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Kershaw Copper Natrix Folding Knife
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Kershaw Copper Natrix Folding Knife
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Product Description
The Kershaw Natrix series is characterized by its patented sub frame lock mechanism, in which one side of the handle has a steel plate for secure lockup, while the rest of the handle can be made from other materials. On this version, the handle is constructed from solid copper, the blade from D2 steel Read More
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keyboard_arrow_downKavik
5531
Jul 22, 2019
Update:
Still no responses or reassurances here in the discussions on how they plan to clean up this mess....very disappointing Drop.
I've just sent in my ticket to the support team, to voice my concerns in a more official capacity, so to speak, and to request compensation for this knife that doesn't match what I purchased. Lacking that, then a full reimbursement and paid return shipping.
I suggest others voice similar complaints through the support tickets (including those who DID cancel in time who want to make their feelings known about the bait and switch that happened here), as clearly no one from the company takes these discussion threads seriously anymore.
@Drop @Drop+Blades @kyleemj @AlexPk @steve
@Amassed2Much @Desastor @nathan.coulombe @Mmhmmm @AJAugust
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Hello,
I am writing to inquire about a resolution to yet another instance of inaccurate specs listed on one of your advertisements, as well as voice my concerns over some serious misconduct in how this drop was handled and the way your company attempted to resolve the incorrect product listing.
At the time I placed my order, this knife was listed as having a 3.25" blade, and an overall length of 7.5". In actuality, the knife I received has a blade length well under 3" and an overall length under 6.5". Additionally, the knife is listed as having a spring assisted opening mechanism, which it does not.
If you look at the listing now you will see the specs on blade and handle length have been changed (though it still incorrectly lists the SpeedSafe assisted opening mechanism in the written description). This mid-drop change is my primary point of concern, in addition to the knife not being what I paid for.
I would like to request confirmation that this issue will be brought directly to the attention of your legal department.
In the discussion, buyer Kyleemj confirmed that the specs on the knife were changed in the middle of the drop, after multiple users (myself included) had already placed their orders. (https://drop.com/buy/kershaw-copper-natrix-folding-knife/talk/2469639)
While this change should have resulted in the drop being cancelled and re-opened after the corrections were made, this did not happen. No one even went so far as to contact the buyers directly to alert them of the change so that they could make an informed decision on whether or not they wanted to continue with their purchases.
I've spoken with other users in the discussion thread who were already told by support that they will be responsible for return shipping costs when they found out about the change after they had already been charged. This is an outrageously unacceptable resolution when the error, and subsequent mishandling of the situation, was clearly on your end.
This went from an all too familiar case of false advertising, to a clear cut bait and switch scenario because of those actions that were taken while the drop remained live.
The reason I am asking for this to be escalated directly to the legal department is that I feel that this is a very serious issue, and hope you understand it to be as well. One that potential opens you up to both lawsuits and difficulties with the FTC/BBB/etc. While I don't personally wish to see that happen, it inevitably will if these unethical business practices continue.
The staff who handle the drops and manage the website need to be better educated in the laws and regulations around e-commerce and have a clear understanding of the legal ramifications of their actions in situations like this.
As for my personal purchase, I would be willing to keep this knife if you were to offer a partial reimbursement. I actually do like it for what it is, but it clearly isn't what I originally purchased.
Please let me know if you would be willing to discuss compensation for your errors, or if the only option is a full refund with a pre-paid RMA.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
glennac
1363
Aug 1, 2019
All good points Kavik.
What Drop needs is a dedicated Knife Representative. Someone that goes to all of the shows, visits manufacturers, and someone that "knows" knives and the knife community. They would be responsible for searching out new products, cutting new deals with manufacturers, and arranging for co-labs with artisan makers. They would be responsible for preparing listings THEMSELVES, not some underling. Drop lists and moves enough knives that a dedicated position just for this category would be worth it.
I think this would go a long way to repairing the black eye Drop has received among the community (same for the flashlight community as well. It's embarrassing the decisions, lack of after-sale support, and co-lab choices that have been made in that area as well).
These things can't be an afterthought. Drop's treatment of these communities, and the respect (or lack of respect) is reflected in the way they choose to handle listings, Support issues, and complaints.
(Edited)
Kavik
5531
Aug 2, 2019
glennacIn an ideal world...yes to all of that. But I doubt we'll ever see it.
Bare minimum though, what they need to start doing is getting a sample piece when they make a deal, so that they can at least verify the specs they're advertising before the page goes up.
Legally, they are responsible for ensuring everything they write is accurate, they can't just go on the word of the supplier. If they do, it's still Drop that's liable for the errors, not the supplier.
