Showing 1 of 7264 conversations about:
RayF
13329
Apr 7, 2018
bookmark_border
Last drop: ordered on Jan 9th, received Mar 22nd--hope your's don't take as long!
search
By the way, they don't look very much like the photos MD is showing--the color is MUCH darker, almost black (as others have noted). It's only a cosmetic issue, but I promise no one is going to accuse you of wearing a pair of Navy Blue Sennheisers.
Next subject I'd mention is that of upgrading the standard cable to something more...expensive.
I did, and don't recommend my choice. My purpose in doing so was to utilize the balanced connection on the Schiit Jotunhiem DAC/AMP. I chose the Van Damme Audio Instrument balanced cable. Verdict: not really worth it. Perhaps some benefit to the sound quality, but the cable itself is heavy, long and difficult to connect to the 6XX (the stock cables just plug right into the left and right sockets but the Van Damme's are very fidgety to insert an once connected, don't feel that secure). That, and obviously you're not going to plug the business end of that balanced cable to anything portable. In the end it's just easier to stick with one cable that works with both your desk set up and carry along set up.
All that aside, I'm pretty sure you'll like the sound of the 6XXs.
Update: Happy to report MD accepted my return of the Van Damme cable; no questions asked.
Apr 7, 2018
Jeff-D
203
Apr 8, 2018
bookmark_border
I hope we get them sooner. Thanks for the feedback its always helpful to hear first hand impressions. Its been a month for me so far. I feel like it's massdrop's evil plan to get us hyped up more so we buy stuff while we wait lol (it worked on me) I got a dac/amp combo and earphones. The deals here are so good it can be addicting.
I really appreciate your'e feedback on the cable. I was wondering if it was worth getting a balanced cable and im starting to think its not worth it unless I come into some random money.
Apr 8, 2018
RayF
13329
Apr 8, 2018
bookmark_border
Yes their evil plan worked on me too--that's where that cable came from--not to mention another pair of cans (Hifi Man 4XXs--still MIA), not to mention a Jotunheim. Aside from the cable, I'm happy with what I ended up with vs the dent in my checking account. I'll have to get back to on the 4XXs.
I'm guessing your 6XXs won't take as long as ours did (rumor had it that our container ship was hijacked and held for ransom by Somali Pirates). Now I hear MD actually has yours in stock somewhere in America!
Good luck ;- )
Apr 8, 2018
Jeff-D
203
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
I wanted to get the 4xx but I couldn't justify it since I havnt gotten my 6xx yet. They are definitely what I am looking at next once I get my 6xx.
I didnt know they are in America already that's so awesome! I thought I was going to have to wait until August.
Apr 9, 2018
RayF
13329
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
Well I don't mean to get your hopes up too high--you can never be sure with these guys.
I'm curious as hell to compare the 6xx to the 4xxs. I suppose it's Apples to Oranges, but it's hard to imagine not liking one over the other for some reason. I was tempted by the AKG K7XXs too, but resisted. I don't really want to become one of those guys with 50 headphones.
By the way, I decided to return that Van Damm cable. MD said no problem and sent me a UPS label. Much as I bitch about them, they do tend to make things right.
Apr 9, 2018
Jeff-D
203
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
Yeah I also looked at the AKG 7XX but I saw some not so great reviews and the frequency response looks very similar to the 6XX. I feel like the 4XX would be more worth it since it would be so different from the 6XX.
I too wonder which I will like more but I thought Id go with the sennheisers since they have such a great reputation. Ive never heard someone say they HATE the 6XX/650.
Apr 9, 2018
RayF
13329
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
Both good points. I have become a little concerned about the 4xx after I saw a few posts showing where and how they break. Literately break: broken headbands, broken ear cup attachment points. I hope they've addressed those issues. Would be pointless to make good sounding cans that can't stand up to everyday use! Guess we'll find out?
Apr 9, 2018
Dela
1
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
Hey I just got the jot with the multi bit dac included. Quick question how loud do you put your volume on it for the 6xxs? I'm a bit disappointed at the sound so far and I want to make sure I didn't get a faulty one. I gotta go at least half way on high gain. Thanks
Apr 9, 2018
RayF
13329
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
Kind of tough to say--I don't have the multi-bit, just the gen2 standard DAC, but I'd say for LOUD listening, half-way (on hi-gain) is about right. I also have a pair of JBL 300 series speakers connected (pre-amp outs) and half-way on those would drive me out of the room!
