Cult of Audio 'Science' Review - Amir's Faithful
more_vert
I've noticed a rather lot of blind enthusiasm on these forums where people just drop a single link to an ASR 'review' without commentary as though Amir offers any authority on the subject. Amir is an ex software engineer, 'retired' Microsoft money (EDIT, Amir has corrected me, he is not a software engineer, this is my bad, his background is linked in his sig on ASF); he larps as though he understands hardware but a quick trip off the DAC reservation shows his ignorance very quickly. For instance, here he is needing to be told by one of his forum members that he can simply add a balanced cord to his HD650 to test balanced lol: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/so-what-is-a-common-balanced-headphone-for-testing.4949/ Dude seriously thought he needed an entirely new pair of headphones! LMAO. More fundamentally, he makes all sorts of commentary on spectrum shape at sub -110 dB levels, but offers no precision gauge in the form of repeated measurements. Seriously, look how skeevy Amir gets when the community tries to get him to measure a second Jotunheim (not unreasonable given how 'exceptional' his results were here compared to such a commonly measured unit). https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/schiit-jotunheim-has-no-grounding-hum-issues.6664/ As usual, the good folks at SBAF utterly eviscerate this clown: https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/modi-2u-and-d30-dac-deconstructing-amirs-hack-job-part-ii.6449/ Amir's measurements are one of many, and they often differ without explanation or (most damning!) investigation. His measurements are sub Jude-tier, get yourself a second (and third) opinion ;)
(Edited)
thumb_upSezciuc Radu Cristian, ceeveedee, and 31 others
33
146
remove_red_eye
18.3K
bookmark_border

search
Antiono
0
Aug 2, 2020
bookmark_border
He just measures the hardware for distortions and audio quality. So you can pick the best measuring product for your budget. Your opinion on how it actually sounds is not needed there. Thats what people fail to realize when they come there. Everyones ear is different and everyone has preferences so when it comes to critical hw measurements, its a pointless effort. He bashed some terribly measuring devices and people got salty because it also points out just how deaf people are. Or they like distortion. Whichever. I know this is a 2018 comment and its 2020 now. Schitt actually released an amp that is very different from their usual flavor and its super clean and analytical. Heresy i think its called. Clever naming given the history. Some people like hw distorting their music. Distortion is not musical imo.
Aug 2, 2020
1TotallyMuffin1
4
Jun 6, 2020
bookmark_border
The guys at Audio Science Review majors in passive aggressiveness i have honestly attempt to have several conversations with these people but it always ends up with them making assumptions about your person they are like a bunch of three year olds its just pathetic how incapable these grown adults are when it comes to having a productive conversation it always resort to them subscribing to logical fallacies ad hominem attacks and straw man argument all transpiring in a sandbox and there is so much hypocrisy going on at this forum its honestly insane why do they even continue measuring dacs if we reached a point were they are suppose to be audibly transparent just look up the dac at the top of their sinad chart and go to the review read the comments bunch of members of audio science review who wants to buy simply because it measures better even though it is audibly transparent according to themselves audibly transparent to a dac costing 15 times less
Jun 6, 2020
lupi900
17
Jun 11, 2020
bookmark_border
They've gushed over $350 DAC's being slightly better sinad than the $95 DAC's. While basing there opinions on headphones/speakers that rate 0.65 ~ 12.5%. These are the same morons that said they could tell a 0.7% ER4XR/SR but made a thread crying they couldn't tell a cheap speaker having 5% bass. Seems common trend of few audio groups that have high delusions about being experts of the subject.
Jun 11, 2020
autoteleology
443
Aug 6, 2020
bookmark_border
Your complete lack of any punctuation whatsoever in two paragraphs worth of text really shows off your independent, free thinking mindset. How can somebody not have deep respect for a person who won't let themselves be pushed around by Big Period? Keep on rocking in the free world, buddy.
Aug 6, 2020
Paperdragons
38
May 19, 2020
bookmark_border
If you're going to accuse ASR of being a cult you better not be linking SBAF as an example of reason. One of these places is much closer to a cult than the other.