It would add all of 2 minutes to their work to open a sample piece, verify the steel markings and take a couple measurements.
In the long run that's WAAAAYYY cheaper to pay someone for 2 more minutes of work than to keep having to make these apologetic bribes---errrr, i mean, refunds
Kavik
5531
Jul 11, 2019
Well, considering people have been questioning this for 8 months, without a single response from anyone on the Drop staff, I'm choosing to take that to mean they're standing by their advertised specs.
I'm in, for a 3.25" Copper Natrix.
Show me what you got, Drop.
Kavik
5531
Jul 12, 2019
I don't want to dismiss your complaints there, that is shitty, and there are countless stories from other users that are similar, but I don't want this to turn into general complaints about the customer service here.
But, as a side note, one of the things lost when I lost all that I had originally written, is that there's also a section in that document I referenced that speaks about written warranties.
By law, they are required to provide customers access to written warranties prior to purchasing, any time a warranty is mentioned on a product for sale. So, for all the MD/Drop Collab items, all these months and years they just keep telling us "don't worry, we'll take care of you", and promising that some day they'll get a warranty written up, then jerking people around they way they did with you...again, that's more that just unprofessional, it's not within the laws of doing commerce online.
This thing I'm trying to focus on in this particular conversation is a whole other ball of wax though.
Originally this would've been yet another clear case of false advertising...however, changing the specs after people made purchases, that probably pushed it into bait and switch territory as well.
I joined this drop, got email confirmation from PayPal that payment was authorized for the purchase, then 2 minutes after the timestamp of that email i have a screenshot of what the specs stated at that time. (the original, larger blade size)
Like, who in their right mind would think for even one second that it's okay to change an ad AFTER people make purchases?
I honestly don't know how this site doesn't have a new lawsuit against them every month or two, this shit is clear cut, black and white, obvious violations.
I don't WANT that to start happening, i want to see them get their heads out of their asses and start acting like the actual big business that they are.
That's my goal in bringing these things out in the open here, but now it's up to them if they want to listen or not.
@drop, if you don't want to listen to it coming from your customers, talk to your lawyers. Tell them what you did with changing the specs on this drop after so many members joined in on it, and see what sort of a reaction you get from them
Desastor
336
Jul 13, 2019
KavikConsidering the fucked up reactive attitude of many online businesses these days ( i.e., we'll try to get away with it as much as we can and until you stop it) they probably have to be sued. I am dealing with an issue right now where I have been billed for several items that neither show up on my transactions list nor at my doorstop. The only think Masdrop has done is to basically blame me alleging that I have ordered via a second user account, which I don't have. I like the concept and some of the warez but I do not have a fuzzy warm feeling for Massdrop as an entity as it is as inadequate as Amazon, Google, Facebook, etc when it comes to real customer related concern. They just don' fucking care, which is totally insane given that this is a service industry. Except, we as customers enable them to behave like this. Until we won't and at that time they are done already bc trust had been eroded irreparably.
nathan.coulombe
387
Jul 10, 2019
Why are the specs still wrong? Does everybody over there at Drop just have their head shoved so far up their ass they can't see straight? People were reporting these as incorrect 8 FUCKING MONTHS AGO. Utter incompetence at it's absolute finest.
Power270
1
Aug 25, 2019
Were is it made ? I’ve requested this be posted on everything but to no avail. Not good business practice transparency is a good model to live by. I only buy American made!!!
Jlczl
96
Sep 10, 2019
🤔 maybe he just buys US product to help keep jobs in this country regardless of which party is in power. Not everything is about politics.
LMNOBeast
32
Sep 12, 2019
Well, technically Kershaw has been a Japanese company since 1977. And they made their knives overseas until 1997. On a fun separate note... Kershaw was founded by a Gerber employee who was tired of their shit. Some things never change...
Amassed2Much
26
Jul 15, 2019
They changed the specifications on the knife from the full sized Natrix to the mini Natrix after they charged my credit card. “Customer service” refuses to cancel my order and requires me to go through the hassle of sending the wrong knife back at my expense. Don’t make the mistake I did and order from this site.
glennac
1363
Jul 23, 2019
Hmm, now I have to think about it. 🤔 Where DID I get it? … … … (checking email for receipt)
Ah! From The Kershaw Store. They had a preorder sale last summer for $48 Total.
https://www.thekershawstore.com/kershaw-copper-natrix-plain-edge-knife-7006CU/
kyleemj
512
Jul 12, 2019
Hey everyone. Thank you for bringing the copy errors to our attention in regards to the specification section on the Copper Natrix. The page has been updated with the correct specifications as of yesterday and we double checked with the vendor to ensure everything is correct. Again, we appreciate your support and understanding.