Apr 9, 2018
Evshrug
1388
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
My experience: most cables sound about the same, some sound WORSE than stock, a few sound better than stock. Unfortunately, you’ve just gotta go with ones you can demo, or recommendations from someone you trust.
The Sennheiser HD 6XX cable (similar to the cable that came bundled with my HD 650 & Apogee Groove combo, except mine is shorter) is actually pretty nice quality. Supple, light, left and right channels are kept separate till they reach the termination plug, only thing is the termination plug isn’t a fancy looking carbon fiber affair.
I’ve tried aftermarket cables with an AKG K712 Pro, a Sony at a CanJam RMAF, and three different cables with my Sennheiser HD 800. The stock cable is already quite good, so getting a cheap cable would probably be a downgrade. I heard the HD 800 first time when a friend let me listen to his, with a cool looking Norne Draug cable. Looked sick in the red color, was thinner than the stock cable, and I got shivers the moment first song started playing (among other reactions), but we didn’t compare to stock so I have no idea. First time/brand I definitely heard something different just because of a cable was my buddy bringing over a DanaCable. That thing kicked ***, the balance of frequency response seemed the same but the dynamics, impact, and clarity were so much obviously better that it shocked me. Based on prior experience trying a Mogami (star quad?) microphone cable that I had a friend re-terminate for my k712, and hearing no difference that couldn’t be down to just placebo, and a similar experience with the Sony, I was ready to say “Eh, not worth it unless I come into some random money.” But with the DanaCable, the upgrade was a bigger leap than when I upgraded my Schiit Bifrost Uber to a classic Theta multibit DAC. I also have a buddy who works at a high end audio store (lucky), and he let me try out a high-end Nordost, and that too was clearer, lifting the haze and letting more music through, but price was a bit prohibitive for me. I hadn’t fallen into money yet, but I had decided a good cable (from a good brand, with return policy) would be my next upgrade because I pretty much love my HD 800 (I don’t find the treble too hot, or at least not irritating like the DT 880 was for me).
Last year, A friend of mine who DIY’d his own cables offered to make me one for the cost of materials and shipping, but the cable got lost in shipping and the friend didn’t get insurance on it, so I was simply out the money. Major bummer. This year though, I talked to a few nice people from cable companies at CanJam NYC, (shout out to the folks at Cardas and DanaCable!), but I got a CanJam show offer on a Wireworld Cable that I couldn’t pass up.
My Wireworld Eclipse Platinum cable for my HD 800 is flat, as short as my HD 650 cable, balanced (Pentaconn for my HDV 820, and the upcoming amp module for the FiiO X7!), lighter than the stock cable, and a calm gray color. All silver, which some think would make the HD 800 sound brighter, but it’s not. The better conductor, plus the design, results in simply more of everything. It’s like putting on glasses for your ears - same colors, but clearer, better contrast. I do feel it’s worth the cost over Sennheiser’s XLR balanced cable (plus I wanted a shorter cable, since my amps are on my computer desk), but of course the Sennheiser cable costs less.
If you look at the cost of a replacement stock cable, don‘t expect a lower cost aftermarket cable will sound better, unless you specifically are looking for a cable that causes distortion and coloration. If you want to try the DIY route, and you buy exceptional materials better than the OFC stock cables, and you foresee making several cables over the lifetime of the equipment you’ll have to buy, and you understand that you might mess up an attempt or two... go ahead. If you just want a shorter or prettier cable without trying to also get a sound upgrade... go ahead. Just don’t expect a cable substantially cheaper to sound better than stock. I haven’t tried all cables, and unfortunately I have found some that would only be a side-grade or downgrade. However, I have found that some cables genuinely do give you what you pay for.
Apr 9, 2018
Evshrug
1388
Apr 9, 2018
bookmark_border
Unless it’s leftover stock from a previous drop, the Massdrop x Sennheiser headphones are essentially made-to-order, that and shipping them all en-masse to Massdrop is why there is a wait between the drop and ship date.
My AKG 712 Pro had an airy, big soundstage sound, while my HD 650 have more body and a richer sound. Similar but different. Now that I have an HD 800, I don’t use the AKG, because the HD 800 is similar but better in basically every way, but sometimes I still use the HD 650.
