BLON BossHifi B8 Wooden Headphones Discussions | Drop

BLON BossHifi B8 Wooden Headphones

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Dec 28, 2018

Just out of curiosity what is the point of all these wood-earcup headphones? Natural hardwoods have resonances that are difficult to control, compared with synthetic materials or engineered wood. So at best wood earcups would have no positive impact on the sound and at worst add colorations. I guess it's all about looks?

Dec 28, 2018

ralphgonzIt's all about dampening and how that manufacturer uses that wood to create a unique sound. Fostex, Denon, ZMF, Audeze, Audioquest, etc., all use different woods and methods to craft the sound as they want. Not to mention how the cups are cut and shaped also plays a huge part on the sound before we get to their density. There isn't a right answer to which is best and goes back to the tube vs solid state amplifier argument. Just different flavors for different tastes. This is a good, brief overview from ZMF who uses the wildest array of woods that I have ever seen from any manufacturer: http://www.zmfheadphones.com/wood/ and https://www.wood-database.com/wood-articles/hardwood-anatomy/.

Dec 28, 2018

jaydunndidditSo you're saying it's for people who don't care to hear the pure recording in its original form, but who want to add resonances particular to the type of wood. One problem I see with this is that resonances are uncorrelated between the L and R earcups. So for example say you have a recording of a violin positioned at center-stage. It seems that you would like your headphones to add a new wooden resonance to the violin sound. But if your earcups add resonances these will be uncorrelated (due to differences in wood density distribution in the L and R earcups) and will fail to convince your ears that the resonance is coming from the violin. Your ears will instead hear a violin in the center, a separate wooden resonance far left, and another separate wooden resonance far right. Add more instrumentation and your stereo image will suffer. That said, these resonances may be much lower in level than ZMF would have you believe, so may have only minor detrimental effects.

Vote

Dec 28, 2018

ralphgonzWell, I'm glad you're the final word on what constitutes as "pure." The industry can't even agree on what is truly considered "neutral." Hearing is subjective, hence my statement about flavors. If you have an issue with wood and resonances, then I am going to assume you hate tubes, and vinyl, and R2R dacs due to how they tend to "color" the sound? You also seem to be misguided and are focusing solely on the resonance of the wood. No matter the material of the enclosure and the driver or dampening scheme, there will be resonance of some sort. That's why CSD and spectrum plots are so important. We also have measurements that show driver matching. What makes it also special is the amount of time it takes to tune wooden cups properly as you have to know each species to be able to use their unique individual qualities. The cutting and shaping plays alongside the density and porous nature of each wood, controlling resonance depending on these factors as well as the driver type and whether they're open or closed. Hell, you can even get low-frequency resonance from an "undamped" bounce from an ear-pad. And it's not as if plastic and metal enclosures don't impart their own characteristics on sounds as well. The same for a biodyna driver compared to a beryllium driver. What you have presented is purely speculative and goes against the various measurements we have at our disposal. And sadly, it's not as simplistic as you seem to think it is or are making it out to be.

Dec 29, 2018

jaydunndidditAh, you are not an unbiased party, now I understand.

Dec 29, 2018

ralphgonzAnd you're ignorant about the topic of this discussion and have provided nothing of value. But, I guess that should be expected from your previous replies.

Dec 29, 2018

jaydunndidditI think that we have different philosophies of music reproduction. Let's keep things from being mean spirited.

Dec 29, 2018

ralphgonzIt has nothing to do about music reproduction. You made some baseless claims about resonance and how it colors the sound. Then called me biased, while providing no proof and speculating wildly about the matter you inquired about initially. You quite literally ignored every valid point I've brought to this discussion. Again, you have not provided anything of value in the query that you yourself raised. There's nothing wrong with being ignorant about a new topic, but you're being obstinate for no reason.

Dec 30, 2018

jaydunndidditThese are not baseless claims. They are well known facts in the loudspeaker design community about how wooden enclosures can collapse the stereo image in the absence of treatment to prevent uncontrolled resonances. I believe that these concepts apply to wooden headphone enclosures as well. The ZMF link you provided indicates that colorations due to uncontrolled resonances are a design decision. I'm willing to chalk that up to a difference in music reproduction philosophy. As far as you being biased, I may owe you an apology on that one. When I read your response ("We also have measurements that show driver matching") I took the term "we" to mean that you represented a manufacturer. If this is not the case then I'm sorry about that conclusion, and I can see where my comment may have offended you.

Dec 30, 2018

ralphgonzRight. We're not discussing loudspeakers here, but headphones. Technically, I could also lump in IEMs as well since they will have more in common with headphone tuning (vs loudspeaker) and their housings can also be made of various types of wood. And this is just one part of the equation which is what I'm trying to get you to understand. What you know about loudspeakers is not going to apply here. With headphones, as I stated, even if we were to take a wooden enclosure out of the equation completely, we have so many other factors to worry about when it comes to resonance. The earpads shape and material (pad bounce causes resonance), the headband (a poorly damped headband can transmit resonance), dampening scheme (a huge effect on resonance), driver type and material (Beryllium, Biodyna, Alum-Mag or Dynamic vs Planar vs Electrostat), and whether that headphone or IEM is open or closed. And unlike loudspeakers, headphones and IEMs come in a larger variety of housing configurations and some can have sculpted/tuned chambers inside of that (Campfire Audio uses something called T.E.A.C.). Now, the above is a lot to consider for any product in hopes of controlling unwanted resonances irrespective of the enclosure being made of wood. And like wood, other housing materials have their own unique density (aluminum, stainless steel, ceramic, ABS, etc). And due to the very high density of certain woods (Ebony is my favorite) they have a natural ability to dampen better than almost any other material. This is all dependent on how the chamber is cut and shaped as well if it needs to be vented or ported and whether that headphone is going to be open or closed. Like I stated prior, you seem to keep trying to make this simpler than it really is. Here, another user that has one of the wooden headphone MD sells was kind enough to break their's down while swapping wood cups: https://www.massdrop.com/buy/e-mu-teak-headphones/talk/621451. There, you can see how the two woods are cut differently. And this is just how that manufacturer likes to do theirs. And if you're really wanting to take it up a notch, you would look at something like the Lawton cups: https://www.lawtonaudio.com/tonewheel.html. And, just so I am thorough, these resonance issue you speak up still exist in headphones that are made purely out of plastic and metal just like the revered HD 800 s: https://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-hd-800-s-tweaked-and-delightfuland-french-diy-response-measurements. And despite its VERY fancy absorber technology and it still cannot escape from some unwanted resonance. And no offense taken. I am just another avid, passionate hobbyist at the end of the day. Your query got my attention, is all. I meant "we" as the community at large. There are a lot of great folks out there taking measurements of all our gear (and loudspeakers) so we can objectively view them under a microscope alongside our subjective listening experience. If anything, I urge you to get some ear time with these types of headphones and make up your own mind. That's where the fun is in this hobby.

JoeBi

Jan 24, 2019

ralphgonzI don't think these are wood. They look, feel, and click like hard PLASTIC.

factsvsfeelings

Aug 22, 2019

JoeBiThe outer material is indeed wood. Your thoughts are irrelevant it is or it isnt. And this most certinally is.

•

JoeBi

Aug 29, 2019

factsvsfeelingsIt seems like a composite -- more plastic than wood, like shaved wood molded and glued to plastic, for decoration. They look fine and are sturdy, so poor design for normal humans head is the real hurdle with these. Apparently there are 3rd party pads at various prices that help give these the fit (for some heads at least) that these worth the price.

(Edited)

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