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SMSL M8A DAC
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SMSL M8A DAC
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Product Description
Upgraded with the latest Sabre DAC ES9028Q2M and XMOS-XCroe 200 Xu208 USB receiving chipset, the SMSL M8A is the revision to the previous SMSL M8 model. It offers sampling support up to 768kHz and is built with three input options (USB, optical, and coaxial) and one RCA analog out Read More
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keyboard_arrow_downAdamInHiltonHead
43
May 2, 2017
I clicked discussion positive I would see you guys guys poking at how the jump 'away' from the 9018 'to' the 9028Q2M is offered as the 'upgraded' version?????? Help me understand this - because we all have so many 784-files - the 'A' Version is an upgrade even though THD, SNR, etc. has been downgraded via 9018 to 9028Q2M? Hmmm?
Airisom
21
May 18, 2017
Well, the M8A will be my taste of DSD512 upsampling with Foobar/HQPlayer, so if I like what I hear, then I'll pick up one of the flagship dacs out there like L.K.S Audio's recently released dual-mono 9038 dac, x-sabre pro, or whatever Gustard will be releasing with the 9038.
Update: Well, I like what I hear. Not enough to warrant spending $1K+ on another DAC, though.
Update: Well, I like what I hear. Not enough to warrant spending $1K+ on another DAC, though.
Jimster480
395
Jun 27, 2017
AdamInHiltonHeadYes there is no upgrade, and you are right there is no DSD512 or 786khz PCM files so its a wash.
Pathworks
81
Jul 18, 2017
Thinking of hooking this up to a CuBox-i via USB out for a Roon endpoint to my home theater receiver. Have a mojo and plan to compare them in this config to see if it is just as good. Anybody compare this to the mojo as a desktop dac? Hey Massdrop how about dropping the P1 linear power supply?
Pathworks
81
Aug 11, 2017
PathworksArrived today! Picked up the P1 linear power supply on ebay in advance. Note, the P1 was really made for the M8 since it has a fixed 9v out (M8) and a variable port that can be configured from 5v (M8A) to 12v -- effectively eliminating an output port. I was hoping to power the CuBox-i (5v) Roon endpoint and use the other output for the M8A (5v) but no luck. I'm also using a Schiit Wyrd (USB decrapifier between the CuBox and the M8).
So far, I have successfully hooked it up to both PC and CuBox-i Roon endpoints (So definitely works in the Roon environment - the CuBox is running Linux btw). Too soon to compare to the Chord Mojo with similar connections but I will be using a Schiit sys to do quick a/b tests and I'll let folks know what my subjective listening tests reveal. I actually wish SMSL didn't have the selectable filters as I'm not sure what to pick (I'll be f'ing with it forever!). Already able to stream native DSD to the SMSL from PC over USB whereas only able to do DSD over PCM (DoP) with the Mojo... don't know if this will improve sound quality or not. Edit. Only able to pick DoP when using the CuBox as a roon endpoint connected to the M8A.
Pathworks
81
Aug 12, 2017
PathworksComparison Setup:
0. Roon Core running on an Intel Nuc
music files stored on internal drive.