Apr 9, 2018
Jeff-D
203
Apr 10, 2018
bookmark_border
That was an incredible in-depth response. Thank you for all the information I enjoyed reading about your experience. This has me curious about cables especially since you said it made a bigger impact then getting a better DAC. I will continue to look into this and if the opportunity arises I might get a better cable.
Apr 10, 2018
Evshrug
1388
Apr 10, 2018
bookmark_border
Thanks Jeff!
Halfway through, I realized how long it was going to be... glad it was interesting anyway! Sometimes, I can’t help it... I think I’m “going there“ again.
Upgrading a DAC seems to result in an upgrade in organic tone, reduced congestion, sweetness instead of glare, and just sounding more “real.” Sometimes, especially the first few upgrades up the budget ladder, this realism also helps with the sense of depth and distance.
Upgrading an amp can help lower distortion, what sounds like signal break-up, help with bass control and that “solid” body feeling, and increase the note separation and sensation of depth in the soundstage.
Upgrading my cable did what I thought a DAC upgrade would do... clear some haze, and have that “glasses for your ears” feeling. I specifically was NOT looking for a frequency response change, but what it did was an across the board quality-up. Small but significant change. Opportunities to demo are rare, but precious. If you don’t hear the change, don’t buy/return the cable!
I think we are most sensitive to frequency response and tonal changes. That’s why most people focus on upgrading headphones first. I started out trying to find my preference, then the “holy grail quest” for the best headphone to fit my preference, but eventually things mushroom out and you begin to explore. I figured out my frequency/tonal balance back around the $300 headphone mark. After that, it’s little differences that make ALL the difference. Know what I mean? Like, the soundstage is a little bit deeper, but suddenly it’s out of the uncanny valley and great recordings sometimes fool me, or the paddig is just a liiiiittle bit softer and thicker, suddenly I can forget the headphones. I love my HD 800, but now I have a DAC/Amp that costs more than my headphone (Sennheiser HDV 820), a fairly expensive aftermarket headphone cable, and... well I’m pretty happy, but who knows what the next itch will be? Oh, yeah, virtual surround DSPs ;)
Apr 10, 2018
Jeff-D
203
Apr 10, 2018
bookmark_border
Thanks for clearing up what each of the components do. I am relatively new to all this so having you explain what each part of the chain does is valuable info. Also after hearing my first HIFI earphones, that I recently bought, I can see where this is going already. Just the other day my girlfriend told me "no more spending money on headphones", and that really made me feel like one you HIFI audio people haha.
I'm excited to get my 6XX and my X1s for my first serious HIFI setup. Right now I am using the MEE Audio PX with my LG V20 which sounds great for little earphones. Im really looking forward to using my Dac/Amp combo with them to see if there is a difference. I noticed a small difference between my computers onboard audio and my V20 with the earphones so I'm hoping once i get the X1S I'll notice an even bigger improvement. I think it sounds sharper and there is more separation with the V20 but not a whole lot. It also sounds clearer, for example, when I plug something into my computer there can be a slight hiss and a loud noise when I plug them in or unplug them.
Apr 10, 2018
Evshrug
1388
Apr 11, 2018
bookmark_border
New to the hobby, and already getting an HD 650? *adopts a cane and a wavering voice* “Why, Pepperidge Farm remembers when a $70 Grado was the young audiophile’s first step into a larger world.”
I started back in 2009, looking for a way to play videogames without bugging dormmates. I consider the HD 6XX, AKG K7XX, Beyerdynamic DT 880, and other units in the $200-$400 range to be “mid-fi“ headphones, where I spent 6-7 years and for most people the point where they stop (Sigh of relief for your wife). The three I mentioned used to be their company’s respective flagships, before headphones started to get really popular and even higher quality options were developed. Going to a CanJam event was when I jumped to hi-fi, but that‘s a story for another day.
I assume you mean the Aune X1s? Honestly never tried it myself, but read good things and the companies products are popular enough. Should be a nice start.
I had a thought last night, about organizing the relative price - to - performance value of components and headphones. This is partially based on how better DACs at lower prices have been available in the past two years or so. In order of lowest cost:performance to higher cost:
Headphone (~$50): better off sticking to the amp and DAC built into a phone > computer, plus EQ software to tame anything painful.
