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Bravo V2 Headphone Amplifier
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Bravo V2 Headphone Amplifier
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Product Description
Producers of some of the most affordable tube amps around, Bravo Audio packs an absurd amount of power into their products for the price tags. One of their most popular models, the Bravo V2 Headphone Amplifier, features open air design and a high-quality tube, making for exquisite sound Read More
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trifco
4
Feb 14, 2014
And this is a good deal? How? Amazon sells it $7 more with free shipping. The order is fulfilled by Amazon. amazon.com/Bravo-Audio-Multi-Hybrid-Headphone-Amplifier/dp/B00ADR2DTG
money4me247
228
Jul 16, 2014
trifcoactually on amazon it's only $61.99 currently (http://www.amazon.com/Bravo-Audio-V2-Multi-Hybrid-Headphone/dp/B00ADR2DTG), so that's only $2.01 more than this drop price and if you have prime, you can get it with 2 day shipping.
Jensen567
71
Feb 6, 2016
$10 DAC mod. I just used a cheapo PCM2704 board I had laying around for fun, but it actually sounds half decent with this amp. If you got the ODAC PCB I am pretty sure it could be mounted within the footprint and it would be pretty much ideal. The RCA become DAC outputs if you use the 3.5mm input like I did here.
Jensen567
71
Mar 3, 2018
andyoIt was a cheap PCM2704. I've long since done a more permanent mod with a Savi SA9027 USB reciever and Sabre ES9023 DAC chip. Very satisfied.
Shenksy
38
Mar 15, 2021
Update: I am now content with Drop's resolution of this issue. Although the overall experience was frustrating, I don't fault Drop entirely since they appear to have been lied to by their supplier for this drop.
According to Drop's terms & conditions: "Drop strives to provide accurate descriptions of products and services on the Drop Sites. Drop does not guarantee, however, that the descriptions are accurate, complete, reliable, current or error-free. If a product or service offered on the Drop Sites is not as described, your sole remedy is to return the item."
Given that Drop would only incur administrative costs if every single customer returned their bravo v2, the exclusive remedy provided by Drop would likely be deemed unconscionable.
Drop has a duty to rectify this, either by sending out a replacement Gold Lion ECC82 to each purchaser or through some other means.
Disclaimer: I am not a licensed attorney and this is not legal advice. I am only a law student and this is just my basic impression.
(Edited)
JimDetroit
124
Mar 17, 2021
ShenksyI sure am surprised Drop is immediately offering the same product again, after the last "drop". They're setting themselves up for a boatload of returns.
Shenksy
38
Mar 18, 2021
Agreed. An inaccurate description would be something like an incorrect color or if this runs off of 12V instead of 24V. This is false advertising. It's not like Drop didn't have an opportunity to inspect the product before reshipping it to all the buyers.
I'm currently communicating with support at a rate of one email per day. I have responded to every email from support within 20 minutes of receipt.
Anon8
23
Mar 16, 2021
Anyone definitive on the Gold Lion ? Sounds unlikely this drop will include a genuine one. Maybe their china factory just sends them a fake-gold lion and labels it as genuine like many china products? Was one step away from purchase good thing I read the discussion.
tutetibiimperes
266
Mar 18, 2021
Anon8Contacted Drop support and they confirmed they shipped out without the Gold Lion tubes due to some issue at the warehouse.
They said they would endeavor to supply the missing Gold Lion tubes but no promises. They did offer a refund, but I’d personally want a guarantee that they’ll ship the Gold Lion tubes instead. That’s the entire reason I joined this drop and waited a month to get it vs getting it in two days from Amazon.
Shenksy
38
Mar 18, 2021
tutetibiimperesUpdate: I am now content with Drop's resolution of this issue. Although the overall experience was frustrating, I don't fault Drop entirely since they appear to have been lied to by their supplier for this drop.
Exactly my issue. A refund is an inadequate resolution (what is the average interest rate for a 1-month loan?), and a nebulous nonbinding "promise" to "try" to supply the missing Gold Lion tubes is just insulting to my intelligence.
