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Drop O2 Headphone Amplifier
01 / 08
Drop O2 Headphone Amplifier
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Product Description
In 2011, audio engineer NwAvGuy published a blog post titled “O2 Headphone Amp,” in which he outlined his philosophy on defining sound quality and detailed his ideal audiophile circuit design. Our version of NwAvGuy's famous O2 amplifier, the Objective 2 Desktop Edition features updates based on feedback from the community Read More
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keyboard_arrow_downStrad1679
106
Jul 28, 2015
Massdrop should not be using the Objective 2 name on this product. The design changes are in clear violation of the license (see below). Their desire to remove all text from the case is likely an acknowledgement of this, yet they reference the licensed name seven times on the product page. This offering could have a serious impact on the open source audiophile community and I, for one, will not be supporting it. Massdrop should either stick to the specs in the license or call this thing something else.
Below is a list of all of the changes that are different from the original spec. This list is from an extremely reliable source. I realize the final design is subject to change (red flag), but it seems obvious that they have no intention of sticking to the license.
"R25 - 5% instead of 1% - Impacts power management. More likely to cycle on off when batteries are low.
Blue LED - Requires power management circuit changes.
'Finally, the LED’s forward voltage is a critical element of the power management circuit. You can't change to a different color (especially white or blue) without making other changes as that will require more current and the different forward voltage means the power management circuit has to be altered.'
C13/C14 - WIMA 1.5uF present instead of 2.2uf. This is a critical audio path capacitor. The smaller value here will impact low frequency response! This is a serious alteration with performance implications. WIMA costs more, but red capacitors sell better than grey. Reducing value reduces cost (and performance).
R1/R2 - Generic charging resistors are present.
C6, C7, C10, C15, C17, C18 - Film caps have been replaced with generic parts.
C1 - Replaced with generic part.
C16, C21 - Ceramic caps have been replaced with film parts.
VR1 - Alps RK097 series potentiometer with 15A taper has been swapped for a lower cost part (unknown volume taper and balance).
Q1 Q2 - Power supply MOSFETS differ from standard parts. Q1 and Q2 are critical parts which affect opamp performance and turn on/off behavior. Discussed extensively in original article."
Below is a list of all of the changes that are different from the original spec. This list is from an extremely reliable source. I realize the final design is subject to change (red flag), but it seems obvious that they have no intention of sticking to the license.
"R25 - 5% instead of 1% - Impacts power management. More likely to cycle on off when batteries are low.
Blue LED - Requires power management circuit changes.
'Finally, the LED’s forward voltage is a critical element of the power management circuit. You can't change to a different color (especially white or blue) without making other changes as that will require more current and the different forward voltage means the power management circuit has to be altered.'
C13/C14 - WIMA 1.5uF present instead of 2.2uf. This is a critical audio path capacitor. The smaller value here will impact low frequency response! This is a serious alteration with performance implications. WIMA costs more, but red capacitors sell better than grey. Reducing value reduces cost (and performance).
R1/R2 - Generic charging resistors are present.
C6, C7, C10, C15, C17, C18 - Film caps have been replaced with generic parts.
C1 - Replaced with generic part.
C16, C21 - Ceramic caps have been replaced with film parts.
VR1 - Alps RK097 series potentiometer with 15A taper has been swapped for a lower cost part (unknown volume taper and balance).
Q1 Q2 - Power supply MOSFETS differ from standard parts. Q1 and Q2 are critical parts which affect opamp performance and turn on/off behavior. Discussed extensively in original article."
Mayflower_Man
9
Sep 12, 2018
Strad1679All of these are mostly moot points for me, because for 5 dollars more, I could get an extremely similar product with a much better 10 year warranty, which is also made in the U.S. It was an easy decision to buy from Mayflower instead.
paperassgasket
57
Jun 2, 2019
Strad1679Wish I had read this before I bought my O2 recently. Mine just died after very little use. Likely a Q1/Q2 failure. I guess at least I have a board and case to build my own now...