Headphone (~$100-$150)> Amp ($50-$100)
Headphone (~$300, Massdrop deals skew this) > Amp ($200-$350) > DAC ($150-250)
Headphone (~$500-$900)> Amp (~$500-$1500) > Cables (~$300) > DAC (~$400-$700)
Headphone (~$1k and up) > Amp (~$2k and up) > Cables (~$800 and up) > DAC (~$2k and up)
Headphone (~$55k) > it probably came with everything you need XD but why not buy other stuff at this point?
Now, I’m constantly learning, so all the above is my current opinion based on observation, subject to change. Sometimes, there’s also exceptions, like many people prefer the HD 650’s tone over even much more expensive headphones, and build up a system around that. You may notice user setups that often have amps and DACs priced higher than the headphones once they start to reach mid-fi headphones... not uncommon, as a good headphone often can get even more performance squeezed out of it.
I think it’s also important to consider that most people have smartphones, with built-in DACs and Amps (why Apple, whyyyyyy? I have an iPhone 8+), and consider if an amp or DAC really is an upgrade over what is built into the phone. I would say the LG V20 has pretty good stuff including a DAC that only starts to get beat by the time you look at something around $200-$300. Of course, an HD 6XX will benefit from something better than the typical portable amp, and we don’t always listen through our smartphones.
I also think the value of surround DSPs are underestimated. OK, sure, sensing front and back (and height?) directions are obviously benefits to gamers, and headphones playing plain stereo have been enjoyed for decades. However, headphones uniquely project the position of sounds inside our head. Pan left-to-right and it’s like something just shot through your skull. Nothing we naturally hear sounds like that, it’s a step away from realism. Some music is recorded in a special way for headphones, where the result sounds like music in front of you (Chesky Records’ binaural albums, for example), but most music (and movies) were mixed for speakers which are already supposed to be in front of you. Simple crossfeeds reduce the irritation of hard-panned music, but still don’t recreate that “in front of you” holographic 3D sense. I think we’ll see more software and hardware DSP (digital signal processor) options in the near future, and become increasingly desirable and sophisticated.
Apr 11, 2018
Jeff-D
203
Apr 11, 2018
bookmark_border
Once again coming back with these awesome responses haha.
Ok so when I say relatively new I mean because I don't have a set of HiFi cans. My IEMs are pretty good but I feel like they don't give me exactly what I am looking for.
I started back in high school with some beats *barf*. When I got to college I thought they were awesome headphones since they were the only thing I had heard that were better than apple ear buds. My room mate had these $70 cans and I always assumed my headphones were better. One day he asked if I wanted to switch for a day to see the differences. I was shocked when his 70$ headphones sounded better than my $300 fancy beats.
Skip a few years and I live off campus to an apartment and use some old Altec Lansing speakers. They were pretty good great bass extension but the mids are really muffled and the highs are decent. I got the Bose soundlink 3 Bluetooth speaker and really liked the clarity and better balance so I got some Bose computer speakers and was really impressed with them. They had similar clarity and balance to my bluetooth speaker but the added stereo effect made them sound worlds apart.
I had been going numerous pairs of cheap earphone thinking that there was no way earphones could sound good because of how small they are. I read some stuff on HeadFi and people were saying how far IEMs had come so I decided since I have the V20 why not try some better IEMs. I got the MEE audio PX and was really blown away by how good these little earphones were.
I had been reading about headphones and once I saw the legendary 650/6XX drop I just couldn't pass it up. I thought when will I ever get a deal this good again. It was perfect timing the Aune X1S was on sale also.
So that catches us upto today I'm sitting here watching reviews and reading forms and massdrop comments eagerly waiting for my set up to arrive. Its going to take forever but once it gets here I expect I'm going to be one happy camper.
Any way I thought I'd give you my listening background since you have offered me so much useful info with you're informative and inciteful comments. Thanks again.
Apr 11, 2018
Tuneslover
41
Apr 11, 2018
bookmark_border
I have a buddy that knows how to solder so he cut the stock cable about 1 ft from the plug end and then soldered on XLR connectors to the cut ends giving me a balanced cable AND an XLR-to-SE adaptor. The male & female XLR connectors cost me $10 and a few beers afterwards.