May 19, 2020
needhelp
308
Apr 29, 2020
bookmark_border
people here are the reason why there are difference between audiophile vs audiofool. SBAF is the last place i would check because of their ignorants and circlejerking attitude. Given that people here hate the cheap recommendation offered by Amir, i suppose people here represents those manufacturers that is making snake oil. like that brand named their brand as faeces, they have many many blind supporters.
Apr 29, 2020
1TotallyMuffin1
4
Jun 6, 2020
bookmark_border
Cheap recommendations? Maybe if you live in the USA considering how Amirs recommendations usually ends up being praising either Topping or SMSL if you want to import those into Europe well tough luck cause its not going to be cheap anymore Topping is massively overrepresented at Audio Science Reviews i wonder why...
Jun 6, 2020
Birdperson365
29
Jun 13, 2020
bookmark_border
Because it measures well.
Jun 13, 2020
lupi900
17
Apr 4, 2020
bookmark_border
For a site that claims to be scientific i really love the total lack of it or the blind faith posters. Ignoring DAC testing, The community is just as cringy with headphones/speakers as they were with DAC's. They had a flame war on the headphone EQ thread how Etymotic's data and research are invaild because somehow Neutrality dosen't exist???. While using the very coloured Harman target(+8db Bass that bleeds into the mids & +7db 7Khz) as a weak example, Because of "Subjectivity". While bashing other headphones in other threads like Grado labs house sound as Subjective BS, Despite just arguing very badly why netural can't exist because everyone hears different & its a headphone. So yeah they have no issue disregarding scientific research & data they disagree with, While having zero clue what there talking about at the same time?. I can see why the site was a massive hit on Reddit headphones since that subbreddit is just as dense if not more so, Since they 180 there "facts" every month & more hostile when they are challenged on there opinions/views.
(Edited)
Apr 4, 2020
needhelp
308
Apr 29, 2020
bookmark_border
i supposed you DO know why Harman target has +8db right? I mean, what is Harman if compared to a fellow audiophile like you, right? let me guess, you are the main maker for speakers for all the events and concert? I mean, Harman seems like a joke to you. so do Amir. Care to share what do you do for a living?
Apr 29, 2020
lupi900
17
May 15, 2020
bookmark_border
Are you having a laugh?, The Etymotic ER4SR sounds better than that target but just cry audiophile because i disagree with a site/tuning target?. Your just doing the whole ASR/Reddit thing make a off topic rant instead of facing any slight or use hyperbolic arguments. Why would i care about a 0.008% DAC when the headphones/speakers are <0.4 ~ 10%?. That forum had a meltdown over speakers having higher THD than headphones like one being >5% under 100Hz & >1% at 1Khz+, Because it challenged the >1% THD is audbile claim that parroted there when i brought up the ER4XR/ER4SR on ASR/Reddit. Which would've gotten them laughed out of any veteran speaker group that delt with any THD chart.
May 15, 2020
tivo
1
Feb 19, 2020
bookmark_border
Amir's testing methods are questionable...why filter out the 1khz test signal source in fft results? Makes no sense to me, as standard audio (amplifier) tests typically use an extremely low-distortion 1khz oscillator in distortion measurements. Besides, adding a filter alters the test enviroment from 'normal' operating conditions. link >> https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-massdrop-x-grace-design-sdac.2495/
Feb 19, 2020
Kris2014
62
Feb 28, 2020
bookmark_border
You should also check his Benchmark DAC1 measurement. He got significantly worse THD+N numbers, and everyone on his side went silent after manufacturer stepped in and pointed out the problem. Total failure. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-benchmark-dac1-usb-dac.3708/
Feb 28, 2020
lupi900
17
Apr 4, 2020
bookmark_border
ASR, Is walking joke for THD+N focused topics. The userbase there will go quiet if you question there claim 1% distortion on ER4XR is audbile, When speakers can mesure higher than that & still sound fantastic.
Apr 4, 2020
kpowers
4
Feb 19, 2020
bookmark_border
I've always enjoyed ASR, but I never base my decisions on one guys opinion, that's for sure :) Always a good idea to do your own research, even if they are an internet celebrity...
Feb 19, 2020
andrewdavis7
87
Jan 2, 2020
bookmark_border
I can appreciate folks choosing to trust their ears over measurements. This is all about sensory enjoyment, right? Where the "subjectivist" argument falls down is where they refuse to do any rigorous blinded listening tests. If you trust your ears completely, why not?