tessierpg
Aug 12, 2017
From my experience with the O2, it doesn't color the sound. It is neutral sounding. It has been designed to be as neutral as possible. moreover, it is a very low impedance amp (0,5 ohms), so amp to headphone matching is therefore optimized with most headphones, from low to high impedance models, well respecting the 8x damping factor (headphone impendance/amp impedance > 8x) with any serious headphone (18-600 ohms), therefore the frequency response of the headphone is far less impacted by the amp's output impedance. And the O2 is powerful enough to drive most headphones, using its gain control to adjust to the input voltage from the source. Use the 6,5x gain if the input voltage is 1V or under (iPhone, iPad, most phones and many portable or pc sound cards) and use the lower gain setting 2,5 (or 3,3x on the medium gain version) for higher voltage sources (cd players, Dac output, etc which are normally around 2,0 to 2,1V). Another benefit from this amp: it is silent, no hiss or noise affecting the sound from the components or the AC adapter. Lastly, the amp has a low distorsion design, although relying in IC op amps, not discrete components, but nevertheless it's design is well done and it sounds excellent. Most people wont ever need more than what the O2 is providing, at any price. Are there other budget amps out there that are comparable? Maybe, many say the Schiit Magni2 is one. I haven't tried it. Could be...
lovemid-fi
2
Aug 12, 2017
tessierpgThanks!
I have a Magni 1, but will be avoiding Schitt products in future. Not for performance reasons, but because I have tried them on 3 newer PC's, none of which would recognize the Modi DAC (you can't manually install drivers, because the PC needs to detect the DAC in order to install the drivers - I need the drivers because the DAC is not detected in the first place!)
I'm going to try running my inexpensive DAP through the Magni, if it gives me what I need with its DAC, I'll order the O2.
Thanks again for the response
lastzero
254
Jul 22, 2015
So I have an ATH-M50. Is this a worthwhile jump or should I wait and spend $1k for DAC and AMP?
Vinn
31
Jul 26, 2015
I doubt you will hear the difference, especially with something like the M50. Like most ppl say get better Cans 1st then Amp then Dac. Dac difference is really subtle and very subjective to each person.
millifoo
80
Jul 22, 2015
@Will - it looks like there are some parts in there that are different than NwAVGuy's spec, and I worry this is violating the original license. From a post on reddit:
You can see a 5% tolerance resistor at R25, non-Alps potentiometer, non-standard MOSFETS Q1 and Q2, and non-standard passives.
R25 is critical to proper turn on/off operation (1% tolerance recommended). The potentiometer choice affects channel balance and its taper impacts volume adjustment.
The blue LED is a nice touch, but that also requires circuitry changes - and NwAvGuy's specified red LED was to avoid an uneven battery draw).
Substituting Q1/Q2 can alter power delivery to the opamps. It will be interesting to see how this pans out.
Also the case isn't the standard b2-080.
You can see a 5% tolerance resistor at R25, non-Alps potentiometer, non-standard MOSFETS Q1 and Q2, and non-standard passives.
R25 is critical to proper turn on/off operation (1% tolerance recommended). The potentiometer choice affects channel balance and its taper impacts volume adjustment.
The blue LED is a nice touch, but that also requires circuitry changes - and NwAvGuy's specified red LED was to avoid an uneven battery draw).
Substituting Q1/Q2 can alter power delivery to the opamps. It will be interesting to see how this pans out.
Also the case isn't the standard b2-080.
wes1099
183
Jul 23, 2015
So will the final version use Alps potentiometers and nichicon capacitors like the bill of materials suggests?
MonsieurKirby
154
Jul 24, 2015
Add my vote for symbols instead of text as well. I prefer brushed as well, rather than matte like the enclosure.
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Sep 30, 2015
Hey Everyone,
Welcome to another action packed episode of "Customs Roulette" where we make something exciting, you give us your hard earned money, and the Customs Officers of various countries try to foil our plans for on-time fulfillment.
This week, we've got some exciting news. As I write this, the finished O2s are being loaded on a plane bound for JFK. Once they land, it's an easy 60 minute truck ride to our NJ fulfillment center. If all goes according to plan, these should start shipping out by this time next week (Oct 5-7).
That said, this wouldn't be "Customs Roulette" if everything always wen't according to plan. As always, there is a possibility that the US Customs decides to pull our package aside and scrutinize it. This can happen for any number of reasons, but fear not, we're already prepared with every conceivable piece of documentation the US Customs office can request.
Shipping manifests, freshly minted FCC Certification (interestingly enough, the O2 was never certified by the FCC, we took care of that), itemized BOM list of every component, a map detailing the location of Jimmy Hoffa's grave, we've got it all ready to fax/scan/fly over at a moment's notice.
Thanks for your patience, support, on-going discussion, entertaining complaints (the un-entertaining ones.... words hurt guys... I am not made of stone), and everything else.
It's been a long journey but I'm glad we'll reach the finish line together (unless you canceled, no finish line for you).
I'll be around tonight and tomorrow answering questions but if you have anything pressing, feel free to email me as always: will@massdrop.com
Welcome to another action packed episode of "Customs Roulette" where we make something exciting, you give us your hard earned money, and the Customs Officers of various countries try to foil our plans for on-time fulfillment.