SMSL Setup Environment: 1. Ethernet RJ45 2. CuBox-i (Linux 2.14.79-cubox) roon bridge 3. Schiit Wyrd (USB decrapifier) 4. SMSL 8A DAC (with P1 linear power supply) (filter set to 70K on DSD and Fast on PCM tracks)
Chord Mojo Setup Environment: 1. Ethernet RJ45 2. CuBox (SonicOrbiter on linux) roon bridge 3. Schiit Wyrd (USB decrapifier - yes I have 2) 4. Chord Mojo - internal battery power supply(line out mode with volume ticked down to match the SMSL output)
5. Both systems RCA'd to Schiit SYS (Volume control and 2-input switch) 6. STAX SRM-323S Driver unit for earspeakers 7. STAX SR507 Earspeakers
Both endpoints are set to run DoP for DSD audio
Music: Classical: 1. Dreams & Prayers: A Far Cry/David Krakauer Track 8: Quartet, op. 132: Helliger Dakgesang (Beethoven) DR(R128) 15.2 LU DSD128
2. Mozart: Violin Concertos: Marianne Thorsen / Trindheim Soloists Track 1. Violin Concerto No. 4 in D major, K.218 * Allegro DR(R128) 13.8LU PCM Flac 352.8KHz 24bit
Jazz: 1. So Many Stars: John Moriarty Trio DSD64 Track 1: So Many Stars DR(R128) 16.3 LU
2. Summer Serenade - Benny Carter Quartet DSD128 Track 4: All That Jazz DR(R128) 5.1 LU
3. Cirklar: Tingvall Trio PCM FLAC 96kHz 24bit Track 1: Evlghetsmasklnen DR(R128) 12.4 LU
4. Move: Hiromi & the Trio Project PCM FLAC 192kHz 24bit Track 1: Move DR(128) 6.8 LU
Rock: 1. Moving Pictures: Rush PCM Flac 48kHz 24bit Track 1: Tom Sawyer DR(R128) 3.4 LU
2. Shockwave Supernova: Joe Satriani PCM Flac 96kHz 24bit Track 5. On Peregrine Wings DR(R128) 2.4 LU
Sample Sound Quality Results: I could quickly switch between Mojo and 8A and could not hear a difference between the two. As you may know, if you conduct the experiment the experimenter becomes part of the test results. I'm listening with 54-year-old ears so younger ears may hear a difference but I doubt it.
The samples were simple and complex with hi-res only comparrisons. The mark of a good dac is not to impart anything to the music and I can conclude that both the Mojo and the 8A don't.
Note: this was a sound quality only comparrison. Obviously the Mojo has more to offer than just a DAC. I'm happy with both and will be keeping them.
SMSL Setup Environment: 1. Ethernet RJ45 2. CuBox-i (Linux 2.14.79-cubox) roon bridge 3. Schiit Wyrd (USB decrapifier) 4. SMSL 8A DAC (with P1 linear power supply) (filter set to 70K on DSD and Fast on PCM tracks)
Chord Mojo Setup Environment: 1. Ethernet RJ45 2. CuBox (SonicOrbiter on linux) roon bridge 3. Schiit Wyrd (USB decrapifier - yes I have 2) 4. Chord Mojo - internal battery power supply(line out mode with volume ticked down to match the SMSL output)
5. Both systems RCA'd to Schiit SYS (Volume control and 2-input switch) 6. STAX SRM-323S Driver unit for earspeakers 7. STAX SR507 Earspeakers
Both endpoints are set to run DoP for DSD audio
Music: Classical: 1. Dreams & Prayers: A Far Cry/David Krakauer Track 8: Quartet, op. 132: Helliger Dakgesang (Beethoven) DR(R128) 15.2 LU DSD128
2. Mozart: Violin Concertos: Marianne Thorsen / Trindheim Soloists Track 1. Violin Concerto No. 4 in D major, K.218 * Allegro DR(R128) 13.8LU PCM Flac 352.8KHz 24bit
Jazz: 1. So Many Stars: John Moriarty Trio DSD64 Track 1: So Many Stars DR(R128) 16.3 LU
2. Summer Serenade - Benny Carter Quartet DSD128 Track 4: All That Jazz DR(R128) 5.1 LU
3. Cirklar: Tingvall Trio PCM FLAC 96kHz 24bit Track 1: Evlghetsmasklnen DR(R128) 12.4 LU
4. Move: Hiromi & the Trio Project PCM FLAC 192kHz 24bit Track 1: Move DR(128) 6.8 LU
Rock: 1. Moving Pictures: Rush PCM Flac 48kHz 24bit Track 1: Tom Sawyer DR(R128) 3.4 LU
2. Shockwave Supernova: Joe Satriani PCM Flac 96kHz 24bit Track 5. On Peregrine Wings DR(R128) 2.4 LU
Sample Sound Quality Results: I could quickly switch between Mojo and 8A and could not hear a difference between the two. As you may know, if you conduct the experiment the experimenter becomes part of the test results. I'm listening with 54-year-old ears so younger ears may hear a difference but I doubt it.
The samples were simple and complex with hi-res only comparrisons. The mark of a good dac is not to impart anything to the music and I can conclude that both the Mojo and the 8A don't.