(Edited)
Jan 2, 2020
Kris2014
62
Feb 10, 2020
bookmark_border
Measurement can tell a story. Thing is, Amir picks what to show. If one care to compare the way SBAF do their measurement, you will see Amir's measurements never look into transients. And he can apply different methods on the same subject. He tested how USB cables affects SQ. In that test he looked at Jitter measurement. But sometimes some devices output higher noise but less jitter than a "quieter" device. How does that translate into sound from DAC's analog output? Despite he tries to demonstrate affects in SQ, he choose not to directly measure sound as if he was to test analog cable.
Feb 10, 2020
stevenswall
19
Feb 28, 2020
bookmark_border
Yeah, it's really hard to do blind listening tests. Thankfully, that ASR website has lots of people who will talk about the that picks up the slack when the subjectivist argument falls down: the research that has been done with blind tests that can be applied to measurements to calculate a user preference score. I had no idea about this score, but discovered ASR once I got my Genelec 8260 monitors after a year and a half of buying and returning things that were sub par... Come to find out, the 8341, with much less bass extension, is one of the highest scoring things they've measured, so for me, (and I think about 90% of people based on the research,) from a purely acoustic standpoint, it is quite valuable to go off of the preference scores there. That being said, a lot of people don't think of audio reproduction as a science, and it hurts ones ego to think that their tastes can be predicted when they aren't being guided by their eyes and thoughts about what 'should' sound good. In any case, if someone is an outlier or some speakers don't quite fit that system, so be it. I'm quite happy to have a source where I can look for speakers that play well across genres and for the super-majority of people who genuinely want something that sounds good over all else... Just ask me: My speakers are more ugly than anyone else's I've met, and also much flatter and better sounding to me, though my prior self would have said "flat means clinical and it's all subjective, and I listen to X music so I need a matching set of speakers and a synergistic amp." At the end of the day I think ASR and other places are good to pick candidates from, but at some point people have to be willing to return things instead of justifying their purchase. If someone returns 10 things for every 1 they keep, I'd trust their perspective a lot more than most who buy something and then give it a glowing review. As far as my own experience before knowing of ASR: Genelec 8260>Neumann KH80>JBL LSR 308... and this is borne out by measurements and calculated preference scores at ASR. Maybe one day they will also measure the other speakers I listened to but didn't keep: Genelec 1031, Mackie HR824, Devialet Phantom Reactor. Don't have an opinion about the DAC stuff on ASR, as most decent DACs are transparent, and I spent the bulk of my money on things that make a difference, and little to none on things that don't.
Feb 28, 2020
FuzzyFluffy
3
Jan 2, 2020
bookmark_border
The forum is a circlejerk orchestrated by an incompetent administrator with a wild imagination... giving the owner money gives you permisson to treat anyone you dont agree with like shit

(Edited)
Jan 2, 2020
PierreLovesHeadphones
25
Dec 13, 2019
bookmark_border
Reading this thread after 1 year. This is kind of sad. I have noted on ASR a second person is doing reviews with another measurement devices and finding more or less the same thing as Amir. Measurements are likely to be correct. They proved that price and quality are not correlated. Most of the DAC measured are excellent to the point that no audible differences exist between them. After that you believe want you want, if having an expensive DAC makes you happy or having a DAC which colored the sound, that's absolutely fine.
Dec 13, 2019
Kris2014
62
Jun 1, 2020
bookmark_border
ASR is just a differently religion. SBAF is all about getting along with others, ASR is about not to. It might sound strange, but as folks in ASR use only measurements to express themselves, so they hide their thoughts/opinions/emotions away from others. To me ASR people are just terrible in communication.
(Edited)
Jun 1, 2020
lupi900
17
Jun 6, 2020
bookmark_border
Ironiclly they just banned few posters on the limits of science thread, And the thread is off topic mess. The forum is full of people who pretend there smarter than they really are who sound 16 too.
(Edited)
Jun 6, 2020
Showing 33 of 146
keyboard_arrow_up
Newest
146 OF 146 POSTS
Aug 12, 2020
keyboard_arrow_down
Oldest