This week, we've got some exciting news. As I write this, the finished O2s are being loaded on a plane bound for JFK. Once they land, it's an easy 60 minute truck ride to our NJ fulfillment center. If all goes according to plan, these should start shipping out by this time next week (Oct 5-7).
That said, this wouldn't be "Customs Roulette" if everything always wen't according to plan. As always, there is a possibility that the US Customs decides to pull our package aside and scrutinize it. This can happen for any number of reasons, but fear not, we're already prepared with every conceivable piece of documentation the US Customs office can request.
Shipping manifests, freshly minted FCC Certification (interestingly enough, the O2 was never certified by the FCC, we took care of that), itemized BOM list of every component, a map detailing the location of Jimmy Hoffa's grave, we've got it all ready to fax/scan/fly over at a moment's notice.
Thanks for your patience, support, on-going discussion, entertaining complaints (the un-entertaining ones.... words hurt guys... I am not made of stone), and everything else.
It's been a long journey but I'm glad we'll reach the finish line together (unless you canceled, no finish line for you).
I'll be around tonight and tomorrow answering questions but if you have anything pressing, feel free to email me as always: will@massdrop.com
anakin
105
Oct 2, 2015
In your defense Will, I be willing to bet that you did not anticipate such a high demand either. Perhaps if the drop was limited to 150 units, for example, for a first time run-through, it may have gone over with less hostility.
ihcTactics
12
Oct 2, 2015
This was the key thing I was pointing out as well: the communication side of thing is what was most detrimental I believe. Not letting us know the status of the parts was what I considered to be the lack of professionalism. I was well aware that we were getting something assembled for us, but when delays happen, updates are a common means to dissipate concerns.
Yes, there will always be people who complain about things they should have read or are just people who feel entitled, and as the saying goes, "You can't please everyone", but hopefully with communication updates, more people would be satisfied.
Yes, there will always be people who complain about things they should have read or are just people who feel entitled, and as the saying goes, "You can't please everyone", but hopefully with communication updates, more people would be satisfied.
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Aug 3, 2015
Hi Everyone,
Thanks for your participation in this drop and joining in the product discussion. At the beginning of this drop, we asked for your input on the final details of the product and we got lots of great responses. From there, we took all your topics of interest to our manufacturing partner and discussed what could be done without impacting the expected delivery date. As initially expected, some changes were possible, some were not, and some could be solved in the future. Here’s a list of answers to the top questions ya’ll have been asking. Feel free to reply with any questions I missed, I’ll be around and answering questions all today.
Final Case Design:
After compiling everyone’s feedback, viewing material samples, and comparing finish options first hand, we arrived at this final front panel design (see image attached):
The matte finish for the front panel will look the same as the matte metal finish this O2 currently sports on all surfaces but the front panel.
The volume knob has been upgraded to a full metal option (as opposed to hollow metal and plastic) with rubber grommets for a smooth grip.
All these changes originated in this discussion section, thank you again for your support. If you find these design changes offencive and would like to leave the drop as a result, simply head over to: https://www.massdrop.com/transactions and cancel your order (third button down the right side of the screen if this is your most recent Massdrop purchase). We’ve extended the drop until tomorrow night so you can cancel your purchase any time between now and midnight Tuesday night (11:59pm PST tomorrow night).
220v Support:
Lots of people have been asking if this amplifier supports 220v power. The answer is yes, this amplifier does support 220v power, but you need a 220v power adapter. The adapters that ship with this drop will be a 110v US plug adapters. As such, anyone based overseas will need to get a separate power supply that fits their needs.
They’re very affordable at $10.99 from JDS labs: https://www.jdslabs.com/products/73/g-e-z-15vac-adapter-for-o2/
And if you prefer, you should be able to find cheaper alternatives at most electronic parts suppliers like Digikey, Mouser, or equivalents based in your country.
Additional Features:
In the course of this discussion we’ve seen tons of people requesting additional/different features like rear power input, rear RCA inputs, 1/4” headphone jacks, etc.
While we’d like to add options like this, our manufacturing plan for these O2s has a tight schedule and any major deviations from the original design would increase wait times meaningfully (changes proposed, plan re-done, contracts re-negotiated, etc). That said, a couple of community members brought up an interesting idea here in the discussion: Could Massdrop make DIY upgrade kits for these changes?
