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callow
103
May 1, 2017
Any chance of JIS compatibility, or do the renders include every key in the kit?
Koatl
181
May 2, 2017
callowYo man. Comparing your render with MiTo's I see it would have to be ISO to fit all the necessary keys. Is that right? Based on that I'm curious if you can recommend any boards and keysets that are JIS compatible. Also, are you saying with the current layout of Laser it would simply not be JIS compatible? Thanks for your time and effort dude. EDIT: After a bit of research, I understand it is not exactly ISO. Still curious about your recommendations though. Thanks!
MiTo
13955
MiTo
May 2, 2017
callowHey my bro, thanks for the reply. The renders include (almost) all keycaps that I'd like to see included in the kit. The actual kit is going to have symmetry tilde and backslash as well, but I don't think I'll be able to provide full JIS support because it's far too many keycaps. I'll check with the manufacturer, but I don't think it's going to happen to be quite honest... I hope you understand, after all the purpose behind the hiragana kits is merely aesthetics!
callow
103
May 2, 2017
KoatlI have a Japanese IBM Pingmaster and I’m planning a JIS 60% (with a non‐JIS bottom row because no PCB supports it). JIS is ISO enter, split right shift, and split backspace. It also has a very full bottom row with about ten modifiers. Very little in the way of Cherry MX boards support JIS (though they do exist), you would probably need to make a custom for a 60%. Filco has made Japanese Majestouch boards, that might be your best bet if you can’t do a custom. As for keycaps, I don’t know of any enthusiast sets. I keep trying to persuade people though. Pingmasters have excellent caps, but they’re old‐style mount ALPS not Cherry MX. The way things are looking right now, MiTo decided to go with DSA Otaku style legends, basically US ANSI with Hiragana where the same keys are on a JIS keyboard, but two kana have to be moved and the chōonpu is missing altogether. The JIS layout itself has punctuation in different places than US ANSI, so altogether they are incompatible.
callow
103
May 2, 2017
MiToYeah I understand, all the same I think I prefer that opinions are considered even when it means I rarely get what I want. I appreciate all your time and consideration, I’ll definitely be buying some kits of this set for sure!
MiTo
13955
MiTo
May 2, 2017
callowI appreciate your support, contribution and enthusiasm. I'm very fortunate to have engaged community members assisting me with this project, contributing with their time and whatever they can. Always open to criticism, feedback and suggestions mate so if you (and anyone) have any suggestions (at anytime), please drop a reply!
Koatl
181
May 2, 2017
callowI see. Slim pickings indeed. Hopefully full JIS sets start coming out. Have you ever considered making one? Or have you been able to convince anyone to eventually develop one?
callow
103
May 2, 2017
KoatlI’m not quite sure I have the connections or skill to have a set made. Regardless, if the Japanese‐look kit for this set passes MOQ, it will greatly reduce the amount of new legends required for a JIS group buy in GMK. Naturally a dye‐sub set (DSA perhaps?) would be completely unproblematic, so there are open avenues. Signature Plastics has 2.5u and 4.5u keycaps in DCS and SA already, which should cover Filco JIS and most other common JIS layouts.
/u/beamingrobot on reddit was designing a DSA set with Japanese alphas and seemed very receptive to JIS compatibility, but IDK what ever came of that and there was the problem of mixing materials (dyesub PBT Kana alphas, doubleshot ABS mods). To be honest, I think most group buy organizers (rightly) focus on meeting the demands of the community and it’s hard to persuade them to support niche layouts for no real reason except that I and a handful of other people want them to. Regardless, DSA doesn’t have an ISO enter mold, and it seems wrong to design a set in a profile without a key the set needs.
Once SP works out the kinks in dyesub SA, that might be a good candidate for a JIS group buy – all the right key sizes and no worrying about the price for molds. GMK double shot is also promising, but they don’t really have the molds to outfit the space bar for any existent JIS keyboard and designing a PCB using a common key size for the space bar is its own can of worms.
Personally if I were to run a group buy very soon I would do classic beige GMK with icon mods and JIS alphas for the most broad appeal, and include ANSI compatibility because I don’t think a set without it is going to hit MOQ any time soon. It wouldn’t fit spacebars for most actual JIS keyboards, but that’s the best option for the JIS layout right now IMO.
Koatl
181
May 2, 2017
callowThank you for all the info. Of the options you mention I would definitely prefer the classic beige GMK. I hope you pursue it, and that this kit goes through to make true JIS more feasible. Where is the best place for me to keep in contact with you, in case you do produce something?
callow
103
May 2, 2017
KoatlHonestly I’m not planning to, you are just as equipped as I am to begin if you want. I have a lot on my plate at the moment, but maybe one day I’ll explore the options if nothing else appears.
Koatl
181
May 4, 2017
MiTo@callow & @MiTo , please correct me (or ignore me ^__^) if I'm wrong, but wouldn't there only be a few more caps needed to make it fully JIS compatible? Would it be worth just adding those few extra keys, that way people can choose between this ANSI layout and JIS?
callow
103
May 4, 2017
KoatlNo I discussed this on Geekhack, it would only be four if the Kana only mods won, but as it is it would require fifteen or so.
Koatl
181
May 4, 2017
callowThat's a shame. So close.
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