Kavik
5531
Jul 13, 2019
kyleemjKylee,
It's been over a day, and only a day left to the drop. Do you intend to make any more effort to contact those who joined the current drop?
Or to address any of the other questions and concerns that have been brought up here?
Or does Drop really feel this post in a discussion page is enough?
According to previous purchasers, there's still another part of the description here that is not accurate in this knife.
There are currently 3 drops live in the Blades community right now, that I personally know of, that have incorrect advertising in them...all of which your members have spelled out for you at length, and you've re-run (more than once in two of the cases) without making the necessary corrections.
AJAugust
353
Jul 12, 2019
Specifications for this knife changed, i.e., it is now 1/2 inch SHORTER... I HATE short knives... If I want a box cutter, I’ll get a box cutter...
How can the specs change in the middle of a Drop?!?!
Hey Drop...! This is not cool... at all!!
Cancelled my order.
(Edited)
nathan.coulombe
387
Jul 12, 2019
AJAugustThe specs didn't change so much as get corrected. They were entirely wrong to begin with.
Kavik
5531
Jul 12, 2019
nathan.coulombeThis is a perfect example though of why just mentioning it in the discussion section isn't adequate, and why updating mid-drop has reprocussions.
In the eyes of someone who didn't read the discussion thread first, the specs DID change
I wish I had seen how many ordered before this drop, to see how many joined in this time, and how many cancel by the end of it. (241 sold as of now, will that number go down if people back out I wonder?)
I don't specifically wish Drop any ill will, but I hope they learn a hard lesson on this one, if that will help them change for the better going forward
DougFLA123
1404
Nov 19, 2018
A lot of people all over the Internet are complaining about the super strong detent! People are having a hard time opening it with one hand! That’s crazy!
14themoney
1395
Jan 16, 2019
DougFLA123I am embarrassed to admit that I have not contacted them. Things got busy with work, church, and the holidays. Now I'm heading home after several weeks with my progeny. This is on my 2019 list.
EdAish
41
Jul 11, 2019
I really like the look of this and would buy based on specs BUT is it actually a speed safe and is it actually the size they quote??
Hatuletoh
850
Jul 11, 2019
EdAishThe CuMini Natrix rides on the KVT system, like a Zero Tolerance, which is good, because I think the torsion bar of the Speed Safe system would put enough pressure on a cpl points inside those copper scales to eventually begin to dig into them.
The KVT works well on this knife EVENTUALLY, but everyone I know who bought one last year had the same issue I did: very sticky action right out of the box. Yes, knives have to break in, but of the two I bought, one started out so tight I couldn't flip it open initially. But unlike some other people, I didn't give up in frustration when the action was still too tight after 15 minutes of playing with my knives, and return them in frustration. It did take longer than I expected--maybe three or four days or regular use and blade deployment, but the actions on both of them are excellent now; good like a ZT, with a strong detent that is easily overcome when the flipper is pressed. Just took some time to get there.
LMNOBeast
32
Jul 13, 2019
HatuletohAnother factor that may be contributing to the stiff action is that Kershaw's sub-frame lock bar is too damn wide. It's only a slight a problem on the copper Natrix because the knife is so small that you can bury the back end in the meat of your palm or otherwise adjust your grip to avoid the lockbar. But holy shit does it get in the way on the Bareknuckle. I'm convinced the lockbar is the main culprit behind complaints regarding the 0777—although it is aptly named because you have to grip it like a knuckle ball for the best action.
(Edited)
glennac
1363
Jul 10, 2019
Here’s mine among my current collection (bottom right). This can give you a good comparison on size in relation to other known knives out there. It’s about the same size as the SOG Twitch next to it, or the Kizer Fiest above it.
Hatuletoh
850
Jul 11, 2019
glennacTell me the piece on the top of the right row isn't a Boker kwaiken. The size and the flipper dont look quite right, but if you had it customized, and it is a kwaiken, esp a Boker kwaiken, well...I might hyperventilate with pure jealousy. My mental issues aside, nice piece, whatever it is.
I have the Spyderco Chaparral with the noble raffir scales and just love the hell out them. Indeed, I've been casually asking around to people I know to see if there is anyone competent and confident enough to machine some scales for me. They would look amazing on the bronze version of the Zero Tolerance 0393, especially with a copper pivot screw and clip hole filler tab...mmm-hmmm!
Also, what's the little fat coffin-handle number, second down on the left?
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