After talking it over with our manufacturing partner, the answer is yes. While they won’t be available until some time after this drop is fulfilled, we will be exploring making DIY kits as cheaply as possible for the most requested physical changes. Based on the discussion so far, our first priority will be a kit to give you the option of having a rear powered unit (new back plate, jumper wire, power jack). Additionally, we’ll be posting the parts list for all of these kits in this discussion as they’re finalized over the coming weeks. You won’t be seeing one every week, but we want to make it easy for people to source the parts themselves if they don’t want to wait for our pre-packaged solutions.
All things considered, I think it’s been an amazing drop. Your support, your questions, your concerns, all made for a better product and for that I say thanks.
I’ll be around if you have any additional questions, otherwise, you have until this drop ends at midnight Tuesday night (11:59pm Tuesday 8/4/2015) to make changes to your order.
Thanks for your participation in this drop and joining in the product discussion. At the beginning of this drop, we asked for your input on the final details of the product and we got lots of great responses. From there, we took all your topics of interest to our manufacturing partner and discussed what could be done without impacting the expected delivery date. As initially expected, some changes were possible, some were not, and some could be solved in the future. Here’s a list of answers to the top questions ya’ll have been asking. Feel free to reply with any questions I missed, I’ll be around and answering questions all today.
Final Case Design:
After compiling everyone’s feedback, viewing material samples, and comparing finish options first hand, we arrived at this final front panel design (see image attached):
The matte finish for the front panel will look the same as the matte metal finish this O2 currently sports on all surfaces but the front panel.
The volume knob has been upgraded to a full metal option (as opposed to hollow metal and plastic) with rubber grommets for a smooth grip.
All these changes originated in this discussion section, thank you again for your support. If you find these design changes offencive and would like to leave the drop as a result, simply head over to: https://www.massdrop.com/transactions and cancel your order (third button down the right side of the screen if this is your most recent Massdrop purchase). We’ve extended the drop until tomorrow night so you can cancel your purchase any time between now and midnight Tuesday night (11:59pm PST tomorrow night).
220v Support:
Lots of people have been asking if this amplifier supports 220v power. The answer is yes, this amplifier does support 220v power, but you need a 220v power adapter. The adapters that ship with this drop will be a 110v US plug adapters. As such, anyone based overseas will need to get a separate power supply that fits their needs.
They’re very affordable at $10.99 from JDS labs: https://www.jdslabs.com/products/73/g-e-z-15vac-adapter-for-o2/
And if you prefer, you should be able to find cheaper alternatives at most electronic parts suppliers like Digikey, Mouser, or equivalents based in your country.
Additional Features:
In the course of this discussion we’ve seen tons of people requesting additional/different features like rear power input, rear RCA inputs, 1/4” headphone jacks, etc.
While we’d like to add options like this, our manufacturing plan for these O2s has a tight schedule and any major deviations from the original design would increase wait times meaningfully (changes proposed, plan re-done, contracts re-negotiated, etc). That said, a couple of community members brought up an interesting idea here in the discussion: Could Massdrop make DIY upgrade kits for these changes?
After talking it over with our manufacturing partner, the answer is yes. While they won’t be available until some time after this drop is fulfilled, we will be exploring making DIY kits as cheaply as possible for the most requested physical changes. Based on the discussion so far, our first priority will be a kit to give you the option of having a rear powered unit (new back plate, jumper wire, power jack). Additionally, we’ll be posting the parts list for all of these kits in this discussion as they’re finalized over the coming weeks. You won’t be seeing one every week, but we want to make it easy for people to source the parts themselves if they don’t want to wait for our pre-packaged solutions.
All things considered, I think it’s been an amazing drop. Your support, your questions, your concerns, all made for a better product and for that I say thanks.
I’ll be around if you have any additional questions, otherwise, you have until this drop ends at midnight Tuesday night (11:59pm Tuesday 8/4/2015) to make changes to your order.
Jimmyz
10
Feb 7, 2016
WillWill,
I'm still waiting for these DIY kits you mentioned that you would offering during the first drop of this O2 amp. You stated: "Based on the discussion so far, our first priority will be a kit to give you the option of having a rear powered unit (new back plate, jumper wire, power jack)." I'm also quite interested in an ODAC kit for this O2 amp too. Could you please give us an update on when these DIY kits will be offered.
Jimmyz
10
Jun 17, 2016
WillIn the first drop of this O2 Amp you said "we will be exploring making DIY kits as cheaply as possible for the most requested physical changes. Based on the discussion so far, our first priority will be a kit to give you the option of having a rear powered unit (new back plate, jumper wire, power jack). Additionally, we’ll be posting the parts list for all of these kits in this discussion as they’re finalized over the coming weeks. I'm still waiting on these DIY Mod Kits, from the first drop, could you please let us know when we can get these DIY Kits.
