An incredible challenge posted by Audeze official - will Dan, Sennheiser and Focal step up?

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ElectronicVices

2207

Mar 31, 2020

The absurdity of this inquiry is mind-boggling.

Mar 31, 2020

Apr 2, 2020

ElectronicVices

Things that are mind boggling:

1. this post: https://drop.com/talk/31692/an-incredible-challenge-posted-by-audeze-official-will-dan-sennheiser-and-focal-step-up-to-the-chall/2592871
2. Hardware the size of a nickel with one moving part costing this much

Things that aren't mind boggling:

1. Curiosity about extreme markup

(Edited)

Apr 2, 2020

ElectronicVices

2207

Apr 3, 2020

Curiosity isn't mind-boggling, having even the smallest expectation that this might happen is the mind-boggling part. Where do you get the idea that materials cost is ever high a high percentage for complex goods? Ever hear that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts? The other aspect that most of the people making these types of requests fail to ever account for is the overhead and R&D that goes in to making products with more than a couple parts. Combine those expenses with the relatively small market for high-end headphones and you get the cost structure we see today. If anyone is looking to TOTL or high end headphones for a strong value proposition needs to re-evaluate their thought processes, because that is never going to happen. This is a niche luxury market, not something usually associated with cost effectiveness. Luxuries are never a good value, that's inherently why they are considered luxuries.

Apr 3, 2020

Mar 30, 2020

Would you look Vincent Van Gogh or Claude Monet in the eye, and ask them how much the paint and canvas cost them?

Mar 30, 2020

Ripter

Apr 23, 2020

Yes

Apr 23, 2020

Apr 23, 2020

Ripter

Hang on, I’ll ask for you... Vincent: “My ear.” Monet: “My eyes.”

No one asked you, Gimli!

Apr 23, 2020

Mar 30, 2020

@Evshrug Audeze issued this challenge on the i4 page, where the BOM is more than a "couple times" the cost of materials. I think it's a valid question

Mar 30, 2020

Mar 30, 2020

It’s a question alright. I really doubt Audeze expects other headphone manufacturers to chime in, and so it was “safe” for them to say, essentially, “If you can get them to share their BOM, then we will.” If you read between the lines, they’re saying the other companies don’t and won’t disclose that information. Again, people will look at the materials cost out of context. At the end of the day, the BOM cost doesn’t matter at all. So what if, say, HiFiman HE-400 S materials cost the same as an HE-6SE? I value the HE-6SE more. Also, the first units off the line for a new headphone (especially for a new company) cost way more than the headphone of equal quality down the line, once the process is optimized and economies of scale kick in.

(Edited)

Mar 30, 2020

Mar 30, 2020

This is NOT a challenge from Audeze... you could call it a rhetorical comment to show that no manufacturer is going to disclose their BOM. Frankly, consumers would misunderstand, and the cost of materials is besides the point. Headphones are not like basic carpentry nails or lumber. It is both a highly developed and highly researched science, AND an art. So, cost of materials is besides the point. Maybe Sennheiser’s resin they use to make the earcups of the HD 800 S is inexpensive (I don’t know the cost), BUT they researched it (I think they developed it in-house) specifically because of its low resonance and lightweight properties. Maybe it doesn’t cost Sennheiser any more to set the drivers at an angle, or the cost of the 56mm driver is a miniscule increase over something smaller, or the absorber in the HD 800 S that prevents masking is cheap, but a BOM doesn’t take into account the years of experimentation, iteration, and unique inspiration of the designers behind it. And then there’s operating costs of companies. Margins are an absolutely required part of doing business. The materials and construction labor per unit cost of a headphone doesn’t take into account R&D the the current product or future ones, nor does it pay for marketing, shipping logistics, etc. A company is simply larger than a single product. I don’t want to be price gouged either, nobody does. If I want something, an attainable, affordable price is necessary for me to buy it, and I don’t want something that appears to cost way more than it’s peers in the market. Value and BOM are completely separate things for most products on the market. So, I know it’s going to cost me a couple times more than the cost of materials.

(Edited)

Mar 30, 2020

Mar 30, 2020

@MrSpeakers @Sennheiser any comment?

(Edited)

Mar 30, 2020

erickong

4787

Audiophile Moderator

Mar 29, 2020

This is interesting

Mar 29, 2020

Davestef

131

Mar 29, 2020

Haha wow. That could go for any high end/luxury brand. Like how much does an Hermès bag cost to make? joshua valor has a YouTube post called the flagship tax. About how companies jack up the prices so much for their high end gear.

(Edited)

Mar 29, 2020

Mar 30, 2020

How much for a chair compared to a pile of wood, some nails, and varnish?

Mar 30, 2020

jaxtrauma

418

Mar 31, 2020

Yep, you’re paying for expertise

Mar 31, 2020

M0BCRUSHER

HD 8XX

I have been blown away by the sound of my HD 6XX and they are simply phenomenal. I hope that massdrop works on something more high end like the HD 800 series.

Jun 4, 2020

General

jaxtrauma

Clear XX?

Now that MD has a relationship with our gallic friends across the pond, I would just LOVE to see a Drop x FOCAL Clear XX and pay less than the $1500 retail. When I say the sound is simply beautiful, its an understatement. If you hear them you'll know why they called it the Clear. [image] [image] Prejudiced and totally biased opinion.

Jun 3, 2020

General

LFTNT_LRAK

Hiby R3 Pro or R3 Pro Saber

Anybody own either the Hiby R3 Pro or R3 Pro Saber? Own the regular R3 and wondering if either is really worth the jump (would likely get the R3 Pro Saber). Have just started beefing up my headphone and DAC game and wanted to know your thoughts. Thanks

Jun 3, 2020

General

testoid3

Test-Jabber

Awsm 1

Jun 3, 2020

General

mtrtn

What is your endgame DAC under 2000 USD?

I’m still rocking my SMSL M3 from 4 years ago until my SU-8 and SH-8 come in mid June to be used with my HD600’s. I saw a zeo’s video (yeah yeah I know) recently about some $1300 SMSL dac and I couldn’t help but think about how crazy that is. Ignoring things like diminishing returns and placebo effects, what’s your endgame dac under 2k? I guess mine would be whatever zeos was ranting about. [image]

Jun 1, 2020

General

DRAZY

Where can I get replacement headband tabs for my HD 6XX's?

I baby my Drop Sennheiser HD 6XX headphones I purchased back in June of 2108. for some strange reason I'm missing the tabs which keep the headband cushion in place. Is there any way to order replacements? Thanks in advance!

Jun 1, 2020