Note: this was a sound quality only comparrison. Obviously the Mojo has more to offer than just a DAC. I'm happy with both and will be keeping them.
SciKnight
15
Aug 17, 2017
This or the ODAC? Currently using the SMSL SD-793II amp/dac combo and have already joined the drop for the Cavelli amp. Would this or the ODAC be a better pairing with my coming amp? I own and use both the K7XX and Fostex TH-X00 headpohones.
Stephen879
64
Feb 13, 2018
I think they’re very similar. Nothing wrong with the SQ in either ito my ears. Picking a winner has to be based on versatility, and the M8 is the more versatile.
Stephen879
64
Feb 13, 2018
For music the M8. I have many files, such as my 192/24 and a few DSD that the ODAC can’t play. For movies either one.
JRichards
12
May 31, 2017
I compared this new M8A DAC with the original M8 and think the old one sounds better. The low Mids are a little bloated and not as coherent as the original M8. Also DSD playback is way too hot compared to PCM (Hi Res flac). DSD playback is 2X louder than the original M8. It almost overloads my preamp. Also it restarted several times when I was comparing the two. I hope they fix these issues.
JRichards
12
Jun 4, 2017
Random reboots. Reboots alot when switching inputs. Also disconects USB when switching inputs. the only way to re-connect is to power cycle.
JRichards
12
Jun 5, 2017
I have a pre-12/2016 and a post-12/2016 with the DSD256 and screen saver. They both sound exactly the same however having DSD256 and a screen saver is a plus for the post unit. I would go for the Post 12/2016 unit as it is their best. I purchased 2 spares of the post 12/2016 as I love the sound of this one. I am a sound engineer and have mixed and mastered many well-known talent. I know what sounds good on reference gear.
dshreter
13
May 12, 2017
How many folks plan to get an upgraded power supply to use with this? I've read elsewhere this is beneficial, but having trouble deciding if it's worth it and which to get. The SMSL P1 is appealing to match in looks, but seems expensive vs alternatives.
coolerking
164
Jan 16, 2018
"Yep the power supply shouldn't make any difference"
I do not want to flame you, but you are giving people the idea that you know what you are taking about.
If you are familiar with Semiconductor architectures (" Yep the power supply shouldn't make any difference ") then you would never make a statement like that.
Saying the quality of power made available to the circuit board and IC's is not important at all, is like saying a well meaning individuals do not require physical attraction to have a lifelong 100% enjoyable love life. Its ridiculous.
Also is their plenty of evidence from other audio boards that 1) this little device kicks ass and 2) with a linear power supply, as opposed to switching.
Just do a search on SMSL M8 and linear power supply.
I have no idea what the heck you are talking about, " And every major review site that checked it out came to the same conclusion " This is a flat out lie!
People are in enchanted by this digital mentality. Where they see an extremely complex system, an audio consumer electronic device, in black and white. No, No, No.
Here is reality. Ground noise, clocking , power availability, signal noise, IC characteristics, the IC eco-system of surrounding discretes and other IC's characteristics , cost and inter-opibility issues, Bill of materials, difficulty in bringing the whole system to mass production and maintaining it, support costs and lastly timing - how quickly can it all be done for the certain market window, and lastly the profit margin (how much does it cost to make, and what do they sell it at) ~ gets thrown into one big pot, and the company (ie SMSL) manages all the trade-offs, and releases the product.
Power is a huge component in all the trade-offs. In all designs. In this design, if you provide clean power, either battery pack or a linear power supply, the thing kicks ass. It is an over - achiever for over all cost $240.
BTW a $60 LPS should do it. Do a search, there are answers out there, and suggestions.
I have no idea what the heck you are talking about, " And every major review site that checked it out came to the same conclusion " This is a flat out lie!
People are in enchanted by this digital mentality. Where they see an extremely complex system, an audio consumer electronic device, in black and white. No, No, No.
Here is reality. Ground noise, clocking , power availability, signal noise, IC characteristics, the IC eco-system of surrounding discretes and other IC's characteristics , cost and inter-opibility issues, Bill of materials, difficulty in bringing the whole system to mass production and maintaining it, support costs and lastly timing - how quickly can it all be done for the certain market window, and lastly the profit margin (how much does it cost to make, and what do they sell it at) ~ gets thrown into one big pot, and the company (ie SMSL) manages all the trade-offs, and releases the product.