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Oct 19, 2015
Hey Everyone,
Three years ago, sitting at the IKEA dining table in our first house (Massdrop was run out of houses for the first year of our existence), we decided to add discussion sections to our drops.
Since then, we've been perpetually impressed with the time folks spend posting and the depth of content they produce. That said, there are downsides to the standard discussion structure, and while we've done our best to mitigate as much as we can, the "vocal minority" problem is one we've yet to solve.
This is a normal situation that forms when something happens that a group of members takes issue with. If the group of members is big enough, then the community will ultimately accept their complaints as reasonable, and address the underlying cause of their concern. If the group of members is too small, then the community judges their complaints as unreasonable, moves on, and the passionate members of the displeased group continue to post and derail discussions with their complaints.
In this discussion, there are ~15 people acting as a vocal minority, expressing their displeasure about the timing of this drop and the availability of the Desktop upgrade, and exhibiting the kind of behavior listed above. While the discussion has moved on, I want to address these complaints, clarify a few things, and ask a couple questions for the purpose of bettering our messaging practices. Even though the discussion has moved on, I think there’s some legitimate confusion to be resolved.
First, to make sure we're all on the same page, these members participated in the first drop, bought a standard O2 for $69.99 USD shipped, and are displeased because once all their units shipped out, we launched this drop, where members can purchase standard O2s for $79.99 USD shipped, and Desktop O2s for $94.99 shipped. The changes made to create a Desktop O2 (RCA Input, rear power jack, 1/4" headphone jack) were all requested in the discussion of the first O2 drop by dozens of users.
The overall sentiment from this vocal minority is essentially “I wouldn’t have joined the first drop if I knew the second drop would have the most requested additional options”. Here’s our response:
1. We made it clear that the first drop would not be able to accommodate those requests in this post: https://www.massdrop.com/buy/massdrop-o2-amplifier/talk/246075
2. We’ve already stated our intent around creating mod-kits for purchasers from the first drop (in the same post linked above). This is something we still intend to do, and we’re working out the logistics now (specifically around replacement plates, everything else is off the shelf components).
3. By participating in the first drop, you were able to take advantage of pricing based on expected costs ($69.99) rather than pricing based on real costs ($79.99), glad to elaborate on this if necessary.
Hopefully that response covers everything. Getting to the question side of things, it’s clear this information could have been communicated better, and I’m interested in your thoughts on the matter.
Maybe we can make some kind of “discussion digest” email for complicated drops. Idea would be to take all the important questions and responses from ~50 pages of discussion, and condense it into a single email. Obviously a couple problems with that (“more emails” is never a great answer), but if you have ideas or thoughts, let me know via email (will@massdrop.com) and we’ll keep the discussion going (don’t want to hijack anymore space on this drop).
Thanks for your patience and support of this drop, hopefully this covers all the pertinent information and provides an avenue for continued discussion to those who feel most impacted.
Three years ago, sitting at the IKEA dining table in our first house (Massdrop was run out of houses for the first year of our existence), we decided to add discussion sections to our drops.
Since then, we've been perpetually impressed with the time folks spend posting and the depth of content they produce. That said, there are downsides to the standard discussion structure, and while we've done our best to mitigate as much as we can, the "vocal minority" problem is one we've yet to solve.
This is a normal situation that forms when something happens that a group of members takes issue with. If the group of members is big enough, then the community will ultimately accept their complaints as reasonable, and address the underlying cause of their concern. If the group of members is too small, then the community judges their complaints as unreasonable, moves on, and the passionate members of the displeased group continue to post and derail discussions with their complaints.
In this discussion, there are ~15 people acting as a vocal minority, expressing their displeasure about the timing of this drop and the availability of the Desktop upgrade, and exhibiting the kind of behavior listed above. While the discussion has moved on, I want to address these complaints, clarify a few things, and ask a couple questions for the purpose of bettering our messaging practices. Even though the discussion has moved on, I think there’s some legitimate confusion to be resolved.
First, to make sure we're all on the same page, these members participated in the first drop, bought a standard O2 for $69.99 USD shipped, and are displeased because once all their units shipped out, we launched this drop, where members can purchase standard O2s for $79.99 USD shipped, and Desktop O2s for $94.99 shipped. The changes made to create a Desktop O2 (RCA Input, rear power jack, 1/4" headphone jack) were all requested in the discussion of the first O2 drop by dozens of users.