(Edited)
CraigL
14
Mar 12, 2021
Got mine yesterday and to my disappointment no Gold Lion tube, just the standard Bravo tube. In the process of returning it.
rongon
50
Apr 4, 2018
Has anyone looked into the actual engineering design of this amplifier? I found a schematic for it here: http://bilder.hifi-forum.de/max/415727/bravo-v2-schematic_691080.png
It shows some interesting things, not all of which look particularly 'good.' I don't know if that schematic is accurate, or is representative of the units that are actually shipping.
1) The input potentiometer (volume control) is 100k ohms. That is a common value for vacuum tubes. However, R4 and R5 (grid leak resistors) are only 24k ohms. That means the input impedance is 100k||24k = 19k ohms. That's only a little higher than you'd see from a typical solid state headphone amp. Maybe this is not a problem in this instance. BUT...
2) The input capacitors, C1 and C2 are 1uF (one micro-Farad). That creates an RC high pass filter (HPF), with bass roll-off that is -3dB at 8.4Hz. That means this little amp can only be truly flat (-0.1dB) in the bass at about 80Hz, and probably -1.5dB at 20Hz. That is kind of high, and would probably be audible used with cans that go really low. This thing won't make really deep bass, but this is probably not a problem. People who buy this are probably not looking for that, but rather are looking for that 'warm tube sound.'
3) The LM317 (IC1 and IC2) current sinks in the sources of the output MOSFETs IRF510 (Q1 and Q2) are set to 167mA (0.167A). Just FYI.
4) The plates of the 12AU7 (triode tubes V1A and V1B) are running with very low voltage, only 16VDC. If you look at the characteristics for type 12AU7, you can see that it must be running with practically no grid bias. That would mean the control grid must be drawing at least a little current. When the tube is drawing grid current, its input impedance goes low. The grid's input impedance is in parallel with the grid leak resistance (defined by the volume control with R4 and R5 in parallel), which is already pretty low. Audio sources with low output impedance and the ability to sink some current into that load will be necessary for good sound.
At any rate, I can see that this design would be very, very sensitive to tube characteristics that the tube itself wasn't designed for. Tubes in general are designed to be used with plate voltages of 100VDC and higher (up to 250VDC is normal for the 12AU7). Characteristics at plate voltage of 16VDC are likely to vary a great deal between different 12AU7s. Tube rolling indeed!
This looks like a fun little "tube-ifier", but it doesn't look like a truly high fidelity headphone amplifier. I might pick one up just to play around with, maybe swap out a few parts, play with some minor modifications. Looks like it could be fun. I think I'd change that blue LED for an amber one. I'd want warm colors for a hot little 'tube amp.'
Anyone else with experience with tube amp designs care to take a look at that schematic and comment on it?
1) The input potentiometer (volume control) is 100k ohms. That is a common value for vacuum tubes. However, R4 and R5 (grid leak resistors) are only 24k ohms. That means the input impedance is 100k||24k = 19k ohms. That's only a little higher than you'd see from a typical solid state headphone amp. Maybe this is not a problem in this instance. BUT...
2) The input capacitors, C1 and C2 are 1uF (one micro-Farad). That creates an RC high pass filter (HPF), with bass roll-off that is -3dB at 8.4Hz. That means this little amp can only be truly flat (-0.1dB) in the bass at about 80Hz, and probably -1.5dB at 20Hz. That is kind of high, and would probably be audible used with cans that go really low. This thing won't make really deep bass, but this is probably not a problem. People who buy this are probably not looking for that, but rather are looking for that 'warm tube sound.'
3) The LM317 (IC1 and IC2) current sinks in the sources of the output MOSFETs IRF510 (Q1 and Q2) are set to 167mA (0.167A). Just FYI.
4) The plates of the 12AU7 (triode tubes V1A and V1B) are running with very low voltage, only 16VDC. If you look at the characteristics for type 12AU7, you can see that it must be running with practically no grid bias. That would mean the control grid must be drawing at least a little current. When the tube is drawing grid current, its input impedance goes low. The grid's input impedance is in parallel with the grid leak resistance (defined by the volume control with R4 and R5 in parallel), which is already pretty low. Audio sources with low output impedance and the ability to sink some current into that load will be necessary for good sound.
