Drop Mech Keys Meetup Recap - Thanks for Visiting!
As you may have seen, we just hosted our first meetup in quite a while here at Drop HQ (Corsair HQ, but they seem to like us enough :) )! It was a blast to get to meet so many enthusiasts local to the bay area—it had been 10 years since I was last hanging out with keyboard nerds in the bay, at KeyCon 2014. We had a great time hosting everyone at the offices, checking out all the very nice boards y'all brought, and sharing some of our own projects/spaces! I knew it would be fun to host in the Game Room when I first saw it in person, but seeing it come to fruition was still so cool. Alright, I'll stop blabbering on now. xD Picture time! (Oh, real quick - there will be more of these! Stay tuned for more info and to catch the next one!)
May 15, 2024
any chance we could get two 1.5u mods for the bottom row? Pretty please?
For something like the TADA68, one would need more 1u R4 mods than are available in the Elven kit:
If they add 2x 1.5u, then why not 3x 1u? then why not better 65-75% support and why not a numpad (besides elven being base-12) etc it's a slippery slope. There is 4x R4 1u from ISO support, 3 would just be the wrong color for mods; with the grey one leftover and the narsil novelty if it's R3, you could make a Tada68 or 75% work.
I think it's reasonable to expect a 'vanilla' kit to fit something like my Poker or Novatouch. When it comes to something like my ISO Whitefox, compatibility is nice but I usually assume something like the Elven kit will not cover a board like that. It's the price one pays for going with a non-standard layout, after all. :-)
I personally build all 60%s, no matter how cheap or expensive with the following bottom row:
1.5u / 1u / 1.5u / 7u / 1.5u / 1u / 1.5u
This bottom row is nice and symmetric. It's aesthetically pleasing.
On TKLs with Winkey blockers, it would be the exact same layout but without the 1u keys.
On HHKB layout, it's 2x 1.5u keys and 2x 1u keys on the bottom row, along with a 6u or 7u spacebar.
On 65% and 75% keyboards I often do the following:
1.25 / 1.25 / 1.25 / 6.25 / 1.5 / 1.5 / arrow cluster
I'm not saying there is no point to 1.5u mods. I'm sure they have their place in some builds. Me personally I couldn't get by without a Windows key since it's quite essential to Gnome Shell, which is my DE of choice. But I digress. If the Elven kit was made to accomodate for Winkeyless boards, HHKB layouts, one-handed keyboards, the Kinesis Advantage, etc, then the kit would be quite large and quite expensive.
When designing any set I always start with the traditional 104 coverage and immediately add Winkeyless support (stepped caps, 7u bar, 1.5 + 1u mods). Even HHKB is not as essential as Winkeyless, though it is a close second. These are the two definitive layouts that if not supported, will negatively affect sales a noticeable amount.
Also, the fact that you mentioned Winkeyless and HHKB layouts with one handed keyboards is ridiculous and irreverent.
I'm not saying the number of tsangan users is equal to the number of kinesis users, merely pointing out the problem of arguing for support of non-standard layout X by adding Y amount of extra keys to a kit.
Winkeyless is arguably quite common. It's still non-standard, the users still in a minority. Last I checked the Elven kit had sold something like 150 units. I doubt catering to tsangan users would push those numbers by any significant amount, at least not enough to justify the increase in cost. The same goes for most GB's, where there's a separate Winkeyless kit to avoid increasing prices of popular kits by adding keys most people don't need.
A "slippery slope" is talking about caps that only work for 1-2 specialty boards. The Mini-Van, for example, has a few caps that only it really uses. Tsangan is a whole different story.
Tokyo60 just sold 400+ units? More? Other HHKB customs are some of the most popular ones out there already, with many sold (X60, Viper, etc).
Any custom TKL is generally WKL as well. OTD, Jane, Mech27, Skog, etc. There are 3-4 IC/GBs for these each quarter at least.
This isn't even mentioning all the other keybaords that utilize the keys. Finally, being able to resale a set without these keys will also be a lot harder and limit your market. I've made a lot of fairly barebones sets, and weight coverage vs cost for everyone with every kit, and there really is no reason not to include these particular caps.
Things might have played out differently in the GB you've been involved with. But in this case 173 Elven kits have been sold so far. Including tsangan compatibility in the elven kit would most likely at best result in something like 15–20 additional kits being sold. Maybe that's enough to justify the cost. If so, then MD will probably come to the same conclusion. But it sounds like a low number to me.