The overall sentiment from this vocal minority is essentially “I wouldn’t have joined the first drop if I knew the second drop would have the most requested additional options”. Here’s our response:
1. We made it clear that the first drop would not be able to accommodate those requests in this post: https://www.massdrop.com/buy/massdrop-o2-amplifier/talk/246075
2. We’ve already stated our intent around creating mod-kits for purchasers from the first drop (in the same post linked above). This is something we still intend to do, and we’re working out the logistics now (specifically around replacement plates, everything else is off the shelf components).
3. By participating in the first drop, you were able to take advantage of pricing based on expected costs ($69.99) rather than pricing based on real costs ($79.99), glad to elaborate on this if necessary.
Hopefully that response covers everything. Getting to the question side of things, it’s clear this information could have been communicated better, and I’m interested in your thoughts on the matter.
Maybe we can make some kind of “discussion digest” email for complicated drops. Idea would be to take all the important questions and responses from ~50 pages of discussion, and condense it into a single email. Obviously a couple problems with that (“more emails” is never a great answer), but if you have ideas or thoughts, let me know via email (will@massdrop.com) and we’ll keep the discussion going (don’t want to hijack anymore space on this drop).
Thanks for your patience and support of this drop, hopefully this covers all the pertinent information and provides an avenue for continued discussion to those who feel most impacted.
stinkyTheDonut
47
Oct 20, 2015
WillMy 2 cents:
I think simply reiterating that mod kits were on the way when the second drop began would have averted all the world's problems.
Much of the confusing discussion on all drops can be avoided by updating the description page. This is a group buy site and it should look a bit more like one, with updates and all continually added under product the description. My suggestion is to list all updates and potential changes at the bottom in bullet points with headings of drop number and date. That way, any newcomer can grasp the context of discussion from previous drops as well as remove the need to have the same questions be asked and answered constantly. This should also serve to remind some impatient people that this is a group buy that involves manufacturing and not a retail store with items in stock.
While I'm at it, will mod kits include internal odac option? =D
I think simply reiterating that mod kits were on the way when the second drop began would have averted all the world's problems.
Much of the confusing discussion on all drops can be avoided by updating the description page. This is a group buy site and it should look a bit more like one, with updates and all continually added under product the description. My suggestion is to list all updates and potential changes at the bottom in bullet points with headings of drop number and date. That way, any newcomer can grasp the context of discussion from previous drops as well as remove the need to have the same questions be asked and answered constantly. This should also serve to remind some impatient people that this is a group buy that involves manufacturing and not a retail store with items in stock.
While I'm at it, will mod kits include internal odac option? =D
kravlin
79
Oct 20, 2015
stinkyTheDonutTotally agree here. I love my O2 and I'm not gonna stop using it and Ill definitely be modding the heck out of it. I wish I'd known the kits were in the pipeline earlier though.
That being said, Massdrop. You guys have got to communicate better. So many updates get lost in the sea of things here, the Fc660m case drop is literally pages upon pages of people asking if it'll fit the Fc660c (that case i'm looking forward to, as i'm typing on one right now), the Noppoo drop was just constantly people asking where stuff was, the knife drops are full of people asking why you won't ship to their country (which I get it, eventually the confiscations just get too much, and it's not worth it anymore, but EXPLAIN that somewhere in the description. PLEASE)
There's a lot that goes on in the discussions that never gets emailed out and is hard to find. There really needs to be separate "drop updates" from discussion (though seeing you guys actually talk and show your excitement for some of the stuff you're doing is very very cool). Just providing easy access to that information, even if it's "There's a strike going on and stuff got delayed" or "For some weird reason, 90% of the supplying company staff turned into marmosets. We're having to source new people to work for them" will help a lot. The planck drop has already seen some massive pitfalls, but regular updates with upfront information from Jack (even if they're just "Things are shipping! haha!") have even dampened the issue with the cases not getting done until December and such.
Additionally, if it's something that's being manufactured and completed by you, make that apparent graphically or when people checkout or something. MAKE THAT STAND OUT. You guys are doing group buys on unique one of a kind products with some very cool partners and projects, which is REALLY AWESOME. You need to make it stand out that you're the ones selling and managing this, not another company who's just gonna hand you the product and you reship. Handling the entire process on your own is much harder, and it means that delays and stuff happen, but if people go in with the mindset that you're doing it on the fly FOR THEM, the "hey, this is gonna take another week!" thing isn't so bad. It tempers their expectations a bit.