Power is a huge component in all the trade-offs. In all designs. In this design, if you provide clean power, either battery pack or a linear power supply, the thing kicks ass. It is an over - achiever for over all cost $240.
BTW a $60 LPS should do it. Do a search, there are answers out there, and suggestions.
Jimster480
395
Jan 16, 2018
coolerkingNice flame.
People are enchanted by not understanding semiconductor architectures. People such as yourself that believe that linear power supplies are superior to switching ones.
And people who believe that modern semiconductors cannot internally filter out noise (they can).
Every site that did a real measurement with the M8 using a linear power supply came back with NO DIFFERENCE.
Only idiots on Head-Fi (A site filled with idiots and scamlord admins) believe there is some difference. But the same idiots on head-fi also believe that dirty USB data exists and that headphone cables make "worlds difference" in sound quality. Basically showing that Head-Fi writers have 0 credibility on the subject of anything that costs money or could possibly get them kickbacks.
Only idiots on Head-Fi (A site filled with idiots and scamlord admins) believe there is some difference. But the same idiots on head-fi also believe that dirty USB data exists and that headphone cables make "worlds difference" in sound quality. Basically showing that Head-Fi writers have 0 credibility on the subject of anything that costs money or could possibly get them kickbacks.
Tizman
11
Feb 2, 2018
I received the M8A on the last drop, and have had the opportunity to compare it to my Musical Fidelity V90-DAC over the last few months. The V90-DAC sounds better than the M8A in every case, no matter what the source file is. The M8A plays pretty much everything I put into it natively. The V90-DAC requires that JRiver convert many high resolution files, and all DSD files, to something it will recognize but it always sounds better than the M8A. By better, I mean more realistic. The V90-DAC makes it seem like your listening to an actual person singing and playing a guitar in front of you, while the M8A lacks this realism. I believe that there is far too much emphasis placed on the particular DAC chip used in units, and not enough on the quality of the output stage. Of course, your mileage may vary, but I have used both DACs with numerous tube preamps and tube amplifiers, and a variety of loudspeakers, and the V90-DAC always sounds better. I will probably be selling the M8A soon.
Tizman
11
Feb 11, 2018
I use JRiver, and it converts the files to something the V90-DAC can use. Perhaps if you have a system of very high resolution, you might be able to
hear a difference between DAC chips assuming an identical output stage. My feeling is that output stage is largely ignored with DACs, with all the emphasis being put on specific DAC chips. For an interesting perspective on this, check out the Lampizator site. As it is, I’d rather listen to 24/96 or CD on the V90 than DSD 256 on the M8A. By a wide margin....
coolerking
164
Mar 25, 2018
TizmanTizman - Kudos, I appreciate the feedback.
I do not even look at what chip is being used, and I have 25 years experience as an engineer in the Semicon industry (digital and analog).
Its an analog world folks, all that I really want and appreciate in these discussions is feedback on the sound, and you did a very good job speaking to that, and comparing it to a known DAC is all the more helpful.
I do know that the older M8 (ie not not m8A) is an amazing unit, but that is after I spent $70 on a linear power supply. still at $250 total i am happy.
This is something else people ignore , some circuits require cleaner power. I stress circuits, it is the chip and everything else.
This thing, m8A has a 5v power i believe, and i think people are using an external USB charger battery. I am opening up a can of worms here, but DC (battery) is always going to be cleaner.
I am curious if you were to try that, what it would sound like?
BTW i am using the M8 through a Roksan Kandy Amp and Kestral speakers. Very precise, very articulate, and a slightly forward sound. I like it. (As a source I use my laptop or a CA audio labs CD player. I am not going to say which one sounds better, there are too many other variables involved, sorry)
Thanks again
I do not even look at what chip is being used, and I have 25 years experience as an engineer in the Semicon industry (digital and analog).
Its an analog world folks, all that I really want and appreciate in these discussions is feedback on the sound, and you did a very good job speaking to that, and comparing it to a known DAC is all the more helpful.
I do know that the older M8 (ie not not m8A) is an amazing unit, but that is after I spent $70 on a linear power supply. still at $250 total i am happy.