Apr 11, 2018
Evshrug
1388
Apr 11, 2018
bookmark_border
@Jeff-D hopefully this is something fun while waiting. I’ve heard some stellar IEMs, but fit is a problem for me, haha. I even had a CIEM attempt fail, though that was mostly my fault because I had my ears cleaned right before having impressions made, and I guess my ears were swollen enough to mess up the impression. Close enough that I tried to live with it past the return period, heh.
@Tuneslover some stock cables are wired so that they can go balanced. You described a good option, if you already have a balanced-wired cable, need shorter and same quality cable but in balanced termination, and you have access to soldering. Learning to solder isn’t hard, but a lot of people don’t feel like picking up a new hobby, nor have a friend who solders.
If I wanted to solder, I could buy cabling at wholesale. Something to keep in mind.
I’m on the fence about putting a really good cable on an HD 6XX. Haven’t tried it.
Apr 11, 2018
Tuneslover
41
Apr 11, 2018
bookmark_border
I bought a specialized cable for my HD650 (unfortunately I forget the name of the company) and hated how it took the life out of the headphones. It was heavy and hard to manipulate so I sold it and went back to the stock cable. No complaints with the stock cable whatsoever. I'm sure there are good aftermarket cables out there but I'm turned off by the prices. I've read that the change in sound can be quite minor so you have to decide whether a cable change will provide good value. Personally I'd rather put that money towards a good DAC or ear pads.
Apr 11, 2018
Tuneslover
41
Apr 11, 2018
bookmark_border
Also, I would go for the Schiit's Loki @ $149 to sensibly fine tune a headphone's sound before an aftermarket cable.
Apr 11, 2018
Evshrug
1388
Apr 12, 2018
bookmark_border
I’ve personally experienced placebo-level changes, bad cables that made the sound worse, and cables that “stopped holding back” and improved the sound more than going from a $300 to a $500 DAC. Unfortunately, price alone doesn’t identify whether you will get a noticeable benefit or not, so as always I advise an audition if possible. Also, never expect a cable to perform the same change as an EQ... the frequency response should stay the same, it’s the clarity that improves. Be skeptical if someone claims they got more bass from a cable, but the cable could affect how tight or blurred the bass is.
I also have no complaints about my stock Sennheiser HD 650 cable, but then again I like that it’s shorter because I got the HD 650 + Apogee Groove bundle. My amp is on my office desk, so sorter cables don’t make a tangled mess. I did really want a shorter cable for my HD 800, balanced, and since that is an even more revealing headphone (and my “pull out all the stops” headphone anyway), I took a chance on Wireworld, which my friend recommended and I got to meet the company head at CanJam NYC this year. I also got to hear my stock cable right before switching to the Wireworld cable, and was rea satisfied with the result. Perfect storm of reasons, except my old cable wasn’t broken ;)
The Schiit Loki probably is fine, would be nice if you need an EQ and you are connected to a source without its own EQ. However... my Headphones are close enough to where I like them that 3 bands of adjustment don’t allow for enough fine tuning. iTunes has, like, 8 frequencry bands? So did my old Mixer/DSP/DAC/amp, the Creative X7, though I sold that in preparation for the Smyth Realizer A16 that’s on the way. I was an early bird Kickstarter backer, talk about a long wait!
Apr 12, 2018
GeekyGirl1
28
Apr 28, 2018
bookmark_border
Nice photo and helpful information.
When you originally purchased, what was the expected delivery date, i.e. did yours arrive a lot earlier than expected?
Regarding your Van Damme cable, I thought that all MD purchases were a final sale, no?
Apr 28, 2018
RayF
13329
Apr 28, 2018
bookmark_border
Thanks.
I don’t recall the posted time frame, but I suspect MD may have run over—sure seemed like it. However, when we all started discussing the issue, MD jumped in and tracked our orders—she (don’t recall her name) gave us updates and let us know all was well. When the tracking emails arrived, my order beat the ETA by a day or two.
As as for the Final Sale, my experience has been MD will make good on any defective merchandise shipped—I’ve returned 2 orders without any trouble at all.
Apr 28, 2018
GeekyGirl1
28
Apr 28, 2018
bookmark_border
Thanks!
Apr 28, 2018
View Full Discussion