (And it should go without saying that someone trying to attain hi-fi accuracy and/or pure musical enjoyment should not be listening to low-quality sources, such as low bit-rate files.) "Minimal distortion" is just one factor of many to consider when defining audio "accuracy". And always remember, human ears are not microphones or computers. We all hear a bit differently. "Clarity" and "warmth and thump" are at different ends of a distortion continuum. Incorrect. Clarity is simply a result of a component's ability to reproduce audio at a high resolution. Warmth and thump are characteristics of elevated lower frequencies and have nothing to do with "distortion". But I understand and agree that in order to achieve "accuracy in replicating the source", distortion should be minimized. Resolution and frequency response are not related, since a high-grade planar-magnetic (with superb resolution) can be tuned poorly (with inaccurate frequency response).

Oct 7, 2020

Xii-Nyth

Nov 26, 2021

mattrishow is it inferior sounding? its an amp, it makes wave go big

Nov 26, 2021

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Nov 26, 2021

Xii-NythBy definition, all amplifiers 'make waves go big.' Some amps make the waves go bigger and better. The lower-priced THX amps are (subjectively) inferior to many 'high-end' amplifiers, which can deliver greater dynamics, more power, and a larger (3D-like) sound-stage.

Nov 26, 2021

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Xii-Nyth

Nov 26, 2021

mattristhe only main thing that happens is something cant make ceratin waves go big so the bass is anemic etc, other than that amps dont actually really affect sound and its just in ur head

Nov 26, 2021

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