At any rate, I can see that this design would be very, very sensitive to tube characteristics that the tube itself wasn't designed for. Tubes in general are designed to be used with plate voltages of 100VDC and higher (up to 250VDC is normal for the 12AU7). Characteristics at plate voltage of 16VDC are likely to vary a great deal between different 12AU7s. Tube rolling indeed!
This looks like a fun little "tube-ifier", but it doesn't look like a truly high fidelity headphone amplifier. I might pick one up just to play around with, maybe swap out a few parts, play with some minor modifications. Looks like it could be fun. I think I'd change that blue LED for an amber one. I'd want warm colors for a hot little 'tube amp.'
Anyone else with experience with tube amp designs care to take a look at that schematic and comment on it?
rongon
50
Apr 25, 2018
rongonSo I bought one. It's as expected. Not exactly hi-fi.
Compared to my Objective 2 amp, this Bravo V2 sounds a lot more aggressive in the upper mids. Low impedance (50 ohm) headphones playing straight from the PC line out sound less bright. But this amp is kind of cute.
This amp does sound better driving high impedance headphones, but still very colored sounding. Its bright and aggressive character remains, just less apparent than when driving low impedance cans.
Incidentally, the output MOSFETs are IRF630, marked as such on the PCB. The schematic I linked to says IRF510. I'm not sure how much difference that would make.
Oh well. Maybe I shouldn't have bothered. I might try some mods to see if I can lower the gain and/or get it to sound more mushy and tube-y. That would be nice for mellowing out the hashy highs from MP3 streams. I can't think of any other use for this thing...
Compared to my Objective 2 amp, this Bravo V2 sounds a lot more aggressive in the upper mids. Low impedance (50 ohm) headphones playing straight from the PC line out sound less bright. But this amp is kind of cute.
This amp does sound better driving high impedance headphones, but still very colored sounding. Its bright and aggressive character remains, just less apparent than when driving low impedance cans.
Incidentally, the output MOSFETs are IRF630, marked as such on the PCB. The schematic I linked to says IRF510. I'm not sure how much difference that would make.
Oh well. Maybe I shouldn't have bothered. I might try some mods to see if I can lower the gain and/or get it to sound more mushy and tube-y. That would be nice for mellowing out the hashy highs from MP3 streams. I can't think of any other use for this thing...
Danbstein
306
Apr 30, 2018
rongonUm... Right!! What you wrote sounds very good, but you might as well have said, "may I mumble dogfish to the banana patch?" Definitely way over my head :)
Interesting though.
BTW: quote is from Steve Martin
Interesting though.
BTW: quote is from Steve Martin
Jensen567
71
Jan 26, 2016
To all those who think they did not get the Gold Lion tube, check the one installed in the amp! I recieved mine today, and while it did not come with a spare tube, the tube installed out of the box is in fact the Genelex Gold Lion. So I am missing out on a crappy no-name 12AU7, no big deal.
So far I have only used this with my Dr.Dac3 as a source, which I know, using an HPA as a source for an HPA isn't how you're supposed to do it, but should work fine as long as I keep the input volume level under the distortion threshold.
Don't really notice much of the "tube character", but considering the amp is setup to use the tube as a buffer rather than the power amp stage I am not too surprised (I haven't reverse engineered the circuit yet, but I would guess it is setup as a cathode follower). Plus, all that really means is that it is NOT adding much distortion (which is really what "benefit" tubes have, distorting your signals). With that said, it does sound very good, and has no problem driving my AKG K7xx or BD DT880 600 Ohm.
I would guess much of the quality, or lack thereof, from the sound out of this will be down to the source you feed it, with a clean input I am getting a clean output, and no buzzing or hissing even at full volume with the AKGs (dont have any IEMs handy, will try later).
My only complaint is purely aesthetic and my opinion only, which is the blue LED under the tube. I would rather just see the very slight orange glow from the actual heaters in the tube, plus blue doesn't match my setup. Like I said, purely my opinion only, and I already plan to de-solder the LED to fix that anyhow.
So far I have only used this with my Dr.Dac3 as a source, which I know, using an HPA as a source for an HPA isn't how you're supposed to do it, but should work fine as long as I keep the input volume level under the distortion threshold.