I'd also like to say thanks to both Alex and Will (I'm hoping I'm remembering names right). You both have provided stellar updates and really stepped up on several occasions. Hats off to both of you as dealing with angry crowds is both difficult and can be flat out draining.
All in all, I want to see Massdrop do well. So many cool projects, tech, designs, and other stuff can come through here, Little guys with cool ideas can get their product out to people, and it'd be really cool to see this continue happening, there's just some really rough edges you guys need to sand down and refine to make this work so much better.
That being said, Massdrop. You guys have got to communicate better. So many updates get lost in the sea of things here, the Fc660m case drop is literally pages upon pages of people asking if it'll fit the Fc660c (that case i'm looking forward to, as i'm typing on one right now), the Noppoo drop was just constantly people asking where stuff was, the knife drops are full of people asking why you won't ship to their country (which I get it, eventually the confiscations just get too much, and it's not worth it anymore, but EXPLAIN that somewhere in the description. PLEASE)
There's a lot that goes on in the discussions that never gets emailed out and is hard to find. There really needs to be separate "drop updates" from discussion (though seeing you guys actually talk and show your excitement for some of the stuff you're doing is very very cool). Just providing easy access to that information, even if it's "There's a strike going on and stuff got delayed" or "For some weird reason, 90% of the supplying company staff turned into marmosets. We're having to source new people to work for them" will help a lot. The planck drop has already seen some massive pitfalls, but regular updates with upfront information from Jack (even if they're just "Things are shipping! haha!") have even dampened the issue with the cases not getting done until December and such.
Additionally, if it's something that's being manufactured and completed by you, make that apparent graphically or when people checkout or something. MAKE THAT STAND OUT. You guys are doing group buys on unique one of a kind products with some very cool partners and projects, which is REALLY AWESOME. You need to make it stand out that you're the ones selling and managing this, not another company who's just gonna hand you the product and you reship. Handling the entire process on your own is much harder, and it means that delays and stuff happen, but if people go in with the mindset that you're doing it on the fly FOR THEM, the "hey, this is gonna take another week!" thing isn't so bad. It tempers their expectations a bit.
I'd also like to say thanks to both Alex and Will (I'm hoping I'm remembering names right). You both have provided stellar updates and really stepped up on several occasions. Hats off to both of you as dealing with angry crowds is both difficult and can be flat out draining.
All in all, I want to see Massdrop do well. So many cool projects, tech, designs, and other stuff can come through here, Little guys with cool ideas can get their product out to people, and it'd be really cool to see this continue happening, there's just some really rough edges you guys need to sand down and refine to make this work so much better.
Will
8470
Chief Product Officer
Oct 16, 2015
Hey Everyone,
Welcome to the second drop for the Massdrop Objective 2 Headphone Amplifier! First off, big round of internet applause for participants of the first drop. This product exists because of their patience and support. To kick things off, here’s a Q&A taking the most asked questions from the previous drop and adding what we expect you’ll ask first.
Q: Is this the original O2 with all NwAvGuy’s approved parts? A: Yep! All parts used in the production of this O2 are from NwAvGuy’s original BOM (other than the metal case, and metal volume knob, those are both custom parts we had manufactured)
Q: For the desktop version (RCA Input, 1/4” output, rear power) how did you add those options without altering the PCB? A: Where most manufacturers use jumper wires (little wires that run from the output PCB pads to the rear RCA jacks as an example), we created daughter PCBs that connect inside the case. While this solution is more expensive, there’s no danger of jumper wires being dislodged during transit.
Q: Looking at the discussion, I see the last drop was delivered much later than originally anticipated. What’s being done to ensure an on-time arrival for the drop this time around? A: Most of the delays we faced in the first drop were caused by unexpected part shortages. We had to source several parts in the united states, ship them to our manufacturing partner, and deal with meaningful delays when foreign customs decided to hold those parts for nearly 10 days. This time, all the parts are already sourced and on their way to our manufacturing partner, no customs shenanigans expected this time. Glad to provide more examples, but suffice to say, we’ve learned from our experiences in the first drop and won’t repeat the same mistakes.
We’re excited to have the O2 (plus new desktop edition) back on Massdrop. I’ll be around all day to answer questions so hit reply, write your post, and I’ll be notified.
Thanks for your interest and support!
Welcome to the second drop for the Massdrop Objective 2 Headphone Amplifier! First off, big round of internet applause for participants of the first drop. This product exists because of their patience and support. To kick things off, here’s a Q&A taking the most asked questions from the previous drop and adding what we expect you’ll ask first.