This is something else people ignore , some circuits require cleaner power. I stress circuits, it is the chip and everything else.
This thing, m8A has a 5v power i believe, and i think people are using an external USB charger battery. I am opening up a can of worms here, but DC (battery) is always going to be cleaner.
I am curious if you were to try that, what it would sound like?
BTW i am using the M8 through a Roksan Kandy Amp and Kestral speakers. Very precise, very articulate, and a slightly forward sound. I like it. (As a source I use my laptop or a CA audio labs CD player. I am not going to say which one sounds better, there are too many other variables involved, sorry)
Thanks again
Kornasteniker
6
Sep 12, 2017
If the drop starts next time, i'd very much like to see a black version of the DAC. Silver just doesn't fit into my current audio setup. So PLS Massdrop: Do a black Massdrop version of the SMSL M8A!
Kornasteniker
6
Aug 15, 2018
KornastenikerIs there any chance to get a black version of this amp? Maybe Massdrop could contact SMSL and see if it is possible for SMSL to make a black version?
Gernapious
56
Dec 12, 2017
Has anyone used this with Windows 10?
I have had issue with other DACs and Windows 10 not supporting more that 24-bit/19200 Hz. Has anyone confirmed Windows 10 usage in 32-bit with this DAC?
I have had issue with other DACs and Windows 10 not supporting more that 24-bit/19200 Hz. Has anyone confirmed Windows 10 usage in 32-bit with this DAC?
kokkat
223
Dec 13, 2017
GernapiousFor music recorded live directly to DSD, use the coupon code "ifimicroidac2" at
http://soundliaison.com/all-categories/185-ifi-micro-idac2-music-sampler
(1.3 GB zip file)
John57
2
Sep 16, 2017
Does this unit go to standby after a few minutes and will cut out sound for a second or two when it becomes active?
John57
2
Sep 16, 2017
That would be good to know since for example the IFI iDSD DAC will go to standby after a short period of time and when music starts playing again you will miss a few seconds of sounds as the IFI iDSD DAC goes back to active state.
Jackula
1743
Sep 17, 2017
John57A lot of the time, this is due to how Windows manages USB power than your DAC device. Check this setting here: Start > Control Panel > Power Options > Edit Plan Settings > Change Advanced Power Settings. Under USB Settings, disable the USB selective suspend setting.
For some reason, Windows always defaults this setting to "enabled" even if your computer is set to "High Performance". It causes dropout issues with some DACs.
For some reason, Windows always defaults this setting to "enabled" even if your computer is set to "High Performance". It causes dropout issues with some DACs.
2denull
0
May 1, 2017
I can't really say that the M8 sounds better than my Sanskrit 6th anniversary edition. In fact, I think the Sanskrit sounds better. Both are new so waiting for some "break in" period to see.
Yakov
1420
May 1, 2017
burn in period... for 1s and 0s conversions.
Okiiiiii.
(SMSL M8 owner here, older model)
kasyx
22
Nov 19, 2017
YakovDAC as for Digital to ANALOG Converter.
What is the output of any DAC......? 0s and 1s..? :)
My M8A after 24h of constant audio streaming got softer, highs are better controlled. And no, it is not my brain adjusting as Im using my Gustard X20Pro as a stable reference, listening to the same song every 10 or so hours just selecting different input in my Sr-009 setup.
On the other hand I can fully understand that one cannot hear burn-in differences as they are sometimes small and one needs quite revealing and stable rig to be able to hear them.
Just my 5 cents here.
BTW: my M8A gives me now about 85% of Gustard X20Pro (double 9028, XLRs with fully balanced design) SQ which means CRAZY value for the money.
My M8A after 24h of constant audio streaming got softer, highs are better controlled. And no, it is not my brain adjusting as Im using my Gustard X20Pro as a stable reference, listening to the same song every 10 or so hours just selecting different input in my Sr-009 setup.
On the other hand I can fully understand that one cannot hear burn-in differences as they are sometimes small and one needs quite revealing and stable rig to be able to hear them.
Just my 5 cents here.
BTW: my M8A gives me now about 85% of Gustard X20Pro (double 9028, XLRs with fully balanced design) SQ which means CRAZY value for the money.
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