Don't really notice much of the "tube character", but considering the amp is setup to use the tube as a buffer rather than the power amp stage I am not too surprised (I haven't reverse engineered the circuit yet, but I would guess it is setup as a cathode follower). Plus, all that really means is that it is NOT adding much distortion (which is really what "benefit" tubes have, distorting your signals). With that said, it does sound very good, and has no problem driving my AKG K7xx or BD DT880 600 Ohm.
I would guess much of the quality, or lack thereof, from the sound out of this will be down to the source you feed it, with a clean input I am getting a clean output, and no buzzing or hissing even at full volume with the AKGs (dont have any IEMs handy, will try later).
My only complaint is purely aesthetic and my opinion only, which is the blue LED under the tube. I would rather just see the very slight orange glow from the actual heaters in the tube, plus blue doesn't match my setup. Like I said, purely my opinion only, and I already plan to de-solder the LED to fix that anyhow.
Jensen567
71
Jan 27, 2016
No worries, I thought I didn't get it at first too, then I went to check what tube it came with because I had forgotten and saw I had the Gold Lion already in the amp.
In terms of other upgrades, there really arent any other easily swappable components. The power supply could help if the standard one is really noisy, I will throw it on the scope when I get home to find out, but i have a feeling it is fine, plus they have one hell of a decoupling cap which should eliminate most if not all ripple. So probably not worth it, even if it was only $5, but I will check. I'm not really an audiophile either (audiophool, no offense guys), I'm an engineer who likes to listen to music and play with electronics, so I'm sure some will disagree with me and claim that a better power supply revolutionizes the outside the box synergy and unlocks the full depth of sound, or something like that.
In terms of other upgrades, there really arent any other easily swappable components. The power supply could help if the standard one is really noisy, I will throw it on the scope when I get home to find out, but i have a feeling it is fine, plus they have one hell of a decoupling cap which should eliminate most if not all ripple. So probably not worth it, even if it was only $5, but I will check. I'm not really an audiophile either (audiophool, no offense guys), I'm an engineer who likes to listen to music and play with electronics, so I'm sure some will disagree with me and claim that a better power supply revolutionizes the outside the box synergy and unlocks the full depth of sound, or something like that.
Jensen567
71
Jan 27, 2016
Measure less than 5mV of ripple on the included AC-DC supply on my scope, plus they have a massive 6800uF decoupling cap on the amplifier PCB, so really no reason to change out the power supply. I would say there are probably no other upgrades that are worthwhile, unless you just want a linear supply to be more "vintage", but considering the housing is laser cut acrylic and it has a bright blue LED under the tube, I don't think this amp screams "vintage"
Indigosummer
164
Feb 21, 2021
I was going to dismiss this but if you factor in the gold lion tube then it's about half off of what you can get from Amazon. Very tempting. Fun cheap tube sound
(Edited)
JimDetroit
124
Mar 14, 2021
IndigosummerGot mine recently. It may be a specially-branded Gold Lion tube, or not at all. Perhaps Bravo Audio got a bulk deal on producing the Gold Lion tubes? Hard to say, as there is no note included to that effect. The tube included just says "Bravo Audio" on it, and there's a lot number stamped on the tube, but there is no indication it is a true Gold Lion tube. It does not say "ECC82" nor have the "Gold Lion" logo on it, and it has silver-colored pins rather than the gold pins of a true Gold Lion tube.
RVDIII
70
Feb 17, 2021
After 30 days!!!
DROP SAYS:
TOUGH LUCK BUDDY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
NO WARRANTY!!!!
quicklytoo4
779
Keyboard Club Member
Aug 3, 2021
drop gives you 30 days then if they don't have any warranty the manufacturer does but you have to pay for shipping in most of those cases
MastroiTek
29
Aug 5, 2021
I really don't see the problem in all this, is not like they try to scam you, when you buy a product you already know that it comes with no warranty from them, and if the manufacturer does give a warranty it will be specified on the product page. Yes drop is just like a middle man but no one forces you to buy from them. Furthermore, this is quite an active comunity, a quick look at the reviews will tell you if the product you like to buy has any common issue.
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