Q: Is this the original O2 with all NwAvGuy’s approved parts? A: Yep! All parts used in the production of this O2 are from NwAvGuy’s original BOM (other than the metal case, and metal volume knob, those are both custom parts we had manufactured)
Q: For the desktop version (RCA Input, 1/4” output, rear power) how did you add those options without altering the PCB? A: Where most manufacturers use jumper wires (little wires that run from the output PCB pads to the rear RCA jacks as an example), we created daughter PCBs that connect inside the case. While this solution is more expensive, there’s no danger of jumper wires being dislodged during transit.
Q: Looking at the discussion, I see the last drop was delivered much later than originally anticipated. What’s being done to ensure an on-time arrival for the drop this time around? A: Most of the delays we faced in the first drop were caused by unexpected part shortages. We had to source several parts in the united states, ship them to our manufacturing partner, and deal with meaningful delays when foreign customs decided to hold those parts for nearly 10 days. This time, all the parts are already sourced and on their way to our manufacturing partner, no customs shenanigans expected this time. Glad to provide more examples, but suffice to say, we’ve learned from our experiences in the first drop and won’t repeat the same mistakes.
We’re excited to have the O2 (plus new desktop edition) back on Massdrop. I’ll be around all day to answer questions so hit reply, write your post, and I’ll be notified.
Thanks for your interest and support!
Darkstar77
123
Oct 17, 2015
It is rewarding doing the DIY thing, especially if you can get away without doing surface mount stuff. I built a SSMH tube amp in the winter last year, and what a great experience. You need basic soldering skills to build one of those, and the result is outstanding. Check out the JDS Labs soldering guide for their DIY O2 amp:
http://www.jdslabs.com/pdf/Custom%20O2%20-%20Soldering%20Guide.pdf
Keep in mind, the reference design requirements on the PCB, and that guide is very relevant, and looks like it would be very easy to move the power and RCA inputs to the back.
You can even get machined front and rear plates from JDS for pretty cheap.
http://www.jdslabs.com/pdf/Custom%20O2%20-%20Soldering%20Guide.pdf
Keep in mind, the reference design requirements on the PCB, and that guide is very relevant, and looks like it would be very easy to move the power and RCA inputs to the back.
You can even get machined front and rear plates from JDS for pretty cheap.
hiduplawak
17
Oct 18, 2015
WillHi Will, can we get an option to change the gain settings to 1x/3.3x since we got the odac drop now.
archeion
4
Jul 24, 2015
Why did all of Tyler's posts get deleted? I want to hear what he has to say, since he has been making these for a while.
needhelp
331
Jul 25, 2015
lucky that you put so much thought into your future 70 buck amp. perhaps you can save it and dont buy it. nobody needs an amp.
iamleo
58
Jul 25, 2015
"no industrial eng / project mgt experience" - that's just one person's (biased) opinion. You guys are doing a great job at Massdrop. I already have an O2 but I have decided to join the drop to show my support.
runeoe
20
Jul 27, 2015
@the gurus/experts
***please set the record straight as far as what is even possible at this price range.***
So people do not waste time requesting impossible features.
Rechargeable batteries even at bulk rates would drive cost up what? $25-$30??? so that is not a realistic request at $70 shipped.
is DAC even possible at this price range?
***please set the record straight as far as what is even possible at this price range.***
So people do not waste time requesting impossible features.
Rechargeable batteries even at bulk rates would drive cost up what? $25-$30??? so that is not a realistic request at $70 shipped.
is DAC even possible at this price range?
chzel
173
Jul 29, 2015
Unusual as it may seem, he did it. His design, his rules, his justifications.
You can see how exactly he specifies part numbers from specific manufacturers. Here is a link to the BOM:
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B52Awjeyc5zKYWViZjlhNzItZDBmYi00YjA4LTk1NzgtZTMwNTAzMWQ3Y2Iy&hl=en_US
YachadM
51
Jul 29, 2015
chzelLooking through the BoM, I see that he has chosen very high quality components, except for that Lelon capacitor which snuck in there somehow.
His specific choice of Vishay SFR and CCF resistors (or the Nichicon UPW capacitor) for their specific functions, proves that he knows exactly what he's doing, and no, you can't go in and just substitute with generic crap and hope that you get the same reliability or performance.
In my designs, I always specify Vishay as a first choice (where available), not because I'm a brand snob, but because our customers expect, and pay for reliability.
Deviate from your mission, and you can count the days until you're tossed in the trash can.
In my designs, I always specify Vishay as a first choice (where available), not because I'm a brand snob, but because our customers expect, and pay for reliability.
Deviate from your mission, and you can count the days until you're tossed in the trash can.
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